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You keep redefining decentralization and trust mid-argument and leaning on assumptions about future outcomes. It's tiring. Claiming to "win" the debate when I've already called out multiple debate fallacies is comical. If any entity or body has discretionary control over access to consensus, the system is trusted at the boundary. The Hedera Governing Council is the gatekeeper. The members of the Council are trusted upon admission. They are carefully selected according to explicit criteria (size, reputation, geography, industry diversity, etc.), vetted before admission, approved by existing governance, and legally bound. They are *granted access* to consensus, that's gatekeeping. Whether they trust each other's behavior *after* admission is irrelevant, the system trusted them at the door. Hedera has achieved Nakamoto score of 11 in a TIGHTLY-CONTROLLED LAB. You say "permissionless is the GOAL" - fine. Let's see what happens to the Nakamoto score when Hedera is exposed to real-world, adversarial conditions. Crypto history is littered with failed "guarantees" that did not survive contact with reality. At this point the disagreement is simple. You’re evaluating Hedera based on future intent and best-case assumptions. I’m evaluating systems based on what they are today under adversarial conditions. Future intent doesn’t change present facts. ABFT, DAB, and Block Nodes improve performance and fairness inside the fence, but they don’t remove the gatekeeper. Until consensus participation is permissionless, all Hedera has done is trade one form of centralization (consensus) for another (boundary control). Ethereum has real centralization pressures and actively engineers against them in the open, but Hedera has avoided those pressures so far by limiting participation. That’s a valid design choice, but it’s not playing on the same field. We’re using different standards, but mine assumes present real-world conditions, not best-case scenarios.
A true long hold is Tradebot. Hands down. Also, LAB even though price has been messed with by swing traders. These coins aren’t the swipes. TB, even when the market is red, stays steady. They are in a group called “Meme Trust” through The Professor ( LAB ). Vetted projects under the MT umbrella to give true investors some safety that they aren’t getting rugged. My two cents!
LAB V2, Shiba were the best