BTC

tekmiester

Interesting you didn't even consider the Euro. But no, the energy usage, the delays in clearing transactions, the volitility, market manipulation, and the lack of accountability make BTC an impossible choice.

Effective_Engine319

Options I can see in that scenario: 1. All countries trust and/or fear China and they get the reserve status 2. Global trade fragments into 3-4 segments with a few different reserve currencies. 3. Global trust and cooperation is low and everyone is forced to use a neutral currency like BTC.

unknowngloomth

Yeah now that BTC is mainstream and is going through adoption. Its rois will be low and or insignificant for retails and that's why alts is a thing. But it doesn't mean alts will thrive the way BTC did. But still...

DV_Zero_One

People get paid to make educated guesses for this kind of thing. There is a lot of historical data and anecdotes describing how asset bubbles deflate. I work alongside a Crypto desk (I trade rate swaps and FX derivs for a bank in London) and last year they told me BTC would halve in value. Currently they are telling me it will halve again at half the prevailing speed. Between the 3 staff on the desk there are about 7; degrees and 2 doctorates. In December this desk will probably have an $20m performance bonus pot to divide between the 3 of them.

Zestyclose_Ad2462

Here's my take on self-custody: You should have some BTC in a hardware wallet, but only a small amount (say, 10%). The important part isn't how much is there, it's that you've built it should you ever really need it. Keep another 10% on a reputable exchange, 40% in an ETF using one custodian and 40% in another ETF using a different custodian. Presto - 80% of your BTC now enjoys institutional grade security. The .20 or .25 expense ratio you pay every year is money well spent IMO. Especially if you're no programmer/cyber-whiz. We are not there yet insofar as cold wallets. BTC itself takes a LOT of self-education and a cold wallet takes even more. Unless and until there's some recourse for a mistake, hack or coding error, self-custody will remain a fringe activity. We need better tools.

_alwin

I’m too European for this analysis. As if all U.S. events steer the BTC-market.

pizzeriagio

Wow, that's great! If you want maximum security buy an hardware wallet(BTC only), dice roll your seed and use a passphrase.

bitusher

Those that suggest this incident proves self custody is too risky are irrational because ~2k stolen BTC might seem like a lot but is nothing compared to the millions of stolen Bitcoin from exchanges Bitcoin is P2P currency. Storing bitcoins on exchanges, banks or web wallets makes you insecure and makes the whole ecosystem insecure indirectly by centralizing bitcoin. Bitcoin is a bearer asset with ~immutable txs unlike fiat. This means that internal or external thieves prefer to target what they can take and won't be reversed like digital fiat. Having centralized exchanges and banks store BTC makes it a desirable target for these attacks. There are privacy concerns with storing your bitcoins with third parties You are exposed to tax theft, asset forfeiture theft , civil theft You are exposed to exit theft You are exposed to the exchange refusing to support a split asset where they steal it , throw it away, or delaying a payout causing you to lose opportunity costs and profit You place Bitcoin as a whole under more systemic risk by tempting exchanges to use fractional reserve banking and giving them too much influence You potentially reduce the probability that your investment will appreciate in value because no exchanges are doing provable audits and they might be fractional. The more Bitcoin you personally control the more likely it will appreciate in value. Many exchanges will legally steal(as forfeited property) your Bitcoin if you simply neglect to log into the exchange for some time. https://help.coinbase.com/en/coinbase/managing-my-account/other/escheatment-and-unclaimed-funds **Never store larger amounts of bitcoins in a web wallet, custodian , or exchange . You own 0 bitcoins if you do not control your private keys.**

statoshi

> There has never been a soft fork that made a chain split. Right, because there has never been a failed UASF before. > We've had years of taproot and op_return with zero innovation on top already. There are several wallets that make use of taproot + miniscript like Liana and Anchorwatch. > Nobody wants to censor transactions. The entire point of 110 is to enforce the will of block space Karens upon the network to stop haram usage of the blockchain. > UTXOS need to be held in RAM to run a node Absolutely false, you have no clue what you're talking about. The UTXOs set is stored on disk and the in memory cache just stores the most recently created ones because they're the ones most likely to be spent soon. > Its literally just returning BTC to what it was a few years ago. It literally isn't; for example the consensus rule for OP_RETURN has always allowed up to 1 MB of data.

Zestyclose_Ad2462

You are right to be hesitant. So... Put some BTC in a cold wallet (with 2FA or multi-sig), keep some on a reputable exchange and put the bulk into 2 different ETF's using at least 2 DIFFERENT custodians. Your BTC is now custodied across 4 different entities, 2 of which have institutional grade cyber-security. Fidelity, Blackrock employ entire departments of cyber-security folks and have over a trillion in assets to employ the best of them. This is their sole purpose. Nothing in life is 100%. If all of your eggs are in one basket, get out NOW before you too, have your life savings vaporized.

bitusher

With a decentralized ledger its impossible to prevent spam so we can simply drive up costs . BIP110 tries to do so in a very ineffective and harmful manner that also breaks many monetary use cases of Bitcoin and encourages spammers to hide their spam more which has nasty consequences Here are 5 better solutions : 1) The best solution as I often promote is to spend and replace Bitcoin as money. This is best done on other layers like lightning that use much less blockspace, but the more people that open and close channels the higher the fees exist for spammers which will encourage them to use altcoins instead for their spam. Yes , more l2 txs reduce onchain use which is why a large focus should be on adoption overall to increase both L2 and onchain transactions concurrently. 2) The second best solution is education which I have been doing for many years where I inform people that nfts/inscriptions are scams and don't do what people claim they do and are a waste of time. Another important point of education is pointing out the fact that Bitcoin is not immutable as many spammers like to market to sell their product. 3) A third solution is we invest more in bitcoin and bitcoin adoption which raises the price of Bitcoin and since fees are priced in BTC onchain fees will grow as well pricing out spammers . 4) You can set your op_return filter to any setting you want even with corec30 or v31. My personal node is set below the default of knots . Although my pool node is best set to the default of core for better block propagation 5) Spam is just one aspect when the overall concern is efficient block usage. Core is constantly updating to insure better efficient use of Blockspace usage and reducing UTXO bloat in many ways. If you are not a developer you can also help when a company or service misuses the blockchain. Common examples: a) coinbase initially used 2 onchain txs for every withdrawal instead of 1 and also didnt use batching. We shamed them and used other exchanges until they corrected this behavior. b) Some exchanges today still don't use batching for withdrawals . Shame them and use better exchanges until they change c) Some exchanges still don't allow lightning withdrawals .Shame them and use better exchanges until they change d) consolidate your utxos and or batch txs where its appropriate . Use lightning or other l2 options as much as possible e) Shame any miner or company that uses or promotes spam and don't do business with them. Those are 5 quick solutions among many more that I actively am involved in. Suggesting solutions that don't work at all or have very harmful tradeoffs is not effective. This being said I completely support your right to enforce any rules you want on your node and even fork off. Power to the node operators. Just do so with your eyes open because BIP110 supporters and their leaders often are lying or making misleading statements .

Sacredwisp

That's why I said it's a nightmare scenario. Would need KYC, or people sharing serial numbers and such. A sizeable portion probably couldn't prove it. The issue is, if you ask people to migrate, there is a fairly high chance that some attackers would look into the code, find the vulnerability, and sweep all the funds before they can migrate. In this case, more people would likely lose their funds. In the end though, it depends on how bad the fk up is. The MK3 keys can all be cracked on a laptop within hours. For this, I'd say white hat hacking is your best bet. For the MK4+, they are still vulnerable, but it would take years. In a case like this, blaring emergency alerts to move your BTC is a better bet.

jhokujhoku

I’ve found the same thing—once an allocation hits a comfortable level, diversification starts making more sense. I still keep an eye on BTC moves, though, and platforms like BTCC are useful when I want to trade short-term volatility without changing my long-term holdings.

jhokujhoku

**I’ve found the same thing once an allocation hits a comfortable level, diversification starts making more sense. I still keep an eye on BTC moves, though, and platforms like BTCC are useful when I want to trade short-term volatility without changing my long term holdings**

_swetzy94_

I've found the same thing, once allocation hits a comfortable level , diversification starts becoming more sense..I still keep an eye on BTC moves though and platforms like BTCC are useful when i want to trade short term volatility without changing my long term holdings..

Just_Produce3769

I've found the same thing, once allocation hits a comfortable level , diversification starts becoming more sense..I still keep an eye on BTC moves though and platforms like BTCC are useful when i want to trade short term volatility without changing my long term holdings..

Just_Produce3769

I’ve found the same thing—once an allocation hits a comfortable level, diversification starts making more sense. I still keep an eye on BTC moves, though, and platforms like BTCC are useful when I want to trade short-term volatility without changing my long-term holdings.

Ireallydontknowmans

I was invested in Crypto from 2021-2025. I sold it all in the end of 2025. I dont see BTC making big gains anymore + as much as the president can manipulate and use it for corruption = im out. Been making loads of money in stocks since I liquidated my Crypto

NaiveMercury

Dude this is 100 bucks. I know you are from India, but this is a small amount even by indian standards. Stick to BTC (maybe ETH) and stocks and move on.

liquid_at

Because Wallstreet profits and by now there is wallstreet money flowing into spreading memes about crypto, just like there are about stocks. Why would people like Michael Saylor want you to believe in Bitcoin, buy it at 100k+ prices and then hold it for years? Because he likes you or because he wants risk mitigation for his fund? And once you realize that Musk-Fanboys exist for all rich people and that BTC Maxis are just monkeys who fly around billionaires hoping that they drop some coins, you undestand how BTC Maxis think. In the end it is a compeltely useless coin that has no function other than being a meme for financial firms. "Buy and Hodl" does not stop being a meme, just because you buy a billion worth...

viper2097

Closed source because you don't want people to be able to see exactly what was patched as to help keep the vulnerability secret. You can ALWAYS change your seed, You can always generate a new seed! In exactly the same way cold card users did it, You'd generate a new seed and move all BTC from the old (vulnerable) one to the new (safe) one.

Wild_Opportunity6623

Total loss how? Quantum? If BTC can be hacked, what other aspect in life can be hacked? banks? nuclear codes? credit cards? Coinbase? Wealthsimple? Or do you mean like the Coldcard hack? Their code was proven to be shit when it came to RNG. This created a huge audit with the BTC wallet manufacturers. To prove to the customers that their wallet is the most secure. And to potentially prove that a competitor's wallet is not as secure/unsecure. This is good for the consumer. Overall. Yes. I will risk my safety for freedom. If I am not willing to, I don't deserve either.

r3v3rb_1

I think of the BTC / Au debate and always come to the conclusion- “why not own both?” I think at least subconsciously, you feel the same way.

Remarkable-Opening69

Bet you said the same about BTC. Anyways, I’d rather be in the red without BTC too.

hodler1992

I have BTC

absurdcriminality

Yes, but only because it is more expensive and I am buying less with my monthly budget in BTC units than I was buying 5 years ago

praise_the_most_high

Breaking it doesn‘t make it less hack-able if it was used to generate a low-entropy seed beforehand. That will keep living on the BTC network and might still be hacked today or 20 years from now.

dende93

It's not about being "hysterical," but about being realistic and aware of the risks you're taking. Of course if your stack is like 0.1 BTC, then the chances of someone breaking into your house are quite low, so I agree that you can just ignore the risk. Kinda.

RecklessStallion9999

I think Coinbase supports BTC staking in a few countries, but it’s like 0.5% per year or something similarly low. Plus, you’re basically lending it and you’re hoping you’ll get it back.

RecklessStallion9999

Not really, if anything I’ve gone more aggressively into BTC the last 6-7 months because it feels like it’s a bargain at 50% off minimum. I may slow down when it goes up to 100k again, but not now, now’s the worst time.

cubeeless

BTC to $400k!

dvondurden

All of this is a lot more work, requires much more knowledge and comes with its own types of risk. How exactly is this "infinitely safer than any ETF"? And yes, you are essentially outsourcing this with an ETF. Low fees and high security. How would you end up empty handed in a financial crisis? It's still 100% backed by real BTC, legally yours and separated from the issuer.

t8c

Shipping and oil stocks have outperformed BTC since it fell from 120 000 USD. These stocks make more money right now so it makes sense for me financially to focus on them, like Okeanis Eco Tankers.

berepere

only operate on the fork chain with wallets that were emptied on the original chain. That is, first move your BTC to fresh new addresses. Then shove the now-empty BTC private keys into any dirty fork you like. The only problem is when there's more than one fork at the same time (and even then your BTC is safe, only the forks are exposed to each other), but that's apparently not the case here.

WorldlyCaramel3793

I think you're starting to diversify your assets since your goal was to accumulate 0.1 BTC.

ilouiei

How do you earn with BTC on coinbase?

Iamstillthinkinghard

See replies like this make no sense to me. Firstly, Luke isn't my thought leader, that's why I came here to better understand both sides of the argument. He added some pro-Christian spam to blocks back in 2011 and that's the same as the spam that's going on today? Not to mention that it happened 15 years ago. Regarding the doxxing, I'm both sorry he lost so much money and sorry he ended up doxxing people. I think you'd probably comply with the feds too if you were trying to recoup over $10,000,000 worth of BTC. None of this has anything to do with BIP-110.

AngrilyShaky

I agree, once you hit your target it can change your whole mindset. I got to my BTC goal and just let it sit on platforms like nexo or coinbase earning while i diversified into other stuff on the side. Feels way more balanced that way imo

janjaas

No - 8 years in crypto and I find myself becoming BTC maxi. I am going all-in on BTC and buying as hard as I can at the end of this bear market, then enjoying the ride to new ATHs.

Lavayo

BTC has nothing to do with a coin, except it was called a "coin" because of the cultural association of the word with money/currency. It's much more than a digital version of any fiat currency coin, we get CBDCs for that.

xtrarradio

BTC was born super ideological, with a heavy anti-establishment vibe. That BTC died a long time ago, no matter how much some people want to believe otherwise. What's left now is just a purely speculative digital coin, tightly tied to stock market moves and global economic trends, and totally absorbed into the system. Bitcoin, the real bitcoin, the one used to buy a pizza back in 2010, is long gone.

Efficient_Range1156

I was the same but not just for .1 BTC lol thank God.

PintOfBacon

I've been in and out for years and years. From 2006 ish, although I did own some breifly years before that too. I sold all my holdings around 110k usd and honestly, I'm not even bothered about entering bitcoin again anymore. The rules and regulations have changed, the tax man wants his cut. The original aim of bitcoin seems to have been achieved through its journey from 1c to $100k. It did it. It ballooned in response to fiat currency printing. It's never going to be used as money, the transaction times and fees are too slow/expensive, at least for fully on chain transactions. Nowadays there are hundreds or thousands of blockchains that are technically better for that purpose, but that's also diluted the case for any single one of them. How to pick one when there's so many. Btc has the superior security due to its sheer size, nodes, proof-of-work etc. After heavily investing in equities in the past 5 years I've learnt you can somewhat easily place objective values on a single company using its earnings, revenues, growth, moat, price, etc. Etc. But how in the heck are you supposed to objectively value a coin/token/blockchain? It doesn't really DO anything, it non producing. Sure, you can compare the BTC supply to the money supply, but.. so what? For the first in a long time, I'm over bitcoin. I've made good money over the years and I'm just not that interested in it anymore. Plus, what's more likely to outperform? Btc or "the market"? If anything bitcoin seems correlated to the market too nowadays, so it's like a russel 2000 vs qqq vs all world type argument. If they move together why would I bother with the riskiest one and destroy my portfolio? find it a difficult argument for btc nowadays. It's been great but I'm out now.

pommesUNDwurst

Depends if you are willing to gamble. I am gambling on a further drop (haven't bought any BTC yet). If it doesn't come until the start of November I am willing to accept the opportunitycost and will buy in either way (even if the price will be higher than now). Most reasonable would be to split your money. DCA weekly up until Decemder with one part. But keep another part for an eventual drop. The stupidest approach would be to wait for lower prices indefinetly.

IBAN-IBON64

Diversification. BTC SP500 ETF ARISTOCRATES ...

HeroicHeron

Would you spend USD at steak and shake? Of course not. Why spend them when BTC is at $64k when you could spend them on BTC instead and then trade them back for $100k USD in a year. USD as a currency is a joke.

blalah

Someone who cares enough doesn't need to worry about all of this. You can hold BTC via a piece of paper... from a printer tha, connected via usb, printed your private key and address. Use coinbase or whatever you want to receive BTC there. Back in the day, we'd just accrue via mining. Digital signing is where you have some open kimono going on, but you can still preplan this and prepare it offline. I've done 90% of my crypto-related interactions this way. It's time-consuming, mundane, and annoying. But ultimately, my stacks of hand written index cards have kept me safer than hardware wallets.

NoBrosCrypto

I can’t bring myself to spend BTC either. I don’t want to be the Bitcoin pizza guy.

False_Abroad_9809

I went to [coinkite.com](http://coinkite.com) and pulled up Gemini Pro: I asked "Rate the likelihood of this company that is a small company and established themselves at block 141,000 having 1000+ bitcoin stored by the founders from 1 to 100" the response was: # Likelihood Rating: 90 / 100 Based on the historical context and the specifics of the company, it is highly probable that the founders hold a very large amount of Bitcoin. # The Company in Question The company you are referencing is **Coinkite**. Founded by Rodolfo Novak (NVK) and Peter Gray, they proudly advertise being established in 2011 around **Bitcoin block 141,000** (August 2011). They are the creators of legendary Bitcoin hardware like the COLDCARD wallet, OPENDIME, and the BLOCKCLOCK.    Here is a breakdown of why it is highly likely that the founders have 1,000+ Bitcoin stored. # Why the Likelihood is Extremely High (90/100) * **Cost of Acquisition in 2011:** When block 141,000 was mined in August 2011, the price of a single Bitcoin was hovering between **$6 and $11**, down from a brief peak of $31 earlier that summer. At that time, acquiring 1,000 Bitcoin would have only cost around $6,000 to $11,000. Mining it was also still highly accessible. For tech founders diving into the space, amassing thousands of coins early on was relatively easy and cheap. * **Deep Ideological Conviction:** Coinkite is famous for being aggressively "Bitcoin-only" and deeply committed to cypherpunk ideals. The founders are hardcore proponents of self-custody, privacy, and holding Bitcoin long-term as a store of value. They fit the exact psychological and ideological profile of early adopters who would hold onto their early coins rather than cashing them all out for fiat. * **Sustained Commercial Success:** Coinkite is one of the most successful and longest-standing companies in the Bitcoin hardware space. Because their core business has been highly successful and profitable over the last 15 years, the founders likely haven't been forced to completely liquidate their early crypto wealth just to pay personal bills. * **Corporate Treasury:** Beyond personal holdings, Coinkite natively accepts Bitcoin for all its hardware products and has done so for over a decade. It is standard practice for Bitcoin-native companies to hold a large portion of those revenues in cold storage rather than immediately converting them to dollars. # Why It's Not a Perfect 100/100 While holding 1,000+ BTC (which is worth roughly $64 million today) is highly probable, it is not an absolute certainty for a few practical reasons: * **Hardware is Capital Intensive:** Building physical products requires massive upfront capital for research, development, materials, and manufacturing. During the brutal "crypto winters" (like the crashes of 2014–2015 and 2018), early companies were often forced to sell massive amounts of their Bitcoin reserves simply to keep their supply chains moving and the lights on. * **Diversification:** Even the most hardened Bitcoiners occasionally diversify. They may have chosen to convert large sums of their early Bitcoin into real estate, traditional investments, or operational fiat to de-risk their lives. Despite these factors, given their exceptionally early entry at block 141,000 and their continued dominance in the space, betting that they hold 1,000+ Bitcoin is a very safe assumption.

lobhater

Just because they accepted bitcoins doesn't mean they saved them. They likely used a service that converted BTC to fiat the moment the payment was made. They then used that money to pay rent and buy materials, health insurance, payroll, advertising, etc

Dilan57169

If you had $1m in BTC, $2500 a year is the annual cost of this ETF. Up to the individual to decide if that’s worth it.

Ok_Option_3

The simple answer is that they had bills to pay (wages , suppliers, advertising, etc) that means they would have had to sell most of their bitcoin to cover bills. You're also applying generous wishful thinking as to how many customers paid in BTC, and how long ago they received their income. There's simply no way a small company like this sleepwalks into > 5 million if assets.

BeautifulSeason8387

BTC papers is against native btc

gits-id-01

you’ve certainly worked with some dipshits if you’re lending out money with collateral you haven’t verified. I totally own 100 BTC, hook me up with a loan. What a bizarre thing to lie about on the internet, and when it’s so obvious you’re wrong.

gits-id-01

No bank is giving out a 7-figure+ with BTC collateral and, ya know, making the lessee prove they own the coin. At which point, it’s pretty obvious the coin is compromised and worthless as collateral. The entire purpose of collateral is to not be left holding the bag. 

NoBrosCrypto

The difference would be a cold wallet would cost say $200. Even if they accepted payment in BTC it would still be $200 in BTC. That $200 wallet likely stores > $1000 of BTC and likely > $10Ks. I doubt they have the funds to compensate. But who knows, maybe they have some BTC if they got in incredibly early and built a large bag.

Infinite-Ad1720

BTC only has value as long as it cannot be centralized.

Some-btc-name

Probably had their BTC on a coldcard. .

Nate_tis

Putting BTC into the hands of the people it was meant to stay out of... Although I won't pretend the ColdCard situation has got me looking into ETFs

TripTryad

That youtuber Trevon James was hilarious. Dude got SO many people caught up in that nonsense. I feel for the folks he fooled. Posting all those YT videos from expensive hotel rooms with his girl and his child. Flexing his BTC etc etc. Crazy times.

randomnegativity

Something something BTC

Acolyte_of_Swole

The fact they did the hack in the first place means they probably have a plan to clean the money. Even if they don't, there is no company backing BTC as a currency or protecting your investment when you store BTC in a wallet. Also can't you just buy from criminals with the tainted money and then sell what you bought from the criminals to legitimate customers? Basically money washing 101.

futon_potato

Here's the best part about this latest hack. Even if you *did* do everything right and were able to move before they recreated your seedphrase, if you *also* didn't have the knowhow to send your BTC with a massive fee it would've been sniped by the hackers before it got processed. How the fuck does anyone still expect this to disrupt banking & payment?

dj_destroyer

Imagine if Bob bought a Coldcard and it collided with Alice. They both think they have BTC. Now imagine one person *adds* to the wallet, the other thinks they're getting free Bitcoin. Maybe one party adds consistently and the other just sits there counting their lucky stars. Just for both of them to see it disappear in an instant.

Subject_Reward_5439

Well, I lost my word and a half BTC a couple years ago and it was terrifyingly devastating psychologically I never got over it

JeremyLinForever

The problem is that we can’t predict the future, otherwise people will generate some random dust amount for a burger in a few years if that’s the case. What we do know is throughout Bitcoin’s entire existence, the burger has only ever gotten cheaper, no matter the time frame. But, don’t let these posts have you up in arms about cherry picking time frames. Maybe don’t buy BTC and spend it on a burger today and count for yourself how much BTC you’ll have 10 years down the line as opposed to a burger you eat today. The choice is all yours buddy.

Jumpy-Assignment344

This is probably fake. No one with that much BTC would be so stupid. She says she entered her 24 words into the new wallet. I call BS. https://x.com/lunymoon13/status/2084971945070666028?s=46

Azula_In_The_AMX

He's saying if you spent BTC on food and made money on BTC today your multiplier would still be going. Saylor just did a video of how he used AI to make $15 billion more on BTC without having to give his up. But probably nothing.

Sligli

"Fuck, this new GTA 8 game looks good, maybe I can preorder it after selling some BTC"

coffeelover9457

Spot Bitcoin ETFs were approved in the US in January 2024. As of this post, BTC market cap is \~1.2T, and some estimate losses due to the CC hack at \~100M. I think these numbers demonstrate that your belief that "ETFs are the only rational option at this point" is already shared by fellow investors. I'm guessing that people who have an investment-only interest in Bitcoin used products like CC because the ETFs weren't yet available. This incident will now light a fire under such hodlers to sell and buy ETFs (I think exchange inflows since the incident hint at this). I can imagine someone in 2023, post-FTX collapse, believing (from an investor point of view) "self custody is the only rational option at this point, prove me wrong", then the ETFs arrived.

Milcah_Ganderton

That's wild, those 19 BTC would be worth like $700k+ today. Guess he got the best pizza tutorial ROI possible lol.

drwebb

I guess the point is you don't want to hold dollars since they devalue, so you want to use it to buy assets that do not (real estate, capital goods, commodities, digital assets \[i.e. BTC\]).

Ok-While-1160

Passing clarity allows massive amounts of institutional inflow into crypto, aside from ETP and pension flows. The analysis below doesn’t even account for the potential that tokenization will bring for real world asset and securities markets generally. For starters, putting asset custody, segregation, risk metrics, capital requirements, etc on exchange platforms eliminates a large percentage of the perceived risk around the industry which was garnered from the FTX/Celsius gambit years ago. Moreover, most banks currently will not use digital assets for defined banking activities in part because the law is ambiguous or doesn’t allow it, and capital metrics and accounting make doing so more or less impossible. Additionally large market makers, brokers, dealers, etc. will start to process trading in crypto assets in a similar way that they do now for other assets. This will rely in part on value generation from real world use. But we’re already seeing stablecoins, BTC and ETH be used for collateral and margining positions by CFTC regulated intermediaries. Remember crypto is 24/7 unlike tradfi. If traditional whales can make money between 5pm-9am using crypto, you bet they’ll play around. Lastly, Bitcoin has historically served as the primary gateway and liquidity anchor for the crypto market. Expanding legitimate use cases and institutional participation across the ecosystem could create additional demand across digital assets generally. A rising tide does not lift every boat equally, but greater adoption of the asset class as a whole is likely positive for the strongest networks. If regulatory clarity increases demand from institutions while available liquid supply remains relatively constrained, even incremental institutional allocation can have an outsized impact on price. This is the same basic dynamic that contributed to strong market reactions around the approval of spot Bitcoin ETPs: a new pool of demand entered a market with limited readily available supply. Obviously the caveat is that regulation alone does not guarantee price appreciation. It creates the conditions for broader participation; actual price impact depends on whether institutions allocate capital, how much they allocate, and broader macro conditions. But Clarity at least creates the market environment to drive allocation.

LuckyWinds

> We are just gonna end up holding BTC in banks, aren't we? If you've been paying attention that has been the plan all long. Hal Finney talked about bitcoin banks in 2011. But people here for some reason don't know that and act like it's some new thing.

IainKay

“How on earth could your BTC be stolen” is what a lot of people were thinking until recently. Your point about generating your own seed is valid though.

submarinefarm

There was a post from 2y ago where someone said 95% of their wealth is in BTC on a coldcard but they are considering converting to an ETF. I do wonder what happened.

H8ckt1v1st

It's not a device problem, it was an inherent issue with the entropy RNG code - which I assure you that thousands of people are reviewing that code right now as well as the patch that was pushed out to mitigate it. As a long term storage solution, I will wait to see if Coinkite folds as a company and no one picks up the codebase. Also as a hardware engineer, the ICs in the coldcard are under intense review as well for any Easter eggs/backdoors for criminal prosecution. Outside of the court of public sentiment, the device remains to be confirmed. The best thing that this incident has caused is a meticulous look at the entire self custody industry. Thanks to Coinkite, everyone is reviewing their design chain of custody and implementation protocols. For the time being, I would leave mine sealed in their OEM boxes as vintage BTC collectors one day might want one.

SaraTalbotAU

Direct swap to BTC in the app then withdraw to Robinhood is usually cheaper than the bank round trip - one trade plus one withdrawal fee beats transfer fees and a couple of days of waiting. Just check the BTC withdrawal minimum and fee on crypto.com first, and Robinhood does accept BTC deposits.

cuteman

If people transacted in BTC how would everyone get rich practicing HODL? It's a bit of a feedback loop to me... People want to get rich holding bitcoin to the moon but in order for BTC to ever become truly widespread you'd have to actually spend them like currency, not hold them, if you did that eventually you'd run out and need to be paid at BTC at baseline current market rates. It's circular

zenethics

My idea was to track the performance for people who got involved in BTC early on their non-BTC ideas. The idea here is that this might be visionaries that see trends before others do (like, maybe they get involved in AI early too). Once a company has 50%+ of NAV in BTC their performance is going to echo that of BTC. It looks like the only candidate that fits the theory is Elon Musk. Michael Saylor is great too, but in a portfolio holding MSTR goes in the "hard money / BTC exposure" bucket whereas TSLA or SPCX would fit in other buckets like "risk growth" or something and filling the other buckets was where my mind was. So, not an argument that MSTR is a bad investment or anything, more of a question of diversifying into something with good management who also have a worldview that understands BTC but whose success or failure isn't largely tied to BTC (here, the low BTC allocation is a plus not a minus - a plus because they own some, and a plus because it's not too much and I can tune my own exposure by having my own BTC proxy bucket).

Good_Extension_9642

"Luckily I only had 0.2 BTC " wtf!

BigDik6355

*OP quickly sends 0.2 BTC to his other wallet*

Ferdo306

Love BTC but this really made me laugh Appreciate it

anymonero

Nobody in DeFi talked about it because it was BTC-only. That's also the reason all those retarded maxi podcasters shilled it. Their argument always was "It doesn't support shitcoins so it means it's more secure". If there's one good thing from this hack, it's that I won't have to hear this dumb argument anymore.

Nossa30

Fuck no. I buy and hold BTC. is Crypto a currency or store of value? Just because you CAN use it as a currency, doesn't mean you should. Sure i CAN use gold to buy groceries, but the lady at the counter is not going to take my gold shavings.

EuphoricDealer4133

Hm ok. Yeah my big concern is say there’s a hack or Bitkey goes up, and we don’t have a seed phrase, how do I move the BTC out of Bitkey. Thanks!

burnt_pubes

"Hello, police. My BTC was stolen from my wallet and moved to this wallet." x 10,000. Same result

SunixKO

You are ignoring every single other thing about what happened..... In a normal every day event, sending one UTXO to another address looks very normal... But knowing that there was bad code in the ColdCard RNG, It doesn't fucking matter how they split the stolen BTC.... Many of the people who lost loads of money can prove that they bought it from an exchange... How will the hackers know what bitcoin is safe or not??? They have to mix it either way.. How can you not understand that?

cuteman

None of what you describe exists It's either MSTR or a company that holds a small portion of assets/cash in BTC or other crypto

Deto

yeah but then you have to acknowledge the fact that BTC can't just exponentially explode forever and when you do that most of the value proposition disappears.

Covid19-Pro-Max

If you generate your own seed and have the device air gapped, how on earth could your BTC be stolen? I agree that coinkite are idiots or criminals or both but I don’t understand how my coldcard could be vulnerable

blaziken8x

Let me hit you with reality. When it comes to investing it takes money to make money. Somebody who says I don't wanna do manual labor and a regular job is not for me, might already have lower chances of doing well with investing. If you want to do well with investing, you need to lower your expenses as much as possible and earn as much money as possible from jobs or any side hustle work, manual labor, whatever it may be. Earn money, then invest it. (if it were me, I'd just be buying BTC, now is a pretty good starting point, it's considered cheap) Also, realistic investing success would be, maybe, doubling your money in like 5 years, if you're looking for 100x memecoins you have already lost. You think you have nothing to lose. But really, with wrong mindset, you're losing time.

zenethics

It doesn't work for a few reasons. 1. The goal would be to track companies whose management understood Bitcoin early, not to track BTC directly (tracking BTC directly is easy) 2. MSTR's operating business is tiny to the point of being irrelevant 3. MSTR isn't even a holding company really, it's more like Saylor's hedge fund where who knows what he'll do next

Civil_Cheesecake439

The perfect card needs trust, simple fees and no weird extra steps. That’s why I’ve been using Oobit for day to day USDT spending and I am not touching my BTC because it doesnt make sense when i have USDT

New_Total_9947

I hated KYC at first too but I kind of separated it by use case. I still wouldn’t keep my main BTC stack in a card app but when I started using Oobit for USDT spending, I treated KYC as the cost of getting access to normal card rails. Not perfect but it makes sense for everyday payments

unknowngloomth

These kind of posts are fucking stupid and low IQ. "Joe bought 1k BTC back in 2009" or "jonh sold 100btc in 2010" blablablabla so what? Nobody knew BTC was gonna be a big deal, dude. I doubt that you'd have held BTC back then.. There's a bunch of alts right now with good tech such as KASPA down to 90% from its ATHs. I doubt you will buy and hold them.

IndustrialPuppetTwo

Investing can be emotionally stressful and even dangerous. Crypto makes that 100 times worse. I would suggest you look into ETFs, bonds, Index Funds and the like and if you absolutely have to be in crypto then don't gamble on anything but BTC.

East-Day-7888

I had chat gpt re-write my thoughts because I can have poor grammar and spelling, but here are my thoughts written by gpt. First, what is a Bitcoin developer? Bitcoin is completely decentralized, with no central authority that can mandate changes. Second, any security update of that magnitude would require a hard fork. What impact would that have on any legal clarity that has already been established? For example: Bitcoin Lightning, Bitcoin Cash, BTC Satoshi Vision (BSV), and Bitcoin itself. At one point, they were all Bitcoin. To make a fundamental change to the network, a new chain has to be created. With that being said, where do we draw the line when we fork the current Bitcoin into a quantum-resistant version? Which chain does that legal clarity apply to? Does it extend to every Bitcoin fork, or only one? If it's only one, who decides? Does it effectively become "Bitcoin: JPMorgan" or some other institution's version, and in doing so lose the very decentralization it was built on? And what do we do with all of the old tokens? Without a mechanism to exchange and burn them, they don't simply disappear. Are we effectively doubling everyone's holdings by creating a new token alongside the old one? Or do we force a mass migration where everyone has to sell or exchange their coins, potentially creating enormous market disruption? I'm not saying these questions can't be answered. But I have serious doubts that a government which took nearly 50 years to even recognize Bitcoin as something worth regulating can solve all of these issues in four years, especially when there is still ongoing debate over the legal classification of Bitcoin itself.

6out

BTC is self accountability... That's one of the risks but comes with the territory ... Same thing with gold in that you can hold it yourself, but then it's on you for the security of it... Kyc is retarded... It's strictly for tracking in disguise... Rich people's rules

immutable_truth

But Bitcoin devs are working on a solution aren’t they? BTC is easy to believe in bc of its history and massive chain that has withstood the test of time. Do you really think there won’t be a consensus quantum-proof solution eventually implemented? (Genuine question btw, not being rhetorical)