ALGO

pay85

MOON and ALGO (though the old one gave away more). ALGO for auto compound - but this is Al Ist obsolete with the new rewards model. MOONs just cause.

jacobsr2

With last two partnership of the ALGO feels like a bright future for them

mybed54

lol will you be saying the same thing when your centralized shitcoin ALGO dies?

Tuxhorn

More ALGO. Haven't hit my target yet.

TarkovReddit0r

Yea I was about to write the same lol Doge SHIB vs ALGO is a perfect example

VannguardAnon

Honestly, marketing is everything. Doge/Shib? No real usecase, but good marketing. Eventually god a usecase by being able to pay with them at different stores in America. This only happened because of good marketing. ALGO/HBAR with a real world usecase, but bad marketing? Shilled by this sub, but still way below what it should be in value.

w00tangel

BTC, ETH for long term hodl. Some go into shitcoins for da, trades. A few of us like ALGO but we're tech guys.

oracleifi

Yeah, it aint for long term. I better invest that on PINK, UNI, ALGO, FTM that has a brighter future. I also have meme coins but once i profited, i exit fast.

Ill-Woodpecker1857

I also just grabbed up more ALGO. Great buy right now. I think ADA, ONE, XLM, and XTZ may come out of this well. Hoping for CKB too.

Ill-Woodpecker1857

ADA or ALGO maybe?

G_TNPA

Idk if your case was user error or not, but CB has been known to limit ALGO withdrawals whenever one of their wallets gets close to dipping below it's Governance commitment

CryptocalEnvelopment

Has anyone else had trouble sending ALGO from Coinbase to a wallet? It wouldn't recognize my address earlier for a few hours, I thought maybe it was a whitelisting issue, but everything looked like it was supposed to. A few hours later I was able to with no problem.

w00tangel

So... This one is for the people in the Algorand ecosystem... Apparently I can now use my LP tokens from tinyman and Pact finance as a colateral on Folks Finance. Now comes the crazy part. I get to keep the rediculous APR of Aenas rewards while using my LP tokens as colateral. This means I can go into ALGO/USDC pool on Pact with 43% APR due to Aenas rewards till the end of June, acquire those LP tokens, deposit those tokens on Folks as a colateral and borrow more ALGO and USDC against that colateral and pay 3% APR and put those borrowed coins back into Packt to gain new LP tokens with 43% APR and do the whole thing again in circle.

deaddoll_x

Who cares? ALGO does not need a promoter really, especially one that can attract negative attraction to an otherwisw good project.

mybed54

Don't forget to add ALGO is centralized and defeats the whole purpose of "uncensorable money"

TarkovReddit0r

Bullish on ALGO But they really need better marketing so more people know it deserves a higher rank

7101334

I don't invest in new coins really, I've lost money on ADA/LINK/ATOM/ALGO even before the recent crash. Even though I still believe in all of those except ADA. BTC/ETH/XMR for me

Crypto_Malik

ALGO and a little bit HNT

Random5483

99.9% of cryptos are useless and should have no value. A handful of the tens of thousands of crypto projects bring some value. This is why investing in altcoins is so dangerous. This is true even for top 10-50 altcoins, let alone moonshots that people often invest in. BTC is risky. ETH is risky. My favorite projects like ATOM, ALGO, and MATIC are insanely risky. And that moonshot you are invested in is purely a gamble. I also think this reddit during bull cycles gets overly optimistic about crypto. I do think crypto will play a big role in the future. But adoption of crypto by developed economies as a primary currency is not going to happen in 1 or 2 decades. These countries benefit too much from control over their fiat currency. And people who think BTC is likely to get to $500k or millions in the coming 10 or so years are likely delusional. I do think BTC will outperform equities over the next decade by a large margin, with some higher downside risk. I do see BTC being a useful secondary currency in some developing economies that struggle from very significant inflation in the next decade or so once BTC price gains some stability. I can see defi becoming useful for serving the underbanked. Developed nations have some underbanked and developing nations have many underbanked. I don't think the defi crazy of yield farming is sustainable, but defi as a means of storing and moving money cheaply can be a huge benefit to those with limited or no banking access. I can see NFTs being useful in the ticket system (movies, concerts, and more...possibly even for flights and the like in the longer term). I believe in the future of crypto. But I am also a realist. Crypto is very risky. Even BTC, the safest crypto investment, could be replaced. Yes, BTC's adoption makes it hard to displace, but BTC is not as safe as an S&P 500 index fund. It is a single investment that faces outsized risk. But as I believe crypto will play a larger role in the future, I invest in BTC and ETH, and I dabble with some of my favorite projects with a small portion of my crypto portfolio (80% minimum for BTC/ETH combined). And I also keep my crypto investments at under 20% (currently around 12%) or so of my overall investment portfolio. This limits my risk if crypto collapses, but gives me upside for gains if crypto does well. Some crypto bulls will call my fears FUD. Some crypto bears will think I am too bullish. I consider myself a crypto bull in the long-term. But I am also a middle aged bull with savings to protect. I could retire frugally now. So while I want to grow my investments, I also want to protect them. This means I need to be careful about the risks I take.

joechss

I’d say use crypto. I’m partial to ALGO or XLM for moving funds. The only hold up would be any wait period to withdraw if using an exchange, but that probably varies by country and may not be an issue with many banks blending into crypto assets.

KeepOnKeepingOnnn

25, UK, got in just before the crash last May. Bought the dip the next few months and did somewhat well for myself. Mostly in ETH and ALGO at this point.

ArtyHobo

BTC ALGO ADA HBAR will prob survive, not much else.

RedPhaedrus5

Love seeing ALGO governors bail so that sweet sweet APR can keep rising.

ibowlquick

My choice of blockchain technology among the top 30. Is Algorand. I’ve gone deep into this project, the more I read about it the more it wows me. Algorand is an incredible project and Silvio Micali is a genius. I genuinely believe ALGO should be ranked 2nd in place of ETH with the sort of technology it has compared to ETH and others. Do your own research and you will come to the same conclusion as me. I hope ALGO can succeed in the long term, it has already done so much in the 3 years since it’s launch. Incredibly bullish.

Str1kon

CZ already answered this bs FUD question on twitter a week ago. This sub reddit has the biggest hate boner for anything CZ or Binance it’s a absolute joke. This reddit is bs like ALGO good, BNB bad rhetoric nonstop shilling.

G_TNPA

Wayyyy inefficient. Could reasonably work as a token but it'd need to be on a very fast and cheap chain to be worthwhile. Maybe ALGO or XLM or something. But you'd also need smart contracts to ensure an accurate payout and at that point why not just make a digital casino lol

Gandalf_The_Geigh

Like everything in life, it's about moderation. Those that abuse it will ruin it for the rest of us. Carbon Credits make sense for projects like ALGO, who are consciously making an effort.

pob125

Rate my profile(or rip it)biggest bags to lowest. ETH, ALGO, JUNO, ATOM, BTC, AMP, OSMOS, TEZOS, JASMY

SnooDonkeys2427

ALGO has 1.5B of VC money

PremdeepVR

Incoming: ALGO supporters

SnooDonkeys2427

I’ve only ever seen them answered in favor of ALGO. It sounds like you are a fan of ADA, so you don’t even need to explain it to me, if you’ve got a solid link you can toss my way lmk I’m just tryna pick the winners that will be around for decades

SnooDonkeys2427

All I want is an argument on how fundamentally, ADA is not overvalued at 22B when comparing it’s tech to ALGO at a 5B market cap If I offended you, my bad. I just want an answer

SnooDonkeys2427

Solana and ALGO actually have use cases though. ADA is an overvalued flop on every metric

SnooDonkeys2427

That’s absolute cope. No VC money means the whales don’t see it as a potential winner to own stake of Give me an argument on how (ADA) with no VC money makes sense at a 22B market cap while ALGO (1.5B VC money) is sitting at 5B market cap

finished_lurking

People have mentioned ALGO but to add to it; ALGO is carbon negative. So that’s the project to support if you care about the earth and shit.

nick83487

In some aspects, the energy consumption of BTC improves the security of the network but it can pose a problem as well. I believe BTC energy consumption has started to focus more towards renewable sources which I hope continues, but I'm also bullish on greener coins like ADA and ALGO.

SL-Gremory-

I have an X and the Bluetooth off. I only use it for signing transactions on ALGO. What I can say from experience is that the range is SHORT. It's literally like 6 inches. Further than that and you lose signal.

scepitile

Aside from BTC and ETH im looking at picking some GALA, DOT, MATIC and ALGO if they drop a little more, any concerns on these aside from the current state of the market?

Crypto_Fi

What’s your take on the ability of Near to differentiate from other strong L1s? I am starting to believe that a pure DeFi war doesn’t make sense, we need other use cases and more innovation, not only pumping liquidity incentives. That’s why for example I like MATIC a lot, doing a number of things (payments, decentralized ID, etc) on top of pure DeFI, and for the same reason ADA/ALGO I like Near a lot, it looks like the cherrypick of the best tech around, but I am not sure whether the strategy is to just push on DeFI growth on Aurora. I believe it’s not enough anymore

Crypto_Fi

I mean I can afford to let it ride but trying to make up my mind since I am shifting my investment thesis on Near in terms of risk/reward vs ADA and ALGO. Recent Luna events hit me with a loss and made me re-think about my risk perception and tolerance

Crypto_Fi

True that’s right, and that’s why personally now that accelerated vesting is over I am starting to consider very seriously taking a position in ALGO...too juicy at these prices

ibowlquick

Dips? Time to buy more ALGO

Crypto_Fi

Very high potential as well and actually I am used to consider it within the same “high potential bucket” of ALGO and ADA

Skyguy824

I need to do some more research, but I think B is overwhelming the right choice, especially this early in governance. To those who feel A is right due to increased risk in liquidity provisions, there isn't a huge amount of risk every time liquidity is added. AlgoFi for example, one of maybe 3 options on the ALGO chain, has a Vault feature where you don't supply a pair, only exchange your ALGO for a token (vALGO) that can be traded or used for other DEFI purposes. There is (very minimal) risk of liquidation due to over leveraging yourself, but it can happen. For the current context, this risk is incredibly low and in my opinion does not warrent a vote from AlgoFi being worth double that of others. I, again, need to do more research, but this push for liquidity on chain through governance gives an incredible amount of power to financial institutions and whales. That's not what equal governance should be about, especially this early in the governance protocol.

Artec_home

ALGO is going to have a very bright future with the big partnerships.

justbc

Remind me what impact ALGO can have?

SlowMotionPanic

Have to go with ADA. And I say that as someone firmly in ALGO's camp.

X2WE

YOLO'ing earlier gains into ADA DOT ALGO. Which one doubles first in the next alt season?

git

> DOT 69 > > ALGO 69 nice.

ts_wrathchild

ALGO will hit top 10 during next cycle. It will *probably* be fighting for it's position on the list with DOGE and/or DOT.

CointestAdmin

#Ethereum Con-Arguments Below is an argument written by roberthonker which won 2nd place in the Ethereum Con-Arguments topic for a prior [Cointest](/r/CointestOfficial/wiki/cointest_policy) round. > **Taken from u\/maleficent_plankton's submission from last round** > > **Gas Fees**: > > The biggest issues for Ethereum are its network gas fees. Every transaction needs gas to pay for storage and processing power, and gas prices vary based on demand. Gas price is very volatile and often changes 2-5x in magnitude within the same day. ERC20 transfers are used for a large percentage of cryptocurrencies, and it's the reason small ERC20 transactions on DeFi platforms under $1000 are impractical. If I wanted to send ERC20 tokens between exchanges, it's often cheaper to trade for XRP, ALGO, or some other microtransaction coin, transfer it using their other coin's native network, and then trade back into the original token. Pretty ridiculous. > > [Typical transaction fees were between $2-10 over the past year](https://etherscan.io/chart/avg-txfee-usd), but they have shot up to $70 on several occasions. It's very common for popular exchanges to set withdrawal fees to a flat $20-50 for ERC20 transfers due to expensive and unpredictable Ethereum network fees. > > And that's just for basic transactions. Anyone who has tried to use more complex smart contracts like moving MATIC from Polygon mainnet back to ETH L1 mainnet during a time of high gas fees in early 2021 probably saw $100-$200 gas fees. Staking MATIC also costs expensive ERC20 gas fees. (So much for MATIC's claim to reduce ETH gas fees.) > > **Inflation**: > > Ethereum has no supply limit and is still inflationary. It did have [three deflationary days](https://www.theblockcrypto.com/data/on-chain-metrics/ethereum/net-eth-emission-after-eip-1559) in September 2021 after EIP-1557, but it's still net inflationary of ~5K ETH daily. As other competitors join the smart contract space, it's likely we'll see fewer deflationary days in the future. > > **Smart Contract Competition**: > > Ethereum has enjoyed its lead as the smart contract blockchain because it had so few competitors historically. Now we have tons of efficient smart contract competitors like Algorand, Solana, and Cardano. While Ethereum has an enormous lead in smart contract project adoption, it is likely to gradually lose market share to its competitors, which are ahead of it in terms of efficiency and technology. Who wants to pay $20 gas fees when you can get similar transactions for under $0.01 with Algo and Solana or $0.30 transactions with Cardano? This will mainly depend on whether the PoS consensus Ethereum 2.0 can arrive fast enough, and whether it can deliver its claims. For now, we are stuck with PoW Ethereum with almost no adoption for Layer 2. > > **Layer 2 issues**: > > Layer 2 solutions are still extremely early and almost have no adoption. Considering how long it takes exchanges to roll out Layer 2 networks, it'll probably be 6-12 months before I can use any Ethereum Layer 2 solutions on Coinbase. (Polygon network still isn't available on any of the biggest US exchanges after half a year of becoming popular and claiming hundreds of partnerships). The majority of platforms do not currently support Layer 2 rollup networks. Very few fiat onramping/offramping exchanges allow for Optimistic or zk-Rollups. ZK Rollups are very limited in use until they have coordination between exchanges that both support them. > > **L2 - Plasma** has been around since 2017, and I couldn't find anyone still using this state-channel solution. It's [more or less abandoned](https://medium.com/dragonfly-research/the-life-and-death-of-plasma-b72c6a59c5ad) in favor of rollups. I guess some Polygon bridges still use Plasma. It required lots of work and always-online overhead to monitor the side chain for misbehavior. You also need to pay the ERC20 gas fee twice when opening and closing the state channel. It has all the downsides to Lightning, which itself is facing lack of adoption. There is a super long challenge period to exit a side chain via Plasma, which means a 1 week settlement. And a mass exit would complete congest the Ethereum blockchain. > > Both Optimistic and ZK Rollups are handled off-chain and require a separate network nodes or smart contracts as infrastructure to validate transactions or generate ZK Proofs. > > **L2 - Optimistic Rollups are expensive and slow**: > > They settle in [1 week](https://vitalik.ca/general/2021/01/05/rollup.html) because there is a challenge period where anyone can submit a fraud-proof to show if there was an illegitimate transaction. People get anxious over 30-minute finality. How are they going to deal with 1 week settlement? Also, optimistic rollups are inherently insecure by design in order to reduce fees because they outsource validation offchain. The operator can influence transaction ordering. You can have faster withdrawals if you pay a market maker or verifier to jump in and swap your transaction, but why bother with the additional hassle and fees? I don't think the average crypto user will have any use cases for optimistic rollups. Optimistic rollups currently cost [$1-2 on Arbitrum One and Optimism](https://l2fees.info/). Unless you need to use a smart contract (which aren't supported on ZK Rollups), why would anyone anyone want to babysit their transactions for 1 week when ZK Rollups are faster, cheaper, and more secure? > > **L2 - ZK Rollup limitations**: > > ZK Rollup require special infrastructure to generate ZK Proofs. These are very computationally-expensive (potentially [thousands of times](https://vitalik.ca/general/2021/01/05/rollup.html) more expensive that just doing the computation directly). On-chain cost of a ZK Rollup is cheap at about [$0.20 to $.40](https://l2fees.info/), but there is a separate infrastructure cost that is rarely mentioned. Loopring is rolling up its costs into its trading fees, currently 0.80%, so their feeless transfer claims are misleading. For transfers of $10K, that's $80 of fees. In any case, even at $0.40, these are still ~100x more expensive than transferring microtransaction-friendly coins such as XLM, XRP, Nano, etc. FWIW, it's a huge improvement over current Layer 1 costs ... when the platforms I use support them some year in the future. The big limitation is that smart contracts can't use ZK Rollups. > > **Ethereum 2.0 arriving later than competitors**: > > Ethereum is separated into Casper FFG (Friendly Finality Gadget) and Casper CBC (Correct by Construction). Casper FFG is a BFT PoS consensus overlay of PoW based on the GHOST protocol. We don't have much details on Casper CBC since its design is still in progress. Its main purpose is to increase transaction speeds and reduce energy costs while sacrificing decentralization and security. > > The ETH 2.0 Beacon chain, a completely separate blockchain from ETH, won't merge with the main blockchain [until 2022](https://decrypt.co/78690/ethereum-2-staking-tops-21-billion-merge-horizon), giving competitors plenty of time to steal a share of smart contract projects. Even then, Vitalik said that [scaling will still rely on ZK Rollups until the 64-chain sharding phase](https://decrypt.co/34204/ethereum-2-0-will-walk-and-roll-for-two-years-before-it-can-run) arriving later in 2022 or 2023. It'll likely lose some market share to existing alternatives like Algo, Solana, Cardano, and others. > > Unlike Cardano PoS staking, Ethereum 2.0 PoS staking uses slashing. The system cannot tell between being offline or being censored. It's pretty damn scary. > 50% downtime is breakeven (unless there's no prepare + commit). Slash punishment can be very harsh. In the first months, we already had multiple examples of large slashings on the Beacon ETH 2.0 chain caused by simple errors: [Bugs](https://medium.com/prysmatic-labs/eth2-medalla-testnet-incident-f7fbc3cc934a) can cause slashing. [Timestamp](https://medium.com/prysmatic-labs/eth2-medalla-testnet-incident-f7fbc3cc934a) being off and cause slashing. QoS and [redundancy mistakes](https://medium.com/stakefish/ethereum-2-0-the-first-slash-a-retrospective-99e4fdcd563a) can cause slashing. ***** Would you like to learn more? [Click here](/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/pz4vav/rcc_cointest_top_10_ethereum_conarguments_october/) to be taken to the original topic-thread or you can scan through the [Cointest archive](/r/CointestOfficial/wiki/cointest_archive#wiki_Ethereum) to find arguments on this topic in other rounds. Since this is a con-argument, what could be a better time to promote the Skeptics Discussion thread? You can find the latest thread [here](/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/umsqe8/monthly_optimists_discussion_may_2022/).

newbonsite

I'm gonna go with ChainLink or ALGO both have huge potential imo...

TarkovReddit0r

DOT, ALGO or CKB MATIC great when ETH becomes bigger

Castr0-

ALGO

Runnegan

Feels like some more good news for the ALGO, and another reason to buy them.

CointestAdmin

#Ethereum Con-Arguments Below is an argument written by roberthonker which won 2nd place in the Ethereum Con-Arguments topic for a prior [Cointest](/r/CointestOfficial/wiki/cointest_policy) round. > **Taken from u\/maleficent_plankton's submission from last round** > > **Gas Fees**: > > The biggest issues for Ethereum are its network gas fees. Every transaction needs gas to pay for storage and processing power, and gas prices vary based on demand. Gas price is very volatile and often changes 2-5x in magnitude within the same day. ERC20 transfers are used for a large percentage of cryptocurrencies, and it's the reason small ERC20 transactions on DeFi platforms under $1000 are impractical. If I wanted to send ERC20 tokens between exchanges, it's often cheaper to trade for XRP, ALGO, or some other microtransaction coin, transfer it using their other coin's native network, and then trade back into the original token. Pretty ridiculous. > > [Typical transaction fees were between $2-10 over the past year](https://etherscan.io/chart/avg-txfee-usd), but they have shot up to $70 on several occasions. It's very common for popular exchanges to set withdrawal fees to a flat $20-50 for ERC20 transfers due to expensive and unpredictable Ethereum network fees. > > And that's just for basic transactions. Anyone who has tried to use more complex smart contracts like moving MATIC from Polygon mainnet back to ETH L1 mainnet during a time of high gas fees in early 2021 probably saw $100-$200 gas fees. Staking MATIC also costs expensive ERC20 gas fees. (So much for MATIC's claim to reduce ETH gas fees.) > > **Inflation**: > > Ethereum has no supply limit and is still inflationary. It did have [three deflationary days](https://www.theblockcrypto.com/data/on-chain-metrics/ethereum/net-eth-emission-after-eip-1559) in September 2021 after EIP-1557, but it's still net inflationary of ~5K ETH daily. As other competitors join the smart contract space, it's likely we'll see fewer deflationary days in the future. > > **Smart Contract Competition**: > > Ethereum has enjoyed its lead as the smart contract blockchain because it had so few competitors historically. Now we have tons of efficient smart contract competitors like Algorand, Solana, and Cardano. While Ethereum has an enormous lead in smart contract project adoption, it is likely to gradually lose market share to its competitors, which are ahead of it in terms of efficiency and technology. Who wants to pay $20 gas fees when you can get similar transactions for under $0.01 with Algo and Solana or $0.30 transactions with Cardano? This will mainly depend on whether the PoS consensus Ethereum 2.0 can arrive fast enough, and whether it can deliver its claims. For now, we are stuck with PoW Ethereum with almost no adoption for Layer 2. > > **Layer 2 issues**: > > Layer 2 solutions are still extremely early and almost have no adoption. Considering how long it takes exchanges to roll out Layer 2 networks, it'll probably be 6-12 months before I can use any Ethereum Layer 2 solutions on Coinbase. (Polygon network still isn't available on any of the biggest US exchanges after half a year of becoming popular and claiming hundreds of partnerships). The majority of platforms do not currently support Layer 2 rollup networks. Very few fiat onramping/offramping exchanges allow for Optimistic or zk-Rollups. ZK Rollups are very limited in use until they have coordination between exchanges that both support them. > > **L2 - Plasma** has been around since 2017, and I couldn't find anyone still using this state-channel solution. It's [more or less abandoned](https://medium.com/dragonfly-research/the-life-and-death-of-plasma-b72c6a59c5ad) in favor of rollups. I guess some Polygon bridges still use Plasma. It required lots of work and always-online overhead to monitor the side chain for misbehavior. You also need to pay the ERC20 gas fee twice when opening and closing the state channel. It has all the downsides to Lightning, which itself is facing lack of adoption. There is a super long challenge period to exit a side chain via Plasma, which means a 1 week settlement. And a mass exit would complete congest the Ethereum blockchain. > > Both Optimistic and ZK Rollups are handled off-chain and require a separate network nodes or smart contracts as infrastructure to validate transactions or generate ZK Proofs. > > **L2 - Optimistic Rollups are expensive and slow**: > > They settle in [1 week](https://vitalik.ca/general/2021/01/05/rollup.html) because there is a challenge period where anyone can submit a fraud-proof to show if there was an illegitimate transaction. People get anxious over 30-minute finality. How are they going to deal with 1 week settlement? Also, optimistic rollups are inherently insecure by design in order to reduce fees because they outsource validation offchain. The operator can influence transaction ordering. You can have faster withdrawals if you pay a market maker or verifier to jump in and swap your transaction, but why bother with the additional hassle and fees? I don't think the average crypto user will have any use cases for optimistic rollups. Optimistic rollups currently cost [$1-2 on Arbitrum One and Optimism](https://l2fees.info/). Unless you need to use a smart contract (which aren't supported on ZK Rollups), why would anyone anyone want to babysit their transactions for 1 week when ZK Rollups are faster, cheaper, and more secure? > > **L2 - ZK Rollup limitations**: > > ZK Rollup require special infrastructure to generate ZK Proofs. These are very computationally-expensive (potentially [thousands of times](https://vitalik.ca/general/2021/01/05/rollup.html) more expensive that just doing the computation directly). On-chain cost of a ZK Rollup is cheap at about [$0.20 to $.40](https://l2fees.info/), but there is a separate infrastructure cost that is rarely mentioned. Loopring is rolling up its costs into its trading fees, currently 0.80%, so their feeless transfer claims are misleading. For transfers of $10K, that's $80 of fees. In any case, even at $0.40, these are still ~100x more expensive than transferring microtransaction-friendly coins such as XLM, XRP, Nano, etc. FWIW, it's a huge improvement over current Layer 1 costs ... when the platforms I use support them some year in the future. The big limitation is that smart contracts can't use ZK Rollups. > > **Ethereum 2.0 arriving later than competitors**: > > Ethereum is separated into Casper FFG (Friendly Finality Gadget) and Casper CBC (Correct by Construction). Casper FFG is a BFT PoS consensus overlay of PoW based on the GHOST protocol. We don't have much details on Casper CBC since its design is still in progress. Its main purpose is to increase transaction speeds and reduce energy costs while sacrificing decentralization and security. > > The ETH 2.0 Beacon chain, a completely separate blockchain from ETH, won't merge with the main blockchain [until 2022](https://decrypt.co/78690/ethereum-2-staking-tops-21-billion-merge-horizon), giving competitors plenty of time to steal a share of smart contract projects. Even then, Vitalik said that [scaling will still rely on ZK Rollups until the 64-chain sharding phase](https://decrypt.co/34204/ethereum-2-0-will-walk-and-roll-for-two-years-before-it-can-run) arriving later in 2022 or 2023. It'll likely lose some market share to existing alternatives like Algo, Solana, Cardano, and others. > > Unlike Cardano PoS staking, Ethereum 2.0 PoS staking uses slashing. The system cannot tell between being offline or being censored. It's pretty damn scary. > 50% downtime is breakeven (unless there's no prepare + commit). Slash punishment can be very harsh. In the first months, we already had multiple examples of large slashings on the Beacon ETH 2.0 chain caused by simple errors: [Bugs](https://medium.com/prysmatic-labs/eth2-medalla-testnet-incident-f7fbc3cc934a) can cause slashing. [Timestamp](https://medium.com/prysmatic-labs/eth2-medalla-testnet-incident-f7fbc3cc934a) being off and cause slashing. QoS and [redundancy mistakes](https://medium.com/stakefish/ethereum-2-0-the-first-slash-a-retrospective-99e4fdcd563a) can cause slashing. ***** Would you like to learn more? [Click here](/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/pz4vav/rcc_cointest_top_10_ethereum_conarguments_october/) to be taken to the original topic-thread or you can scan through the [Cointest archive](/r/CointestOfficial/wiki/cointest_archive#wiki_Ethereum) to find arguments on this topic in other rounds. Since this is a con-argument, what could be a better time to promote the Skeptics Discussion thread? You can find the latest thread [here](/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/umsqe8/monthly_optimists_discussion_may_2022/).

smeijeri

Partnership with FIFA is the main reason for pump of ALGO,

FetidGoochJuice

Gonna focus DCA on ALGO and LINK as I am down on them (and also would like more)

mangilyFeel

The first thing i notice in this comment is the DOT and ALGO number.

jakekick1999

Well he doesn't see what impact blockchains like ETH, ALGO, other L1 can have in the future. He was the bleeding edge when tech industry started. And now he is looking at the next revolution. Unsurprising that they will be apprehensive as they always are

fetushippo

Anyone ever watch the movie Argo ? Whenever I hear ALGO I just think of that famous line , “Argo fuck yourself “ makes me heh every time

yeetboi_dangerous

Nice! Idk enough about ALGO and LINK to buy yet

ShawtySnappin_

Do I even need to say it? ALGO BAYBEEEE

20seh

I have all these as well! Order of %: ETH ADA DOT BTC ATOM. Also have ALGO and LINK.

AnomanderRake42

>Your active participation or “work” to vote and participate is what qualifies you for a expected gain via governance awards The fact that governors can vote on proposals that control the direction of Algorand (which is then executed by developers, i.e. "the efforts of others") is what might qualify Algorand as a security. The fact that governors aren't paid until they vote is immaterial, because that's just an arbitrary condition of receiving the profits. The profits themselves were generated by ALGO validators. The governors could, if they wanted to, change the system back to the old system where every holder of ALGO gets paid an interest rate.

alimakesmusic

I would agree on ADA, ALGO but I will also add ERG.

FargusBlastenphart

One way that I think about it is those who lend or add to liquidity pools have a bit more skin in the game since it’s often more risky than just parking ALGOs in wallet for governance. It’s easy to get stuck holding bags due to impermanent loss, so there can be a bit of a commitment unless one is willing to sell at a loss. Then there’s contract risk, etc. These type of investors are necessary for the blockchain to operate smoothly though, so they need to be attracted and retained. I kind of like the idea of having incentives other than more and more ALGO rewards being pumped into the economy. I think that it makes sense, at least from a long-term holding perspective.

KevinAlexandr

Ethereum is older and hence it had more exposure than ALGO

7101334

DeFi *participants?* That's not what "the right to vote – on behalf of their users" sounds like to me, or this part: >DeFi projects will qualify for participation in Algorand governance by registering with the Algorand foundation, and by maintaining daily TVL on Algorand of at least 10M Algo-equivalent, on average over the two-week signup window for the governance period. Sounds like the protocols are voting, not the participants. If it's the participants I can somewhat understand why and I wouldn't say it's such a bad thing to discourage DeFi participation. Yes it's more risk, but if you take more risk, you have a more vested interest in the outcome of the protocol, so I'm not sure it's entirely inappropriate to give DeFi participants double voting power. But it sounds more to me like they're talking about giving "representatives" of each protocol the right to cast a vote weighted by their users' locked ALGO, then double it. That's an easy no from me.

7101334

From the new ALGO governance proposal: >Qualified projects will earn the right to vote – on behalf of their users - in the voting sessions in the governance period. Does this mean they're encouraging decentralized finance... by elevating individuals who create or represent dApps to a higher status than an average individual, and trusting them to act in the best interests of their community? Or will each DeFi protocol have its own governance vote to determine how the community vote is cast? Because if it's the former, that seems ironic and contradictory in more than one way

Wack0Wizard

bullish on ALGO

Odlavso

ALGO buy some more

Bothan_Spy

The extra step is to then withdraw your liquidity after the crash. Wait for your paired asset (ETH, ALGO, AVAX, etc.) to recover X% then deposit back in, and cash-out a bit in profits This really only gets you meaningful absolute returns if you have thousands of dollars in these kinds of pool, ideally 5 figures. I'm too poor to make money other than letting it sit

SevereCalendar7606

Yeah I have looked at ALGO. I think they will survive as well, a lot of loyal hodlers, but I don't think they are EVM compatible which means no one will fork over dapps.

UPinCarolina

I will shill you ALGO, if only because I think it will survive this bear market. ETH will too, but I think they’re in a race against time.

CointestAdmin

#Proof-of-Stake Con-Arguments Below is an argument written by MrMoustacheMan which won 1st place in the Proof-of-Stake Con-Arguments topic for a prior [Cointest](/r/CointestOfficial/wiki/cointest_policy) round. > Reusing from [my previous entry here](https://np.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/pfoke5/rcc_cointest_general_concepts_pos_conarguments/hd7dme2/). > > *Disclosure: (assuming Ethereum successfully transitions to PoS) ~50-60% of my current portfolio is in PoS coins, not including tokens that run on those chains* > > #PoS Con Argument > > Just a note that there are [lots of variations](https://www.finyear.com/photo/art/default/31320255-29572660.jpg?v=1551793721) on the Proof of Stake consensus model - e.g., [Proof of Staked Authority](https://github.com/binance-chain/whitepaper/blob/master/WHITEPAPER.md#consensus-and-validator-quorum) (BSC), [Pure Proof of Stake](https://www.algorand.com/technology/pure-proof-of-stake) (ALGO), Bonded Proof of Stake (ATOM), Delegated Proof of Stake (EOS), Liquid Proof of Stake (XTZ), Nominated Proof of Stake (DOT) etc. Different implementations have different tradeoffs, but I'll try to keep the main arguments general. > > ##Wealth and control > > - As other con arguments mention, PoS consensus favors big players and can [lead to centralization of wealth and control](https://medium.com/stakin/centralization-of-stake-in-pos-f7ccb8f8254). > > - In the absence of staking pools or delegators, the necessary capital required to self-stake (+ hardware costs) can exclude smaller participants: > > - [If you got in early, then you have a larger stake - and your position is basically guaranteed since you had a head start in earning rewards](https://www.coinbureau.com/blockchain/proof-of-activity-explained-hybrid-consensus-algorithm/#Introducing_Proof_of_Stake). > > - If you have a bigger stake you're probably in a position to hoard it, accruing compound interest and solidifying your position as a whale. > > * Airdrops are great, but if they're based off a snapshot of staked holdings ('stakedrop') then the rich get richer (some projects have tried to make [fairer distributions](https://medium.com/osmosis/osmo-token-distribution-ae27ea2bb4db), but [whales gonna do whale things](https://np.reddit.com/r/cosmosnetwork/comments/q8y550/centralization_issue_in_juno/)). > > - The bonding/unbonding periods of some protocols disincentivize participation from less wealthy users who may need to keep their assets liquid in the face of market volatility (i.e. opportunity cost). E.g., ATOM has a 21 day unbonding period. > > - Even if you delegate your stake to validators, there is a centralization of power/wealth: > > - The lack of incentive for smaller participants to be active in the voting process undermines the system's democratic intentions: > > > "[This leaves the door open for the whales to have a more direct influence over the network, especially if they are also able to take control of masses of smaller votes via proxy.](https://www.coinbureau.com/education/delegated-proof-stake-dpos/#Disadvantages_of_DPoS)" > > - Entrusting validation to a small group of participants introduces trust into the equation - delegates could form cartels making the blockchain less decentralized and less resilient to attacks. > > - Cartels aren't just a theoretical issue - historical examples include **EOS**, which has a [vote buying system](https://research.binance.com/en/analysis/eos-governance) leading to [accusations of cartels bribing an exchange](https://www.coindesk.com/markets/2018/10/04/vote-buying-scandal-stokes-fears-of-eos-governance-failure/) and **LISK** which had a [cartel](https://np.reddit.com/r/Lisk/comments/8dwwqa/delegates_or_delegateyou_decide/) likened to [the mafia](https://medium.com/coinmonks/lisk-the-mafia-blockchain-47248915ae2f). > > - Various examples of centralization on more notable chains include: > > - **ADA**: [Binance has 12% of the total stake](https://adapools.org/groups). As /u\/Eagle-Pool explained in [this post](https://np.reddit.com/r/cardano/comments/muf1ap/why_staking_your_ada_with_binance_is_a_bad_idea/): > > >"Cardano created [Enterprise Wallets](https://docs.cardano.org/en/latest/learn/types-addresses.html) that were meant to be used by exchanges that shouldn't carry stake rights. Clearly, Binance isn't using those since they've created so many pools. If they participate in Catalyst voting, they have enough Ada to make or break any project." > > - **ATOM**: [CEXs \(Binance, Coinbase and Kraken\) hold ~17% of the staking power](https://www.mintscan.io/cosmos/validators). > > - **BNB**: [21 validators and if you want to be one you'll need a minimum 10,000 BNB](https://docs.binance.org/smart-chain/validator/Parameters.html). Meanwhile, [Binance owns ~80% of BNB](https://www.coincarp.com/currencies/binance-coin/richlist/). > > - **ETH**: running your own [validator requires 32 ETH](https://github.com/ethereum/annotated-spec/blob/master/phase0/beacon-chain.md#gwei-values). [~20% of validators belong to whales and centralized exchanges.](https://beaconcha.in/charts/deposits_distribution) > > - **DOT**: would recommend the [DOT Con Argument thread](https://np.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/og2peh/rcryptocurrency_cointest_top_10_category_polkadot/) for specifics on the confusing election and nomination aspects of the governance system. [The minimum required stake needs to be higher than the least staked validator](https://wiki.polkadot.network/docs/faq#what-is-the-minimum-stake-necessary-to-be-elected-as-an-active-validator), currently [1.6M DOT](https://ipfs.io/ipns/polkadot.dotapps.io/#/staking/targets). > > - Lastly, there's also centralization to consider given validators' reliance on infrastructure providers like AWS, [Bison Trails](https://bisontrails.co/protocols/) or [Infura for ETH](https://coinmarketcap.com/alexandria/article/ethereums-infura-iating-outage-revives-decentralization-concerns) and software clients ([like Geth for ETH](https://medium.com/coinmonks/how-eth-2-0-could-resolve-the-long-running-centralization-debate-c416b394e54c)). > > > > ###Subjectivity > > - This may be a bit more technical, so bear with me. > > - There is trust involved not just when delegating to a validator, but also at a more fundamental level - how PoS nodes connecting to the network 'learn' what the 'truth' is, i.e. how to sync and validate the correct chain: > > - PoW networks like Bitcoin's are **objective**: [when a new node comes online it can determine the 'truth' based off the protocol and the history of previous blocks](https://blog.ethereum.org/2014/11/25/proof-stake-learned-love-weak-subjectivity/). > > - On the other end of the spectrum is a network like Ripple, which is **subjective**: [all the nodes are sort of doing their own thing to determine what the truth is. The network thus requires nodes to have reputation, otherwise anyone could spin up a bunch of nodes to take over](https://blog.ethereum.org/2014/11/25/proof-stake-learned-love-weak-subjectivity/) (i.e., [Sybil Attack](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sybil_attack)). > > - PoS falls in the middle, it's '**[weakly subjective](https://academy.binance.com/en/glossary/weak-subjectivity)**': [when a new node comes online it has to find someone to tell it what the truth is so it can sync up. Reliance on a trusted third party thus adds a small but non-zero amount of risk not found in the PoW security model](https://blog.ethereum.org/2014/11/25/proof-stake-learned-love-weak-subjectivity/). ***** Would you like to learn more? [Click here](/r/CointestOfficial/comments/r6voht/general_concepts_round_pos_conarguments_december/) to be taken to the original topic-thread or you can scan through the [Cointest archive](/r/CointestOfficial/wiki/cointest_archive#wiki_Proof_of_Stake) to find arguments on this topic in other rounds. Since this is a con-argument, what could be a better time to promote the Skeptics Discussion thread? You can find the latest thread [here](/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/umsqe8/monthly_optimists_discussion_may_2022/).

Xlt888

I’m a sucker for ALGO Stablecoins 

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WhiskeyTangoTrotfox

There’s so many projects in the top 25-50 by market cap that are *not* proof of work. Almost everything really *besides* BTC is not based on a proof of work model. ALGO, BNB, ADA, DOT, SOL, AVAX. The list is quite large. These all have lower fees. But if environmental conviction and concerns are at top of your mind, then I’d recommend doing research on Algorand. They’re quite mindful of their environmental impacts and are one the most eco-friendly projects.