BYD

catastronot

Just rode in a BYD for the first time, I’m gonna sell my tesla position

SexyAIman

Thank you, i want to move with her to Shenzen and buy a new BYD every week. I did notice that, what i thought was a little Buddha statue, which on closer inspection bears an uncanny similarity to XiPing. So i think i am done. Anyway happy times ahead in Shenzen, don't know what to do with her Thai Viet parents yet.

shadylex

As soon as BYD and China’s other vehicles can be sold in USA it’s puts on $F & & $GM 

Mustatan

Great points here, been saying a lot of the same things. The circular financing and massive leverage was always going to be a disaster especially when bond yields and borrowing costs they went way up, like they started to do later in September. And then all the dumb hype and FOMO around the AI bubble, crazy promises the math would never support even with most over-optimistic assumptions and sales. And then how Amodei, Altman and Musk are so scummy in general with such shady IPO's. It's like they're not even trying to hide they're just looking for dumb retail bagholders for exit liquidity to dump their companies in massive pump and dump and rug-pulls. The SpaceX IPO was bad enough, but Dario and the Anthropic insiders basically set up the Anthropic IPO to openly fleece retail, getting cash out options on Day 1 and F-shares so retail doesn't even have much say in the company. At same time China and Europe (with Mistral) have [cheaper open weights models at](https://qz.com/ai-us-china-open-models-deepseek-qwen) same quality but [fraction of the cost](https://finance.yahoo.com/technology/ai/articles/businesses-experimenting-cheaper-chinese-ai-185931713.html) [and businesses already switching to](https://www.cnbc.com/2026/07/07/chinese-ai-models-costs-us-openai-anthropic.html). All while Treasury yields going up and debt gets so pricey CoreWeave and Oracle basically have junk bonds, and stupid valuations and PE ratio's all over. (Tesla still worth more than other car companies combined even though way down on the list of sales, and now BYD and soon Geely snatching away dominance in the EV business). So like you saying it was already a perfect storm before November. The harsh anti-AI backlash by the public was just iceing on that cake, but it gets played up because it gives Fox News and the usual idiots a convenient excuse and scapegoat to blame the Democrats for an AI bubble that was imploding anyway. And the hatred of AI data centers is uniquely bipartisan and all over the US, in red blue and purple states the same. [The harshest data center bans](https://www.toledoblade.com/local/politics/2026/11/04/data-centers-ohio-voters-reject-large/stories/20261104104) passed as ballot initiatives in red rural regions of Ohio on Tuesday, and even the few GOP governor candidates who did better read the room and went anti-data center themselves, especially Byron Donalds in Florida. (An easy call since it's so swampy, hit by sinkholes and massive storms the insurers wouldn't insure data centers there anyway). But those actual facts don't matter when Fox News now has the narrative to blame Democrats for a nasty economic recession that was coming anyway. And the worry is there might even be enough morons to fall for it in large numbers. The only thing I'd question is continuing to buy on the way down, at least in general, I'd say it maybe makes more sense do it very selectively. AI has a lot of good tech and value in the right places and applications, and a lot of the models help with things like summaries, translate and software but it's very costly, burns so much fuel and drives up power costs. Like with Internet and the dot-com bubble the tech will continue after the AI hype collapses but most companies won't. Even [Apollo had to admit](https://www.apollo.com/wealth/insights-news/insights/daily-spark/no-signs-of-ai-payoff-outside-the-tech-sector) the ROI is not that great and tokens costs way too much, and often even disrupts work more than helps. And now China is getting it's own EUV, GPU's and memory chips online so the AI models prices getting even cheaper, and the AI companies in hundreds of billions and debt and losses won't be able to raise their token prices, make a profit much less pay down that debt. Same goes for the hyperscalers and and neoclouds, even the shovel sellers got in too much debt at dumb valuations so they're falling too. Would make sense to buy selectively in small amounts but be careful, there's still a lot of leverage and excess has to unwind first.

Mustatan

Especially with Tesla still not far from 300 even with recent falls, and still worth more than other car companies combined. Even though it's way behind Toyota, VW, GM and Honda alone in sales and profits, and it's lost the EV industry to BYD and soon to Geely. (Even with the dumb handicap of the big tariff keeping Chinese EV's out of the US while Tesla can sell in China, it's getting crushed by an EV maker with a hand tied behind it's back). Tesla and SpaceX both have much farther to fall and fall hard.

Mustatan

It's a secular change in where capital is get allocated though, even just outside the Blue Tsunami dozens of data center bans got passed as ballot initiatives, and one of the rare cases of bipartisan agreement and total opposition to a whole industry. The AI sector has nowhere to go and maybe even more important, it's way too much leverage there and other sectors too, like housing and CRE just as debt gets much more expensive. And even with the unwind some stocks still have crazy PE ratios and no real path to growth. Tesla has been shrinking the past couple years, way behind the big car-makers and now even in EV's BYD and soon Geely are eating it's lunch. But it's still worth more than other car companies combined. Much farther to fall.

Mustatan

This, and on Chinese EV's. This alone would bring costs way down in the US and leave lot more money in Americans pockets, if they could get a good high electric vehicle for even just $20K or $30K. Always a dumb idea to just ban those or put in huge EV tariffs, if necessary we could do like Canada and start low with import numbers, and then encourage BYD and other Chinese EV makers to build their plants here and hire American workers for, just like Hyundai, Toyota and Honda does.

Mustatan

Yeah there was never going to be a soft landing with that amount of extreme leverage and imbalance in AI and the neoclouds and hyperscalers, it was too dependent on extreme speculation and margin just like in 1929. And although it's true the Blue Tsunami puts in some tough anti-AI policy right away (Texas and Georgia are just tip of the iceberg with hard stops on data centers), it's much worse because the push against data centers it's bipartisan. Basically all of the data center ban initiatives passed and those take effect immediately, and many of the [harshest restrictions were actually passed in very Red areas like rural Ohio](https://www.toledoblade.com/local/politics/2026/11/04/data-centers-ohio-voters-reject-large/stories/20261104104) or [Indiana](https://www.ipm.org/news/2026-10-22/over-half-of-indiana-counties-now-restrict-data-centers). And the GOP state candidates like Donalds in Florida survived only because they read the room and went anti-AI bubble and opposed data centers themselves, and Florida with it's sinkholes hurricanes and storms would be the worst place to build them anyway, insurers won't cover them there. So there's not even any consolation prize and nowhere for the hyperscalers to run to. And now with China Europe and other places making their own cheaper frontier AI and chips (and China with it's own EUV, GPU's and chips supply coming online), the AI models already here can't raise their prices or they lose business. (Or bankrupt the customers they do have). So the shovel sellers take a hit too. This is why it's never a good idea to put so many economic eggs in one basket with so many companies priced to impossible perfection. Especially sector depending so much on massive debt and hype, and huge PE ratios and overvaluations even outside AI tech. Even with the massive falls today, TSLA still has a ridiculous valuation more than other car companies combined even though it's sales way below Toyota, VW and GM alone and it's lost the EV industry to BYD (and soon to Geely), way behind Waymo and even Mercedes in self-drive and Tesla not innovating as much. Much farther to fall, although in being fair they're hardly alone, Palantir has been same and even Nvidia's price for perfection had been ignoring cheaper GPU and TPU options, in general and now from China, no way to maintain those margins or prices. Heck even Apple couldn't sell enough for that kind of valuation, and Coreweave and Oracle have near junk bond status, just when debt re-finance gets pricier.

Madmagician-452

Honestly I’m not looking at anything in the tech sector. I’m looking more into the Chinese ev market especially BYD, Food and drink, and surprisingly Ford.

AnotherThroneAway

Good points on rail and BYD. But defense typically does poorly when congress is blue. Then again, they may have no choice but to rebuild munitions

DeltaForceFish

With the cost of deisel looking to be sticky; everything will be shipping via rail. So those companies like CN rail. Any company that produces oil and also refines it inhouse. Defense companies like raytheon or lockhead. And BYD as they will eventually control the entire automotive market.

throwaway2676

Sure, the US has made a small number of good foreign investments over the years in exceptional circumstances, and those have been used to justify 100x as many terrible ones shouldered by american citizens at no cost to the elites. It is long past time to stop. That is why trump won, and then trump just sent it to israel instead, which is why he lost. It’s kinda funny how you’re framing the conversation about free trade. The Dem/neoliberal consensus is that protectionism is intrinsically bad for the country, so why would these places hurt themselves in response to the loss of american welfare? And then wild that your example is a BYD car — china doesn’t give them anything. Seems like maybe China’s strategy here is the winning one

cupofchupachups

You familiar with the Marshall Plan? Or protecting waterways for Japan, The Philippines, etc? American products are fine but the reason European and other countries embraced free trade in the first place was largely due to Pax Americana. If the US doesn't want to do that anymore, the rest of the world will go back to local or regional markets.  People are right now buying Luckin Coffee instead of Starbucks and driving BYD cars for this very reason. 

Swiftnice

Everyone call your new Dem congressman and tell them you want them to cut all PLTR and SPCX contracts and open the country to BYD EVs hahaha

AllWashedOut

The investment argument isn't really whether FSD is usable. It's whether FSD is far enough ahead of the competition that it will cause TSLA car sales to sky rocket in future years. And the answer to that is no. Waymo and GM are potentially more advanced. BYD is supposedly good. Tesla FSD is the most available option today but that probably won't be true 5 years from now. Soon the tech may be broadly available in new cars, like Apple Carplay. So go ahead and buy a Tesla today if you have a long highway commute. But I wouldn't buy the stock on that rationale.

fomoandyoloandnogrow

BYD have self driving? Cause Asians can’t drive, and self driving is gonna be king there. Except for those initial D cats

TrollChampion

In China BYD drives you

BarbellPadawan

BYD is such a superior vehicle.

cbigsby

Why doesn't BYD's stock price show that then?

No_Garbage3009

TSLA got its bussy destroyed my BYD

LongjumpingFondant81

TSLA chuds can never compete with BYD chads

Eresbonitaguey

These won’t ever be sold in the US but many Chinese manufacturers are ramping up domestic production within the EU. Spain already has at least 4 major manufacturers setting up shop and BYD’s Hungarian factory is ramping up to 300k vehicles a year which is only \~90k less than the target of Tesla’s gigafactory in Brandenburg and more than the total number of Teslas sold in the EU in 2025. Germany and France can’t tariff vehicles produced within the EU although they will be more expensive than the same models in China. American EV companies will continue to be relevant to the US but the rest of the world are being seduced by the value proposition of Chinese manufacturers.

lonewolf420

if its a BYD bus put "Tiawan numba 1, China Ashole" on my tombstone.

lonewolf420

where it builds electric transit buses, school buses, and battery-electric big-rig trucks you riding the BYD short bus to work.

abandoned_idol

I can't wait to be able to buy a BYD. Btw, are they good cars overall? Do they have any issues at the moment besides being banned from hell?

piltdown_manchild

The (LFP) Blade Battery is considered safer than Tesla's Lithium Ion. Many reviewers favor BYD's build quality. Tesla is still arguably ahead on software and FSD, but that could change. None of that matters when two cars are comparable and one costs less than half what the other one does.

Certain_Raspberry58

Maybe im misreading peoples thoughts.  But it seems like people think it would be a good thing to let Chinese makers compete here. But the issue is theres no reasonable way for the govt to only open up the market to Chinese EVs and not other Chinese cars. Tesla would sue and it would immediately get a stay because it would obviously be targeted.  The end result is either the entire car market opens up and the entire domestic market dies, or none of the market opens up.  But yes. BYD is a threat to Tesla. 

Unlucky_Pace_155

A red herring for what thought? Sounds like ur logic (and mine) is literally: A. BYD is a threat to US car companies, esp in the EV market. B. Tesla is the largest US EV company. Therefore C. BYD is a threat to Tesla.

PaperDoom

BYD already has a US factory. It's only a matter of time before they can sell their cars in the US.

Sickmonkey365

That’s hilarious and incredibly naive. I’ll be driving a BYD here by the end of the decade I guarantee it

Eresbonitaguey

I don’t think you can comprehend the scale of production coming out of China and how much better those EVs are for similar price points. The cheapest BYD EV in Australia is \~14k USD and there are even cheaper models in Asia.

Mustatan

This, none other than Elon himself this weekend completely changed his entire AI outlook, put in sharp cuts and limits on Grok usage for his whole user base, saying the Grok token usage has been totally unsustainable. This is Elon Musk, the guy claiming for a while that xAI, Grok and AI value would be unlimited. And now he's gone completely against his own previous statements and openly fret the AI side is bringing down the Starlink and rockets side, as it's been sinking in the modestly positive stock futures are already reversing. The problem is this a problem across all his businesses now even if not the cash-burning disaster that the AI side is. He wants to push Tesla into SpaceX, but Tesla has been completely overtaken by BYD in sales and soon by Geely. So where are the profits to base the valuation? Even Elon knows it's all based on hype and becoming a sinking ship as borrowing costs keep rising, thus the sudden turn-about and cutting his losses on the AI side with the new tight limits on Grok usage, and basically calling out the AI bubble brutally himself in his own statement.

Mustatan

lol Tesla is getting crushed by BYD in global sales even with the handicap 100% tariffs so Tesla doesn't sell in the US, and soon Tesla about to be crushed by Geely too. That's #3 in the EV industry and promises for 10 years unfulfilled, FSD with hands off and just zone out was supposed to come "it'll be next year" since 2014, in 2026 you still gotta pay attention every second you turn on the FSD. And sales have been going down for 2 years that's why the PE has been between 300 and 400. If it had better sales the PE wouldn't be such a stupid number.

Mustatan

Yeah China doesn't really rely on the stock market or other investor markets for their funding, it's a whole different mechanism and they deliberately pop bubbles in things like real estate where people actually need homes. It's not as big a concern in equities where it's supposed to be speculative and the hype investors are expected to lose their shirts, but they frown on bubbles and focus more on linking wealth to actual production and value without speculation. BYD is now crushing Tesla in EV sales for 2 years in a row and soon Geely will push TSLA to 3rd, but the stock value way lags behind the performance, because the value is in the physical assets and production. Although that said BYD has finally been gaining lately so may be their blue chips at least might be holding on more to a value that makes sense.

Certain_Raspberry58

The BYD thing is a bit of a red herring in some ways, not because they wouldnt beat Tesla, but allowing Chinese vehicles here would eliminate ALL the car companies here. Not just Tesla. Their economics are just too unfavorable for us. 

Unlucky_Pace_155

Lol the post i responded too acknowledged the danger of chinese imports so actually we caught the BYD threat.

undef-behavior

Tesla does not, in fact, get as much government subsidy as BYD.

Redditor2000000

What everyone is missing is that if BYD were allowed into this country, it would be an immediate game-over for Tesla. Musk didn't go to the White House and prostrate himself before Trump for nothing. His empire is deeply dependent on continued government favor. Also, I haven't looked into it much because self-driving doesn't appeal to me, but evidently Mercedes and some others are already at a level of self-driving higher than Tesla, WITH LiDAR I might add.

Marino7637

Leapmotor will probably sell close to 1 million EV cars this year, and establish themselves on 6 place among world car brands. BYD, Tesla, Geely Galaxy, VW, + one more is propably larger.

manbat-_

I mean shit I'd just invest it into safe options maybe get a house and a nice electric BYD instead and live comfortably but thats just me.

ArtOfWarfare

Your PE is too high but your estimates for FSD revenue are far too low. $100/month is what people will pay for Supervised FSD. It’ll be closer to 10x that Unsupervised. You also omitted the Semi (where Unsupervised FSD is going to be closer to $2000/month - a tiny fraction of what paying human drivers would cost). You left off the power systems. More speculative, but Tesla has been pretty open that they want to get into building a substantial portion of houses (hvac and roof and power) - I think they might decide to just start building and selling entire homes. They said that barring governments blocking them, they think they’re on course to takeover all terrestrial transportation, so I expect them to get into boats like BYD has done. To be clear, those last two paragraphs have nothing to do with buying shares of TSLA today… it’s more stuff that they might announce in five years and deliver in ten… which I suppose would result in the PE continuing to remain high after I said your PE was too high.

Slight-Big8584

"The minute BYD is allowed to sell EVs in the United States," not likely to happen. Car manufacturing is an industry nation states nurture and protect jealously, because it is such a large & sprawling supply chain. A country the size of the USA can afford to keep Chinese Cars out.

NiceCreamSundaes

Even before the BYD ascent, most American auto companies were performing poorly abroad and were reliant on the domestic market. Only Tesla and Ford were selling well outside of the USA.

TryNotToShootYoself

To be fair, if we got rid of laws that protected dealerships, removed tariffs and bans on all foreign cars (not just BYD), and reformed our god awful vehicle regulations, the American manufacturers would also collapse overnight. They only exist because the auto industry is not at all a fair market in the US.

Early_Aardvark_4346

Compared to BYD and Toyota? Read the whole sentence after the comma!

Jahobes

The minute BYD is allowed to sell EVs in America would mean Tesla would be the only American car company that stood a chance.

gyozafish

Tesla has been competing against BYD in China for years and is still doing fine.

Early_Aardvark_4346

Seriously, a company with a market cap of 1.5T with almost 0 presence outside of the US. How is this even possible? BYD can eat its lunch.

CraigLake

I read in a different post Biden was trying to protect American unions. He knew BYD would likely kill American automakers to some degree.

cockNballs222

If BYD is allowed to sell cars in the US, none of the American manufacturers are viable companies, overnight, it’s game over. 

Fun-Time4064

I live in a country that allows BYD. I see 90% of EVs are teslas, very rare to see a BYD. Most people don’t want to buy Chinese crap, and brand is important. Tesla has a strong reputable brand 

rod_jammer

The minute BYD is allowed to sell EVs in the United States, Tesla is no longer a viable company. Elon has taken such a hard right turn that he could see himself on the wrong side of aisle with a Democratic President in 2028. They could easily lift this ban and....poof! No more Tesla.

R3luctant

I would partially concede FSD, but BYD has absolutely closed the gap on batteries, it's just that they aren't allowed(effectively) into the American market.

Samjabr

Fair enough, but WB was famous for boring, slow, but consistent returns. He mostly invested in insurance companies. It's what he knew. And he famously quipped that diversification was for idiots that didn't know what they were doing. He also bought some boring ass, slow growth companies, like AXP and KO. But Berkshire's most epic win came from buying AAPL - which was Munger. Also, as someone mentioned yesterday, BYD was a great investment. That too was added due to Munger. All I'm saying is that without Munger, Buffets returns would be respectable but likely either on par on +/- a tiny % compared to just investing in the S&P. In other words, just like almost every other fund manager. Hardly any of them ever beat the indices, and when they do, it's often not repeated. Total Berkshire return the past 10 years = 14.2% Total Berkshire returns without BYD or AAPL = 12.3% S&P 500 returns past 10 years = 15.2% WOMP WOMP And it's worth pointing out, since Munger's death, Buffet sold billions in AAPL at \~$190 (currently trading for $350), and also bought billions in GOOG for \~$350 (currently trading for $280). DERP * **“Diversification is protection against ignorance. It makes little sense if you know what you are doing.”** This is traced to the 1996 Berkshire shareholder meeting. * **“Wide diversification is only required when investors do not understand what they are doing.”** This one is from his 1993 shareholder letter.

Samjabr

Munger was introduced to BYD by Li Lu (founder of Himalaya Capital) and became deeply enthusiastic about the company and its founder, Wang Chuanfu, whom Munger famously called a "combination of Thomas Edison and Jack Welch".

GhettoMuppet

nm... Charlie Munger convinced Warren Buffett to invest in BYD. you're right bro

GhettoMuppet

what about BYD that one was pretty good

Ok_Departure333

TIL Tesla doesn't get as much of governmental subsidies as BYD.

jasperCrow

The reason BYD isn’t allowed in the US is because we can’t compete with it on cost or quality. Full stop. Any other excuse is propaganda. BYD in the US would crush Tesla and all the admins know it.

jacd03

1) US Corporates won’t route data through Chinese-hosted APIs. The barrier isn’t price or quality, it’s political and regulatory risk, it's the same national-security logic behind the connected-vehicle blocking (BYD). Self-hosting open weights is a separate decision. I have heard a lot about it lately. 2) Labs face a structural problem, their business the model is the most expensive layer to build and the fastest one to become "commodity". Every frontier model has been matched within months, and open models compress pricing from below. Meanwhile, the value capture sits in compute (Nvidia, hyperscalers, etc.) where scarcity creates margins, and distribution (Google, Microsoft, Meta), where AI gets bundled into products customers already pay for, at near-zero marginal acquisition cost. Anthropic pays their biggest competitors for compute, so their gross margin is the competitors revenue, and vice-versa. I believe most won’t reach self-sustaining profitability, so yes i am being serious right now. I will change my mind when 2 things happen, one model stays the leader for a large amount of time, and inference costs fall faster than the price adjustments due to the competition. We will see....

jacd03

While i agree with you, no US corporate is going to give their data to China. Anthropic and OpenAI are already close to the government for that reason. It's the same moat for Tesla, it's only successful because BYD is blocked from the US market. In my mind, it's not so much about having a profitable AI business model, its just a race that the US has to win over the rest of the world, whatever it takes. I am 100% confident the public is going to eat the losses via bailout, and the stock crashing the market.

DotesMagee

It will. BYD is already crushing Tesla, by a severe margine. Tesla 800k vs 2-4 BYd sold worldwide and Teslas decreasing while BYD is increasing YoY

DrivingHerbert

Of those you listed only one sells more vehicles overall than GM. VAG and Stelantis each have over 10 brands under their belt, BYD has five and Toyota has 4. So of the 4 brands selling more than GM, all are doing so with either an equal number of brands, or more.

debid4716

That’s not the full story. BYD, as an example, gets significantly more in subsidies than our domestic companies do. That means Ford, GM, Toyota and the rest are basically competing with the Chinese government on price. Not to mention a difference in safety standards, in safety standards for employees during production, and a whole slew of other things. There is more to it than just they don’t want to compete. Further, from a geopolitics standpoint point you don’t want Chinese companies getting a foothold here as China is our major adversary.

IAmMiddleChild

Keep going on this thought. If inference gets cheaper for anthropic doesn't it get cheaper for all models including open models. If they try to keep passing on costs and keep pricing high as expenses from compute decrease, the open models will become increasingly cheaper alternatives. That's why they want regulatory capture on thought? Just like how Elon needs BYD out of American markets for Tesla to stand a chance.

Bartleby11

There were many good reasons why nasa chose not to develop reusable rockets. It's not like they just couldn't figure it out until musk came along. But just like his cars it doesn't change anything bc the value is all in hype. Still Doesn't make the average persons life easier or better. BYD has long since made better cheaper electric cars but we can't import them. I wonder why?

Neosynephrine

Ride in some BYD EVs and report back to me please. Very curious how good they are.

Fit_Neighborhood9251

Chinese EVs are not cheaper than Tesla, i don't know who told you that. I drive a BYD Seal Excellence, and the same from tesla is literally 1,5 times cheaper here. And yes, my car is (so far) better than a Tesla.

6RamboSmurf9

Tesla stock P/E ratio 409.03. BYD stock P/E ratio 19.76. Tesla EPS ttm .91 BYD EPS ttm .46 Tesla stock price $372.22 BYD stock price $9.09 Those are some lofty future expectations for one of these companies. When can I buy one of these here in the US? Do I really need an EV with thrusters?

OrangMiskin

Bring BYD to the US, pussies!

Cimexus

A few thoughts. I did mention that charging speed is a weak point for Tesla. It doesn’t matter for me personally since 100% of my charging is done at home, but for road trippers it definitely matters. I don’t agree at all about UX - IMO Tesla is still the gold standard for this (and yes I’ve driven most popular EVs, including BYD, Polestar, Rivian and legacy makes like Hyundai and Chevy). As you say though that’s subjective. I’d put Rivian as a close second BTW. When I talk about thermal management I am not really referring only to battery thermals. I mean the ability to scavenge heat from any part of the vehicle (motors, cabin, battery, brakes) and redistribute it to other parts, which is a big part of why Tesla’s efficiency is so much better than other comparable vehicles (in addition to the work done on aerodynamics, drivetrain losses and so on). You might say “if it works, who cares”, but since it directly affects efficiency and thus range and cost per km travelled, I think people do care. They might not know that thermal management is *responsible* for the car being efficient, but they do care about that efficiency. Or I do, at least. Even though electricity is cheaper than fuel, I still want to reduce my charging costs as much as possible. It also keeps the cars more affordable since they can get away with having a somewhat smaller battery. And you’ll note I didn’t mention FSD at all. No one in the Western markets has anything even remotely comparable. Some of the Chinese makes do, but they only work in China. Now, as you say, some people might be happy with just lane centring and TACC, so this won’t matter. But there are a good number of people who want complete point to point automated driving (and a whole bunch more who don’t realise how good the tech is now and don’t know what they are missing, I suspect). Anyway that’s enough rabbiting on. The point of my initial response was not to say that Tesla is the best or anything like that. I’m an EV enthusiast in general and have owned several by different manufacturers. I’m just saying that in the real world it’s one of the best selling EVs, and it does the basic stuff really well. Calling it a “shit product” is just inaccurate. It’s in the top handful, and any EV journalist or reviewer will tell you that.

MrYOLOMcSwagMeister

Oil goes up BYD (which makes ELECTRIC cars) goes down Makes sense

Disproving_Negatives

Yeah it's crazy. This is an AI summary but I'd guess those numbers are fairly accurate: |**Company**|**Current Market Capitalization**|Net Profit per Quarter|**Earnings Status & Notes**| |:-|:-|:-|:-| |**Tesla (TSLA)**|\~$1,530 Billion|**$787 Million**|Official Q3 2026 results (reported Oct 21, 2026); net income fell 43%.| |**Toyota (TM)**|\~$226 – $256 Billion|**\~$7.5 Billion** (Avg.)|Calendar Q3 results expected in early November. Prior quarter net profit was \~¥1.33 Trillion (\~$8.7B).| |**BYD (01211.HK)**|\~$100 – $122 Billion|**\~$1.3 – $1.5 Billion** (Est.)|Q3 2026 official earnings scheduled for release on October 29, 2026.| |**Volkswagen (VOW3)**|\~$50 – $60 Billion|**\~$2.4 Billion** (Avg.)|Q3 2026 earnings release scheduled for October 29, 2026.| |**General Motors (GM)**|\~$66.8 Billion|**$3.3 Billion**|Official Q3 2026 results (reported Oct 20, 2026); net income surged 151% YoY.|

OrangMiskin

One issue voter: anyone who lets BYD into the US market. Do it pussy!

LaughCompetitive1504

BYD is better than Tesla that's why they won't allow them to be sold in USA.

Hot-Dark-3127

Their sales are down from last year and BYD is the EV king.

LaughCompetitive1504

BYD is better than Tesla

cosmopolitanScience

H1 2026, BYD sold 1.8 M cars. Tesla just over 800k, geeky just below 800k.... Interesting indeed

redy__

BYD too. This "protects" the car industry as the DeepSeek ban protects the ai industry. For the latter I can think of counter espionage, however, just a guess

fuzexbox

**Top Global EV Models (2026)** [**Tesla Model Y**](https://www.google.com/search?kgmid=%2Fg%2F11gb_4f22x&q=Tesla+Model+Y)**:** \~748,088 units (Jan–Aug 2026) [**BYD Song**](https://www.google.com/search?kgmid=%2Fg%2F11f4ptp094&q=BYD+Song) **/ Seal U:** Second place globally, trailing by a wide margin **Geely Xingyuan / EX2:** Third place with \~321,454 units [**Tesla Model 3**](https://www.google.com/search?kgmid=%2Fg%2F11c3x48pb7&q=Tesla+Model+3)**:** Fourth place with \~298,903 units [**BYD Yuan Up**](https://www.google.com/search?kgmid=%2Fg%2F11vsffgbkp&q=BYD+Yuan+Up) **/** [**Atto 2**](https://www.google.com/search?kgmid=%2Fg%2F11vsffgbkp&q=Atto+2)**:** Fifth place with \~225,334 units \[[1](https://driveteslacanada.ca/news/tesla-model-y-global-ev-sales-2026-august/), [2](https://www.reddit.com/r/teslamotors/comments/1xbc2gc/model_y_was_the_worlds_bestselling_ev_from/)\] interesting.

mikaball

To this I will also add the lack of competition at those times. Now Rivian needs to face Tesla, BYD and possible other strong companies like Xiaomi entering the market. Good luck.

bloodlynx

The best selling car in the world is the Tesla model y. BYD makes great cars why is that an even?

Plane-Salamander2580

Profitability is deteriorating relative to sales. Higher R&D expenses, inventory impairments, tax effects and a less profitable product mix all weighed on earnings. Competition is intensifying. CATL's share of China's battery installation market fell to 40.9% in September from 49.8% in January, while BYD gained share. Analysts are cutting estimates. Citi reduced its 2026–2028 earnings forecasts by approximately 9%, 14% and 15%, respectively.

ergzay

What does Russia have to do with this conversation? And yes surely the government is propping the company up. Surely. The levels of ignorance here is beyond belief. I'll bet you $1000 that import tariffs on Chinese cars (BYD included) stay and that SpaceX continues getting government contracts when Democrats take power. You realize that a vast majority of SpaceX revenue is unrelated to the government right? It's even less than 10% now.

PalantirImperator

I'm talking about the reality of the industry, not cherry-picking stats to create a narrative. What I'm saying is common knowledge. https://finance.yahoo.com/news/55-billion-gone-automakers-ev-210000677.html You are correct that Tesla's real competitor in the EV space is BYD, the Chinese company that ripped off everything Tesla does and produced it for cheaper- which is why I specifically excluded them from my previous post.

CypherAZ

What is Tesla “working on” that justifies their valuation? Remember when they first announced the roadster in 2017? Or full self-driving in 2016? Or the sub $25k car? Musk is literally vaporware conman. If the government was propping him up with contracts and sanctions on BYD…he’d be out of business or in jail.

meikawaii

Just what the hell are you even taking about? top volume leader is Toyota, VW, Hyundai, top profit is Toyota, VW, BMW, Hyundai. top EV volume is BYD, top profit per car unit is Ferrari and Jaguar Land Rover. Tesla ranks number 1 by market cap and nothing else

hackmalafore

No. They are glorified golf carts with obnoxious ipads glued to the dashboard. I rented one for a month, and it was amazing how many hardware flaws, misaligned panels, poorly designed software controls, and a lack of intuition. BYD is far superior, and they are 7x less expensive.

piltdown_manchild

My problem is not with the past success, but the *valuation*. Tesla's sales are stagnating and they are still more valuable than Toyota, BYD, General Motors, and Ford combined. SpaceX brought launch costs down by 90%. Starlink lets you play online games on the way to Hawaii. Even so, 70% of SpaceX's TAM is xAI. They took a great space company and stapled an AI money furnace to it. Then they claimed that the worst part of the business has the most potential. >SpaceX claimed 93% of its total addressable market would be “in AI”—a figure roughly equivalent to U.S. annual GDP, or $26.5 trillion. xAI (Grok) has captured less than 7% of the enterprise AI market, in distant fourth place. If Google were valued using the same metrics as SpaceX, it would have a market cap of $80 trillion.

Outta_hearr

>Tesla is profitable Yes, but not to the tune of a $1.5 trillion market cap. It has a P/E of 350 which is one of the highest currently in the market and easily the largest. I'd doubt any other company with around that P/E even exceeds $50-100 billion market cap. If Nvidia had TSLA's P/E its market cap would be $67 trillion, or about 80% of all the money in the world. >is working on groundbreaking technology and has very little competition. Chinese EVs are destroying Tesla in the global market, especially BYD. The only reason Tesla has little competition in certain places is due to Chinese EV import tariffs (which the US had negotiated for previously and are now being taken down in many contries due to deteriorated relations with the US). If BYD was allowed to operate in the US, Tesla would be fucked. They do some cool things, but SpaceX is the company actually building groundbreaking technology. As much as I am not a fan of Elon's, Reusable rockets and Starlink are genuinely amazing tech advancements. Tesla, however does not do those things. I guess they have some really good EV battery manufacturing? >They are on the verge of both a robotics and self driving revolution (or not) and the market is speculating that Tesla can pull it off. They've been "on the verge" of many things for over a decade. Speculation can only go so far if you never deliver on anything.

ScornForSega

I'm all for it. The resulting company will be SpaceX and it gets Tesla out of the SP500 before BYD eats their lunch.

bejammin075

Tesla stock holders are a cult too. Currently Tesla market cap is equal to the next 10 to 15 of the world's largest car companies, which is ridiculous. The brand is tanking. Musk's fascist salutes (and other fascist-confirming behavior) did permanent damage to the brand. The liberal eco-friendly customer base was turned off. Musk was responsible for the cyber truck fiasco: that was the vehicle he got most involved with, and it's a disaster. Musk bizarrely refuses to use Lidar for self-driving, and Tesla is falling way behind others with self driving and robo taxis. There is way more electric vehicle competition now than in 2018 when I bought a Tesla. Companies like BYD will eat Tesla's lunch. So the writing is on the wall that Tesla is fucked. Musk will do with Tesla what he did with other companies like that solar company: he'll roll them together to hide the problems. It worked before and it will probably work again for a while. The people who own Tesla stock are very much the same people who buy SpaceX stock. They'll look at these 2 companies as complimentary and that it makes sense to merge.

mikaball

In a simple country like Portugal I see none. As for Tesla and BYD, they are everywhere.

zedmaxx

Leftists: there is no way Tesla can do this. BYD is so innovative Tesla: does this Leftists: Nooooooooo People have quite literally been saying “the future is so disappointing we don’t have flying cars” for decades. You got it and you whine like children. People asking what the point is are luddites who would have shook their fist at the wright brothers, NASA and every other tech advancement since fire. Useless cancers on society, the whole lot.

Popular_Register_440

Put a couple £K into BYD and quite down. Still believe in the company but wish I had invested earlier. Put less than a grand into CloudFlare and wish I had put a ton more in.

jimmux

For the next demo they should literally flip over a BYD Shark.

GSmithDaddyPDX

They don't need to be competitive as long as chinese models are banned in the US. But eventually people will likely get fed up with the ban just because we can't be competitive due to greed etc. Who is the actual market? Working people, eg the majority of the population? Are they buying supercars to get to work? Or do they want a good affordable electric with amazing features for a price they can actually buy it? Look at the numbers: BYD Seal ~$24,500, Tesla Model 3 ~$32,300 (cheapest tesla model). BYD Seagull ~$10,300 — Tesla has no comparable model here, nothing below $30k. We don't have to be competitive if we just ban better/cheaper products, yes, but ... what? Is that the point you're trying to make?

GSmithDaddyPDX

I was hoping a human would walk out of the car at the end of any of the demonstrations. This isn't even something they're confident enough to put a person inside of. Who is the product for? Are car flying parks going to be built like rocket league? Who would both be able to afford that, and put their own body in the car? Maybe a spectator sport? Still not quite the product that makes sense right now with BYD etc. coming for the whole of the USA's lunch. As an engineer though it was a really cool demo!

Suitable_Switch5242

Search around for which vehicles Tesla is using their in-house 4680 cells in. The only information is about the Cybertruck and some specific Model Y variants which just started this year. Presumably the Cybercab as well which is still very low volume. Model 3 and Y in the US mostly use Panasonic cells currently. Sometimes in the past they have used imported LG or CATL cells. In Europe they also use BYD blade cells for some variants. This isn’t controversial information if you follow Tesla or their suppliers.

Suitable_Switch5242

Tesla buys most of its batteries from Panasonic, LG, CATL, and BYD like everyone else.