TSLA

dankbeerdude

Def won't be enough to retire on that far from now. Are you 100% allocated to BTC? I would also invest 50% at least into S&P or whatever, AAPL,GOOG,AMZN, TSLA etc just to diversify. I'm only at .25 BTC but still DCA $100 a week

OkDiver6272

That’s the truth. I just retired this week, in my upper 40’s with about $1M in investments. My goal is ~ 20% CAGR with half in BTC and half in tech/AI/bitcoin treasuries. The folks over at r/FIRE did not like that idea. Said I should plan on only 4% and hope for 8% returns. They just don’t get that this isn’t your grandpa’s stock market. The 60/40 portfolio is dead. BTC is my savings account. TSLA, NVDA, PLTR, HOOD, COIN, MSTR, etc are my investments. Excess gains from them will be rolled into BTC. That’s my FIRE plan.

McNitz

Yep, people can for sure make decisions that are irrational based on the available information. For example, based on the public data available it is irrational to value TSLA anywhere close to how highly it is valued. It doesn't match the PE ratio, it doesn't match the free cash flow, it doesn't match any probable potential future earnings. It is entirely based on people irrationally believing TSLA will definitely claim the majority electric car market/ that Elon Musk is a genius that is guaranteed to make TSLA great.

NarrowArtist

Same boat here, my SO and I are 6 figures in student loan debt with low paying jobs, even with our degrees. I did what I was told by the system and got cooked. The interest on hers alone is over 1/3 of her income. I basically decided I’m doomed if I keep doing what the system tells me and now I’m putting all my extra money into BTC and TSLA. Might be a foolish mistake but f it you live once and this is the only possible path to freedom I have found. My friends that make 4X my salary tell me to just invest in SPY but with the low income/small shovel I don’t see a chance for me following that path. 

madladchad3

This isnt ETH vs TSLA, it’s BitMine vs TSLA. We have many reputable exchanges here in Korea. People can just use them and buy ethereum from them. I’m confused as to why the people mentioned in the article are using BitMine when we have our own trust worthy major exchanges.

kirtash93

I would not hesitate on that decision xD ETH >>> TSLA

Obsidianram

Eventually big fish start eating smaller fish. Let's take a hypothetical - MSTR continually gets 0% interest loans...ZERO PERCENT...now imagine somebody wants to start looking into how that's being pulled off (I don't think GOOG, AAPL, MSFT, TSLA, AMZN, et al get zero interest loans). Then they go and, just for sake of thoroughness, double-check the math on all those 10-Q reports filed. Does everything add up correctly? In an ugly scenario, that Smog pile may end up being forfeited, one way or another ~ feel free to replace MSTR with any target of your choice, mind you...point being, what the big players want, they usually get - and money isn't even the object or concern anymore - it's control & influence...

Obsidianram

Eventually big fish start eating smaller fish. Let's take a hypothetical - MSTR continually gets 0% interest loans...ZERO PERCENT...now imagine somebody wants to start looking into how that's being pulled off (I don't think GOOG, AAPL, MSFT, TSLA, AMZN, et al get zero interest loans). Then they go and, just for sake of thoroughness, double-check the math on all those 10-Q reports filed. Does everything add up correctly? In an ugly scenario, that Smog pile may end up being forfeited, one way or another ~ feel free to replace MSTR with any target of your choice, mind you...point being, what the big players want, they usually get - and money isn't even the object or concern anymore - it's control & influence...

boisvertm

The other worst thing is to sell everything and then watch it rocket. I have heard countless stories of people having regret selling all of the best investments you've heard of - BTC, ETH, NVDA, TSLA, AAPL, their house, etc. HODL is the way.

BeginningMost6014

Nah, I'm diversified... in SOL, MSTR and TSLA

Hot_Philosopher3199

I have a Roth for each of my kids. 20% TSLA, 30% S&P, 50% IBIT. None of them know about it. Won't tell them till they are older. I will continue contributing till they can take it over.

According_Tax7036

reddit likes to put an agenda to everything. they don't like a project so in their minds it can never succeed. Do you remember the hate that TSLA got? people continued to say it would never succeed or that the stock would crash, yet it defied all odds and continued going up lol.

Trader_Joe80

Well 2k challenge in my server is now 12k thx to massive win on TSLA puts and KSS calls. In 2months by the way. But its options not crypto? Why crypto tho? You might as well just drop 2k on META options. It will get to $1000 and will split which will run up leading to it. If it has to be crypto then I would just buy 30% BTC 30%ETH and 20% PEPE and keep 20% for later use. If this is a gambling money then just buy anything that has huge following and just hodl. If you would rather try our 2k challenge then shoot me a message

malignantz

If Berkshire Hathaway bought $TSLA or $NVDA a few years ago, Warren Buffet could have been the world's first trillionaire. But that would be stupid. Buffy could have just bought $FART and been a quadrillionaire in 20 minutes or whatever. But, if Buffett consistently took massively risky positions, he probably wouldn't have made it through 70 years of successful investing.

cryptoripto123

Let me guess, none of you contributed to your 401k or IRA or S&P500 in 2013. While inflation sucks, it's easy to beat it. * VTI in 2013: 70 * VTI today: 310 These aren't sexy returns, but if you are so greedy you will only take 234897% returns, then ask yourself why you missed out on all of Bitcoins massive gains and why you missed out even on huge returns on NVDA, TSLA, tech stocks, etc?

casiocoin

Coinbase is where all of the ETF volume will be (mostly) it’s going to be the next TSLA/GOOG. MSTR will probably do well but the real money will be in the ADTV. The crazy thing is BTC hasn’t even truly hit supply shock yet, I don’t think, which is wild considering the small amount that’s left out of wallets and exchanges.

PoisonWaffle3

We've been working toward FIRE for the last five years or so, and we're on track to fully FIRE in about 5 years (I'll be 40). We've been aggressively contributing to a pretty "normal" Boglehead style portfolio, but then I have my crypto portfolio and a higher risk stock portfolio. I've made a killing on the crypto of course, but I've also made a killing on PLTR, CLSK, META, TSLA, and a few others over the years. On average my portfolio makes at least double what my wife and I make at our jobs (some years it's 3-4x, and we don't spend any of that, just keep it growing), but I know that's not realistically sustainable for decades. I keep moving profits over to the more traditional (and realistic in the long term) portfolio over time, and when that's big enough well retire.

Fun-Sundae4060

At that time, 100% TSLA only Right now it’s ETHU and BITX

PoisonWaffle3

It's good to see that you're coming out ahead and that the risk paid off! I did something similar a few years ago when BTC was $15-17k, but after I took out the HELOC I signed up for a bunch of balance transfer credit cards (all with 18 to 21 month 0% interest promotions) and paid the 3% fee to do the balance transfers. $50k in total, and I bought mostly BTC, TSLA, and META stock. I made the minimum payments on the cards, and occasionally sold some of the purchased BTC or stocks to pay them down. I rolled the last $15k or so into a new 18 month 0% card a while back, but paid off the rest. It's now 2 1/2 years later, and I'm at about \~$250k of overall profit. I [posted ](https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/zu3s5t/adventures_in_borrowing_to_invest_part_1/)about it [twice ](https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/10tsahv/adventures_in_borrowing_to_invest_part_2_285/)but generally didn't get great feedback, so I mostly stopped posting about it.

Fun-Sundae4060

That’s the truth. I bought my dream car Model S Plaid in Dec last year for $51k used using some of my TSLA stock winnings out of a $500k portfolio. That’s enough to buy a brand new one 5x over but I still chose the used one for half price. Literally a month later, my stock portfolio gained well over $100k. Basically paid for my dream car and added another 10% to my portfolio. All for free.

cryptoripto123

Yes it does. Again, I get it. It's not sexy compared to Bitcoin's 289374% returns. But it is something that means if you contribute to it for 30-40 years of your working life, you will have PLENTY of money. Again my point is to suggest that people should be investing in this already. It's safe. It works, and unless the world falls apart it guarantees a retirement as long as you budget wisely. The narrative that Bitcoin is the only way is false. There's already a way there. Now can you get ahead with Bitcoin? Yeah if you invested in 2010 you'd be on an island now retiring early. But I'd argue you could also have gotten there catching all the top stocks like AAPL, TSLA, NVDA, meme stocks like GME, etc. If you got in on all those great returns you'd also be on an island. I think it's more dangerous that people chase crazy returns. While you might get lucky, you're also prone to sink money into bad investments. My recommendation is Bitcoin (and other alts if you want to gamble) should be a PART of your asset allocation, but not the whole thing. Keep a part of your investments in something safe and reliable where you won't gamble it all away or lose it in a quest to "get rich quick." https://i.imgur.com/3wpOMyp.png

cryptoripto123

If all you care about are gainz, why didn't you get rich already from BTC? What about stocks like NVDA, TSLA, AAPL? Or go further back and look at the 90s with MSFT, CSCO, etc.? You had plenty of chances to get GREAT returns and you missed it all. An IRA isn't about trying to catch the next moonshot. It's about getting steady 10% returns with tax benefits. You should be doing that regardless of Bitcoin.

Life_Without_Lemon

Make sense the best type of investment is the one you forget and later regain access to. Paper hands so hard on $TSLA, $AMD, $NVDA and so much more. Would people have taken the profits once it hit 1m, 10m, 100m or 1b.

PoisonWaffle3

In general, don't get a loan to invest at all. But if you do, do it at the bottom, not at the top. I took out a $50k 0% loan at the end of 2022 to buy BTC and a handful of stocks that were way down (mostly TSLA and META). I 5x'd my money on the TSLA and META, and have done even better on the crypto. I paid off the loan and have about $200k of profit. I'd have more if I had waited longer before paying off the loan, but I wanted to take some risk off of the table.

Hot_Establishment216

I can't even begin to tell you how misleading chat gpt is and often blatantly incorrect. Hell will freeze over before I get it to remember UTLY is not the fund that tracks TSLA.

blowgrass-smokeass

She’s basically a WSB user. Her ARK ETFs were solid performers in 2019/2020 and everyone raved about her. They only performed well because she bet 30% of every fund on TSLA. Those funds have cratered since.

Eadie2021

Been around this game for awhile too. BTC and MSTR profit is going into TSLA, NVDA, and ARKQ. If I can 2x any of those in the next year, I will be happy! My son is selling all at 130k but I am riding it a bit higher🤞to 150k. Good luck with your house purchase. Exciting times ahead.

Fun-Sundae4060

Not with Bitcoin but TSLA stock. I was never big on BTC until earlier this year just to catch this cycle top

ProfeshPress

Scenario: in 2035, BTC is worth $1000,000. A bank offers you $500,000 'against' your 1 BTC, meaning that they get to sell-off part of your BTC in the event that you fail to keep up with the re-payments on the loan: this is known as **collateralisation**. The difference between the amount of the loan, and the current value of your BTC, would then be referred to as loan-to-value, or **LTV**. Obviously, if BTC's price falls below $500,000, the **LTV** is now more than 100% and your **collateral** no longer insures (i.e., guarantees re-payment of) the loan. Therefore, your loan agreement also includes a **margin**, which is based on the maximum LTV the bank will allow prior to selling your Bitcoin. For instance: a loan of $500,000 with a 'margin' of 20% allows BTC to fall from $1,000,000 to $600,000 before triggering this forced repayment on your behalf—a process known as **liquidation**. To wit, the bank **sells your BTC** until the 'margin' of the loan is restored: so if Bitcoin fell again, to $500,000, then the bank would pay your loan down to $416,666 using your BTC to do so; if Bitcoin fell to $400,000, the balance would be paid down to $333,333; and so on. Obviously, this is something you'd want to avoid. However, had you borrowed only $100,000, or **10% LTV**—which in a developing country might still sustain a comfortable lifestyle for longer than the duration of the next bear market—your $1000,000 in Bitcoin could fall by up to **88%** without causing the above chain of events. By the time you've spent even half of that on living expenses, Bitcoin's market value has doubled again, to $2,000,000: now the same $100,000 loan is only **5% LTV**; so you take out another $100,000. Providing you're never liquidated, none of the above is subject to tax. Substitute Bitcoin with TSLA, and now you know how Elon Musk can effectively print his own money.

moonRekt

You’re going to get biased answers here but I sleep better at night being heavily invested in Bitcoin right now than owning multiple houses. It may be possible but I don’t see it as likely that housing prices can collapse upwards during high inflation as they still need to be, people still need to be able to afford the prices you charge and if they can’t another house is another tho g you need to protect in unrest. Where as Bitcoin/TSLA/NVDA can reach any price as long as hype is there and people are willing to buy

TheDakestTimeline

TSLA up

OnlyBTC2035

You can go to 30/40% BTC allocation depends of your risk tolerance. BTC is the little brother of SPX/Nasdaq, very high correlation between the three. So if you’re bullish long term with your stocks/ETF, Bitcoin should follow. I’m 55% SP500 ETF, 35% BTC and 10% TSLA.

Cantrillion

It's all correlated with each other. Imagine investing in a "portfolio" of GM, F, TM and sure, maybe TSLA to go a little crazy. Consumer spending drops, they all fall. Nice diversification. US prints money, all the cryptos go up. Etc. And as an individual investor, diversification sucks, especially if you're young. Don't pick 4 cryptos you barely understand. Spend 4 cryptos worth of research to pick the one you really understand.

OnlyBTC2035

55% SP500 / 35% BTC and 10% TSLA for me. Both SP500 and BTC are great, you play both safe and growth.

Darkerjev

Imagine if Musk/TSLA starts stacking in bitcoin like Saylor’s MSTR. I imagine its possible just out of spite due to his fallout with trump. Something tells me sumthin big is coming soon.

AmericanScream

#Stupid Crypto Talking Point #12 (market cap) "**$$$$ 'Market Cap!'**" / "**There's $x million in this project!**" 1. The term "market cap" is one appropriated from the stock market and is misleading and erroneous to apply to crypto. 2. Traditional market capitalization translates to "the value of a company as a function of its share price." This figure only has meaning if the share price is properly valued based on the actual value of the company. There are standard established formulas for determining what a company is worth by adding up its assets and income and subtracting its liabilities. Then to determine whether a share price is over or under-inflated, you divide that figure by the number of outstanding shares. 3. Market capitalization when shares are not manipulated, should settle at the true value of the company. In cases where shares are manipulated (TSLA is a good example), its "market cap" is unrealistic. In situations where insiders control a large portion of shares, they can easily manipulate the stock price, resulting in the appearance of a high net value that doesn't jive with reality. 4. Cryptocurrencies, by their nature, have no intrinsic value. Crypto doesn't create income; it doesn't represent real-world assets. So it has absolutely no base value in the first place by which to calculate valuation and market capitalization. 5. In reality, nobody has any idea how much actual "market capitalization" there is in the world of crypto, since actual liquidity is obscured by phony stablecoins and shady exchanges that are neither regulated, nor transparent. In crypto, people simply multiply the coin price x the number of coins minted and declare that's the value of the crypto industry. It's completely misleading and deceptive and in no way indicates any realistic level of capital value. For additional details see [Why Market Cap is a Meaningless & Dangerous Valuation Metric in Crypto Markets](https://medium.com/blockchain-review/why-market-cap-is-a-meaningless-dangerous-valuation-metric-in-crypto-markets-8deb78c50995)

CleazyCatalystAD

Mostly BTC, some other cryptos, equities portfolio w high concentration in tech/QQQ, MSTR, TSLA, and VOO.

Significant_Grab_173

I saw kraken has option to buy stocks through their new xStocks, still considering that diverse option. Any reason why only tesla? Thought about TSLA and PLTR for 3-5 years.

cryptoripto123

You guys do realize that while inflation eats away at your money, basic investing protects you from inflation. In all this time since Bitcoin was invented, you could've tripled your money. Sure that's not as sexy as the rate of return as Bitcoin, but I'd also argue why did you miss out on the returns on Big Tech, TSLA, NVDA, etc? The point is if it's a matter of finding the next moon stock/coin, you all missed the past ones. In the end it's not about getting rich quick but understanding a basic bit of personal finance. **It's entirely possible to be successful both in the fiat and Bitcoin world.**

cryptoripto123

As someone in my late 30s, I really just suggest y'all understand some basic personal finance concepts. Most people are here just to get rich quick, but the reality is if it were that easy, you'd all be rich already. And it doesn't even have to be with Bitcoin--y'all missed the $1 to $100,000 opportunities but you also all missed out on all the stocks that mooned in the same period be it TSLA, NVDA, FAANG stocks, Meme stocks, etc. You're telling me none of you got in on any of those gainz? The best thing you can do isn't to hope that your Bitcoin investments go to the moon. You can put some into Bitcoin, but put your money into stuff that's tried and true. 10% annual returns don't sound sexy, but I'll tell you what's even less sexy--chasing 9238937% returns and then getting it all hacked because you got rugged, scammed, lost your keys, etc. If those 9238937% returns are so easy, allocate some money there, but please do not forget some basic financial concepts. I'm sitting here on 7 figures of fiat and crypto SEPARATELY to tell you that yes it's entirely possible to be successful in the fiat world, and it's also entirely possible to be successful in the crypto world. If you think your only path to success is ______ then you're likely never going to succeed.

cryptoripto123

So you're saying it's skill? Why didn't you make your millions off NVDA? TSLA? AAPL? All those meme stocks?

westbourn

I'm 64. I can't buy BTC in my pension (UK SIPP) so I've been using MSTR as a proxy, it's allowed because it's classed as software not crypto. At the moment I have around 10pc of my pension in MSTR but in 2023 I was as high as 95pc for six months. Perhaps it will suffer more premium erosion but I think medium to long term it's fine and once BTC launches again it will outperform. I'm planning to just keep 10pc minimum and at the right time go to 40pc. Most of the rest of my pension is in TSLA. Diversification has never worked out for me. I'm planning to leave it all to my kids. I don't need it and I've already taken my max tax free drawdown.

OkSeries5363

They don't insert a tip, with lending and LSTs, rewards go to the pool this means the pool grows and therefore your portion/claim of the pool is more when you come back later to claim? So when you return the recipt you get more back, same with liquid staking tokens. This means when you give your receipt tokens back they were 'worth' more as you got more back from the pool, or staking tokens than previously. A common misconception is that depositing cryptocurrency to earn a yield is treated uniformly for tax purposes. However, under tax law, there is a very critical distinction between how Centralised Finance and Decentralised Finance are treated, its an issue the IRS is currently grappling with given the precedent it sets. Centralised Finance (CeFi) The Loan Analogy In a typical CeFi "Earn" program, you deposit an asset like Bitcoin with a centralised company. The platform's Terms and Conditions often frame this as a loan. Because you are lending your BTC with the right to get BTC back, you may be considered to have maintained "beneficial ownership." Consequently, no disposal event occurs on deposit, you avoid an immediate CGT event, and your 12-month holding period for the CGT discount continues. Decentralised Finance (DeFi) The Disposal Problem In a DeFi liquidity pool, the process is fundamentally different. You send 1 BTC to a smart contract and receive a completely different asset, an LP token that represents your share of the pool. The IRS views this as a disposal of your Bitcoin. This action triggers an immediate CGT event and resets your long term discounts. This legal distinction creates a system where users are financially incentivised to take on the higher counterparty risk of a centralised platform to achieve a better tax outcome. The challenge of creating fairer DeFi tax rules While implementing a "no disposal safe harbour" for DeFi may sound like a simple solution, it presents profound technical and legal challenges for legislators. The difficulty lies in defining the boundaries of such a rule. What qualifies as 'In Kind'? If you deposit 100% ETH and get an recipt token for a 100% ETH lending pool, that's simple. But what if the LP pool is 50% ETH and 50% USDC? Is that still "in kind"? What about a 3-token or 8-token pool? What about when the Composition changes? What about 'Financialised' LP Tokens? What happens when the LP token itself stops being just a receipt and becomes a financial instrument in it's own right? You can use LP tokens as collateral for loans, trade them on secondary markets, and even stake them in other protocols. At what point does the LP token become a new, distinct asset, breaking the "in kind" link to the original deposit? Gains could be rolled over indefinitely from one high-yield protocol to another. The lines blur between what is a simple "receipt" and what is a complex, interest-bearing financial product. This could lead to a significant erosion of the tax base, as value is generated and compounded outside the reach of clear taxing points. This create a legislative challenge. Legislators would have to draw a precise, legally defensible line between a simple liquidity pool and a complex protocol that creates literal derivative product. Creating this definition without opening loopholes for unintended assets to get the same treatment is extraordinarily difficult. Creating a special exception for DeFi also risks undermining the integrity of the broader tax system. What would stop other industries from demanding similar treatment? For example, an investor might ask, "I swapped my individual TSLA and AMD shares for units in a tech ETF which holds just TSLA and AMD. That's an 'in-kind' swap, why do I have to pay CGT?"

panthera_N

NVDA stock is at all time high, SPY near ATH, same as BTC. TSLA sucks but don't underestimate Elon fanatics

DryGeneral990

I remember TSLA was over 1,000 like 4 years ago

footbag22

You sound exactly like me but I've bought 100k of TSLA instead. And a bit of MSTR.

Daddio4u

I would go 50% to BTC, use the rest until you get get a job for living expenses, borrow to match the 50% - interest expenses are tax deductible, take the balance of your savings after you get a job and put it in MSTR. When MSTR seems toppy rotate into TSLA. Never sell the BTC. Keep working to cover the debt repayments. Thank me in 5 to 7 years. NFA.

Working-Network-1876

Fuck off Elon, Tesla sold its BTC in the last bear market. Dude promised BTC payments for TSLA, took it away and never implemented it again.

biophysicsguy

“I know it’s better than a traditional bank” Come on, it has been performing better than most of the top stocks. In the past 5 years it has done 1022% which outperformed MSFT (145%), META (192%), TSLA (384%), and APPL (125%). Why do you act like a 10x is just ok?

bsc_rug_pulls

Cue the “thought I was buying TSLA, but it’s just a shitcoin on Solana” support calls. r/coinbase is already filled with this lol

lidge7012

I'm all in now, but if I had gone in earlier when I first heard about it, I could retire now. One of the biggest regrets of my life, that I selling TSLA and META. Could retire by now if I just held, but oh well.

DegenDreamer

10% drawdowns have become rarer? We've had 5 of them in 2025 so far which is riskier than most traditional investments. "Risky" doesn't mean bearish either. It has higher volatility than what it's benchmarked against (S&P 500, etc). This is measurable, not opinion. PLTR is risky, TSLA is risky, putting all my money in a box under my bed is risky. And yes, Bitcoin is risky. That's not a bad thing.

HopiumTrump

Bitcoin is better than TSLA!!

cryptoripto123

Of course, but let's be real: none of you even got in on mediocre gains whether its TSLA, AAPL, or even the lowly S&P500. The issue isn't that you didn't win the lottery but that you had zero concept of personal finances.

sgrinavi

That would be nice, but we've all seen equities with plenty of institutional support tumble down 50% in a couple of months. TSLA is a great example

Obvireal

I’ve got IBIT MSTR MSTU SMLR MARA NAKA ASST CEP FAAS TSLA CORZ CLSK CRCL TZUP and some FLD. Hahahaha😈 Treasuries for the win🚀

Obsidianram

Can you really expect great results when you're relying on software engineers and such to do your sales & marketing? Does AAPL, IBM, TSLA or GOOGL do this? It also doesn't help when your focus is on stupid shit like "planting trees", "digital IDs for school kids in Africa" or getting in bed with the devil - oooos, I mean, the UN. Some projects just kill-off themselves with misguided decision making and warped ideology...

superminingbros

$70B for now, could go up, could go down. TSLA is a volatile stock.

HSuke

This is the future of stock investments From now on, for every $3 invested into TSLA, Tesla will buy $1 worth of US manufactured cars.

IndustrialPuppetTwo

I don't think anything at this point is going to help TSLA, not even a new CEO.

theonly764hero

It’s wild. I remember when Elon smoked weed on Rogan and the TSLA stock drops made headline news. That was child’s play compared to the past several months.

Glum-Temporary7426

Trump and his sidekick are pretending to feud to drop the price of TSLA before his robotaxi company launches on the 12th. I say buy

ZackZeysto

I love to short TSLA. Im right there with you

coomzee

I love it when people lose money on TSLA.

ZackZeysto

I would not exactly call them grown up men. More like two egoistic childish loosers with too much power and publicity crying over each other. And that is somehow tanking the markets. But probably the -14% TSLA stock that triggered other people to sell a bunch of assets because they got margin called.

kale_boriak

Bitcoin is a risk asset with close correlation to TSLA - short covering.

Hick6262

Yea seems crazy but look at TSLA stock lmao

OriginalFluff

TSLA One way or another it’s a much bigger oppy than BTC in the immediate 1-7 days

urbangoose

I'm pretty neutral on this At one hand, I don't want too much regulation overhead and I do believe the better projects will survive in the end. I know Ethereum has been shat on the past 4 years by the community, but it's 'surviving'. It's done better than 99% of other coins since the 2021 peak. It's just Bitcoin has far surpassed any other coin these 4 past years. And on the other hand, if people want to gamble and lose money, they will do it (and let them do it) - crypto or not. Current trend tells me that it's more than crypto. The likes of DraftKing and Polymarket becoming enormous is because retail traders are willing to play the game. And, even if you take away the meme coins, DraftKing, and Polymarket, etc., there's still TSLA, GME, AMC, and even SPY 0DTE options. Yea, pump fun theatrics is crazy. But coins come and go. Some reach the moon before they go, some don't. I was looking back at top 10 coins of 2016 the other day. Dash, Maid, Xem, Steem.. were all considered the 'best crypto projects' that year. I doubt anyone prior to Covid even heard of those coins.. No, they weren't meme coins but the bad apples, it's all the same. They come and go.

OxfordKnot

>we're not talking about the fundamentals of price based on a simple offer vs. demand equation Of course. That's the whole point of OTC or other "off the books" trades. Though IIRC, Saylor said he was buying his initial MSTR stake at some constant rate (like every minute) over several months (so kinda in the market?) To your point of the OTC desks - this is where things are a little bit different than in a stock market (say TSLA or AAPL) - I am of the mind that 21 million (well, 20M right now) is a relatively small number to work with. There aren't a bazillion places to get new coins from (yes, they can load up on a derp news dip, etc.) to refill their coffers and meet the demand of multiple large buys over a short time. If I am correct, that inability to wait months to refill + lack of places to go to fill in the first place = pressure outside of the OTC, spilling into the retail market and then...number go up. Now I don't know how long the lag between "OTC got hit hard" and "OTC tries to refill" and "OTC has to make bold moves because demand is now" and "hey look magic 8-ball, retail is getting OTC pressure" is, but I don't think it is years and i do think it is, at absolute most, months.

PoisonWaffle3

It's good to see that I'm not the only crazy person who did this, and it's good to see that it went well for you! I did basically the same towards the end of 2022: $50k in balance transfers (0% 18 months, 3% upfront fee) to buy BTC, crypto miner stocks, TSLA, META, and PLTR. I sold quite a bit and reinvested elsewhere after a while, but I still have a full BTC and change. I've paid off all but about $10k of the cards (did another balance transfer last year), and the current value of what remains is about $250k. I'm hoping to hit a total value of $350-400k by the end of this bull run, basically all free money.

NeighborhoodFair5468

Get outta mutual funds, weight heavier btc and microstrategy, and invest in disruption TSLA and NVDA. Solana and sui if you want more crypto exposure, but maybe wait until bear market before you get into those.

realheadphonecandy

I’m personally getting out of real estate and selling off collectibles. Currently 25% BTC but will end at 50% BTC, 25% TSLA, 5% cash, 20% collectibles. The only lifelines to me look like BTC and TSLA.

KiNg-MaK3R

Guess that's true, I always forget about TSLA.

InvoluntarySoul

TSLA only goes up

HankScorpio2020

Looking backwards is pain. I bought $30k of TSLA when it went public. I sold it a few weeks later for $2k gains.

dhddydh645hggsj

TSLA I think

imade100ktrading

Don't even ask me about TSLA

urbangoose

>the larger the market the lower the proportion of degenerative gambling TSLA and S&P 0DTE have entered the chat

True_Day3466

I am using Robinhood for TTWO and TSLA and VOO, but using Cash App for BTC, is that good, or should I just use Robinhood as well for BTC?

Fun-Sundae4060

TSLA share ownership for the past 6 years (but transferred just 3 years ago) and TSLQ holding for about 1 month from late January. On one day 2 months ago I printed over $100k literally overnight and then another $100k holding through the trading day on TSLQ

Wildren77

MSTR, ABTC, CES, KDLY, 3350(Metaplanet), KULR, SMLR, STRV, TSLA, the possibilities will soon be endless.

urbangoose

r/investing knows how to make make 1 way. take a company, perform valuation, if low=buy, if high=sell there are a million ways to make money, and moreover hedge yourself as well. but Warren Buffett, their god, preaches things like value investing and P/E ratio (which is fine). in the game of investing, stocks are just a small part of the picture. overall, stocks are fundamentally different to buying a commodity like bitcoin. they also don't like investing in gold, so no surprise bitcoin + tech = not-with-a-10-foot-pole. there's some argument to be had about over-zealous bitcoin influencers (and worse, crypto in general) that give crypto a bad image as well. i agree to a certain extent. but, with that point, i'd argue the GME, TSLA, AMC, BBBY crowd can be just as toxic, but they still invest in them.

moonRekt

Totally. Bitcoin has no earnings. But then you look at traditional investments like TSLA—they do have earnings that are completely out of whack with their valuation and make zero financial sense investing in except for the same “number go up—greater fool theory” etc that they always accuse bitcoin of. At least Bitcoin doesn’t need to justify its earnings

AstroRoverToday

I think you’ve just discovered the Theory of Relativity 😱. Nothing goes up or down. Everything is measured “relative” to something else. If you jump up, did you move? Yes, relative to the Earth you went up. When people say BTC went up, they often skip mentioning what it moved relative to, like USD, or perhaps TSLA, or maybe some other currency, like EUR. If BTC went up by 10% relative to USD, but USD went down 10% relative to EUR, then BTC didn’t move at all, relative to EUR. So, in order for you to put a value on BTC you actually need to measure it relative to something else.

Fun-Sundae4060

Of course it’s possible. I made $2M on TSLA stock in 2 years while I was still attending college. Bitcoin has that potential as well. I think you overestimate how easily you can retire on just $1M though. When you’re young you need much more more capital to retire than someone who’s 55-65 because you’ll be alive longer.

Rich_Produce8986

She gave the target for TSLA of $2,600 by the year 2030. She is fucking stupid.

jasoncyke

She also said TSLA will go to 3k in few years. I mean the last 5 years of ARK performance is still in the fucking minus, she is literally worse than most retails.

moonRekt

She also just said TSLA to like $3,000 again too. She’s either stupid or betting on a heavily devalued dollar via inflation

Hot_Philosopher3199

No. TSLA, NVDA, PLTR. All disruptive technology like BTC. There are plenty of chances to diversify (a little) and still make great gains. All-in-one, no way Jose!

cryptoripto123

The issue is 99% of you are just chasing returns. But returns exist outside of Bitcoin. as I've said many times--why didn't you get rich off of NVDA? TSLA? AAPL? Countless other stocks? The other issue is 99% of you lack any basic understanding of personal finances. If it was that simple to get rich, everyone would've done it already. Yet most people here don't even get basic concepts like budgeting, savings, compounded returns, etc. Concepts like DCA only suddenly became a thing as they learned about Bitcoin but they never DCA-ed at all into 401ks or IRAs. Do yourself a favor and learn about personal finance before you just talk about chasing returns. Because let's face it. You all already mostly failed given you missed out on easy 100,000x returns. At this point an additional 100,000x return is extremely unlikely.

Fun-Sundae4060

Why would trading BTC not be a good idea? Volatile assets create lots of opportunity to generate entries and exits to gain high returns. Time in the market beats timing the market for majority of people… but I’ve beaten the market for the past 6-7 years by a huge margin via swing trading TSLA. TSLA and BTC are of similar volatility and TSLA outperforms BTC at certain times, but I plan to include BTC in my portfolio more in the future.

Fun-Sundae4060

I don’t own BTC directly. I own leveraged exposure to it meaning I profit when BTC goes up more than the amount BTC goes up. Same in losses if it goes down. This is not a position I can hold for an indefinite amount of time, I’m pretty much required to exit for risk management. While I’m bullish on BTC and things like TSLA, there are times to own the assets and times to sell. You make WAY more timing the cycles so long as you are correct. Not just in fiat terms, you can own more BTC just by exiting and coming back in cheaper.

Fun-Sundae4060

I made 120% last year on TSLA stock alone and 30% YTD on TSLQ. I’m riding BTC right now with about $1.1M worth of exposure for the next few months. Everything is a tradable asset with their own risk and reward profiles.

ItIsRaf

Well a lot of people are bagging the short term raises on MSTR, TSLA and BTC

Petursinn

Ye sure, TSLA is doing great, and they will never sell their Bitcoins, gotcha....

fanzakh

If I can borrow on TSLA, I can borrow on BTC. It all depends on the margin requirement. And I'm not saying this will happen right now cause no bank does this. But if BTC becomes a treasury asset, it will act just like gold or treasuries.

Sabast-

As a seasoned 25+ year investor, I would tweak this a bit: - Pay of all debts first - unless you have an essentially free interest rate like 3%, and a comfortably manageable monthly payment. But pay extra to get the princapal down faster. - Put 20% into a super safe, liquid cash-equivalent instrument (eg savings account), until you build up enough to cover 6 months of normal living expenses. - Then drop it down to 10% and keep going until you have a year's worth, and keep going. Dip into it for after that for emergencies or big purchases, but never go below an identified 1 year of expenses, and try to keep growing it. - I would stay away specifically from XRP and SOL. I don't know why those have been doing well, but then again I don't know why TSLA hasn't crashed. People are stupid, and the market is dumb and irrational. Yes, they have been working to facilitate cross-border payments. But there is nothing intrinsic to either that allows that, just agreements that any crypto foundation can - and will - make, so not a real, unique, lasting competitive advantage. High TPS is good, but comes at a serious cost to the other two anchors in the Crypto Trilemma. The real and serious problem is that both of those lack the very two things that most crypo is great at: transparency and decentralization. SOL specifically has had *outages* in the past. That is totally unacceptable for something that should be trustless and decentralized. That it hopefully may never happen again, is irrelevant. That it ever happened at all, is a HUGE red flag. You might do well by getting in - just be sure to get out at the very next overheated market, just in case. I sure as hell am not touching either with a ten-foot pole. - BTC and ETH are always solid bets. I don't understand why BTC is beating literally anything - all it is, is "the first", and has name recognition for boomers telling their brokers "I want in on this crypto thing". That's it. Plus this delusion that it's "digital gold". So for that, it's probably not going anywhere for a while, and will probably continue to outpace everything else for years to come. Possibly even 10x'ing again before you know it, inexplicably, against all reason and logic. - Can't go wrong with other solid alts with fully open and transparent architectures, governance structures, and validators - like Cardano and Algorand. Hedera uses a new tech and is well-organized, very open and non-sus - but seems a little overhyped at the moment (unlike say underdog Algorand).

Friendly-Profit-8590

Totally agree but she got TSLA right. Though, I suppose, if she hadn’t we never would’ve heard of her.

ObiWanKokobi

Please buy $TSLA!