BTC

pablo_in_blood

Because this whole security issue is a huge deal on some level, and in different eras could have crashed the price. BTC chilling at the current price is great in the face of this type of news.

CoolCatforCrypto

Having to engage in dice rolls with casino quality die in order to set the the proper randomness security for a device that is supposed to safeguard the on-chain control of your rightful bitcoin? You really have to be kidding. Exactly 1.5% of the American population is ready and willing to undertake this absurdity to ensure 128 bit randomness of seed phrase generation. You want sovereignty? Then understand the huge responsibility in that and be willing to be left destitute by some developer clown named novak who couldn't have bothered to audit his firmware. Otherwise use a custodian - Schwab, Swan, Kraken etc. As appalling as that sounds, the btc on exchanges is still in the rightful owners' possession today. Many BTC associated with coldcard isn't. Which situation should people prefer?

Hypnot1se

That's fine. You don't have to be. I am just saying that it might be in your own self interest to 1. Consider the actual utility of BTC as a currency 2. Consider even performative understanding of how emotional people are so that they don't reject good advice because they are hurt by it I totally understand where you're coming from *and I agree with you.* I do thank you for the advice.

jasperCrow

Tbh, I trust blackrock ETFs more than most self custodial cold storage providers. And I’ve been in BTC for 10 years. I’ve just heard sooooo many horror stories. Blackrock manages trillions and trillions of dollars. I am highly doubtful they would have a security breach before I would.

Darkpriest667

1 BTC would get you the land and a nice custom house in many provinces in the PH. Part of my retirement plan is buying a house in PH for 100k thats easily twice what I own here in the US that I paid 315k for.

fan_of_hakiksexydays

So we now started having exchanges collapse, major hacks, one alt coin after another getting killed off. Are we entering that phase of the bear market again? And of course we got MSTR no longer buying BTC, even selling some, and being forced to dilute its shares. MSTR's BTC holdings are still bigger than the entire market cap of Luna and FTX at their peak.

paokara777

It looks most of the BTC in the bc1qq85v2c926eg6pgxhwp6q7lf6cnsz80qs3fcu9r has moved. Which address did the hacker move it to?

Marxbys

BTC is not Bitcoin. Right now you can buy 2 full Bitcoins for $25 and start over but this time you won’t be scammed and can own the real true authentic Bitcoin that actually works & scales to over one million transactions per second. \#Teranode BitcoinSv

Altruistic_Bee_9343

With the scenario you describe, I would contribute a little bit every month to a gold and BTC ETF on an investing platform.... assuming that is an option at all with the sanctions. Small monthly contributions also mean you don't take as much of a hit if your currency gets stronger.

KateR_H0l1day

How much cheaper is it, I'm with Chase, but use ARKB for BTC.

SaltySn0w

Also on the same page, I started my DCA a few weeks ago and planned it with two buys per week, this stretches into Nov till my total planed invest is back in BTC. As soon as it drops below 50k i go in with bigger chunks, if not i'm fine either

Western-Gain8093

If you're down 45% it's because you bought most of your coins when it was expensive. With consistent DCA your coins would average around 80k dollars/BTC and you'd be around 20% in the red, not 45%.

PropAdvisor

This sucks to hear. Consider picking up trading instead of holding. With 8 years you would probably be a professional trader. Many people make it in 2-3 years and you'd hold far more than 2 BTC. Once you learn how to trade you are set for the rest of your life.

Usur_zero

I’m almost technical illiterate in this but trying to make sense of it. So far i have a fair idea of how the true randomness or entropy of affected coldcard wallets were significantly reduced from 128-bit to 40-bit. But i still have many questions regarding how the attackers may have attacked it. Especially how this weakness was exploited by the attackers. Like, I assume the attackers must have gone through all the BTC public addresses from the public blockchain and then tried to guess its private key by making many guesses and test each of them, right? But the attackers don't know which public address was generated from a coldcard wallet right? Then how do they know which address to narrow the search space from 128-bit to 40-bit in their guessing? Or do they just apply the 40 bit-search to every address and and if the search doesn't result in anything, they move onto the next address? Or something else? And how could they test if a private key is the correct one without signing transaction?

Covid19-Pro-Max

Great option for most but I already have money in stocks and fonds and also want some outside traditional finance and I live in a country where BTC gains aren’t taxed

longReshape40

You either get rich or die trying. Either way, you'll become a BTC maxi. The BTC.D chart paints the picture better. Plus, the mythical alt season seems no more, so BTC is the way

Covid19-Pro-Max

Great option for most but I already have money in stocks and fonds and also want some outside traditional finance and I live in a country where BTC gains aren’t taxed

Open_Situation686

BTC is safe they said.

Weak-Ad-3185

Nobody commenting on how you could possibly lose your BTC if you followed proper opsec cold wallet offline and properly secured seed phrase?

evilgrinz

At least there are a ton of eyes on the bitcoin now, and people will keep looking for a slip up in the past or going forward. I'm sorry, I've lost BTC before also, it sucks.

bitusher

I do not agree with exchanges , I do agree with some less technical people using an ETF to invest in Bitcoin and have always shared this opinion Bitcoin is P2P currency. Storing bitcoins on exchanges, banks or web wallets makes you insecure and makes the whole ecosystem insecure indirectly by centralizing bitcoin. Bitcoin is a bearer asset with ~immutable txs unlike fiat. This means that internal or external thieves prefer to target what they can take and won't be reversed like digital fiat. Having centralized exchanges and banks store BTC makes it a desirable target for these attacks. There are privacy concerns with storing your bitcoins with third parties You are exposed to tax theft, asset forfeiture theft , civil theft You are exposed to exit theft You are exposed to the exchange refusing to support a split asset where they steal it , throw it away, or delaying a payout causing you to lose opportunity costs and profit You place Bitcoin as a whole under more systemic risk by tempting exchanges to use fractional reserve banking and giving them too much influence You potentially reduce the probability that your investment will appreciate in value because no exchanges are doing provable audits and they might be fractional. The more Bitcoin you personally control the more likely it will appreciate in value. Many exchanges will legally steal(as forfeited property) your Bitcoin if you simply neglect to log into the exchange for some time. https://help.coinbase.com/en/coinbase/managing-my-account/other/escheatment-and-unclaimed-funds **Never store larger amounts of bitcoins in a web wallet, custodian , or exchange . You own 0 bitcoins if you do not control your private keys.**

fugogugo

we've been doing this for more than 10 years now back in 2017, 2020 people still have faith on alt coin but now it's been proven that only BTC survive the bear market

blurred_rabbit

Sorry to hear this and props for stacking for 8 years man. I was never able to be that consistent with it even though I sat through several cycles learning that BTC goes back up. Life gets in the way so had to sell here and there. Coldcard airgapped w/ micro SD was my go to. There hasn’t been a single issue since I started using them back in 2021. It is unreal to me that there was a bug around one of the most important parts (initial seed generation). This is something you can’t just patch later on unfortunately. Thankfully for me I always did at least 100 manual dice rolls and a complex passphrase which I think saved me this time around. Only thing that would make you feel better is to consistently start stacking back in bitcoin or some other investment and as time goes on it all becomes a blur and you will feel better.

VitaminGrin

Exactly, we all come to the realization one way or another. We don’t start BTC maxis but we always end up BTC maxis.

Hypnot1se

I mean, look. You have a really solid point that I won't argue with, but, you are kind of of presenting it in a very cold way that makes you look cruel and uncaring. I don't think your delivery is very good and might use some work. People are totally responsible for their own failures, but that doesn't mean that you have to mock and belittle them for it. You can be more empathic than that, and know that not everybody has the same understanding of the technology that you do. If you have to be well informed on cryptography to be able to trust holding BTC it doesn't seem like it's going to ever be a very popular currency, honestly. If people can't just deposit their money safely and not have to go through great lengths to keep it safe I think this bodes poorly for the entire ecosystem. That said, I don't even own any BTC, so what would I know?

GodLob0

Yeah, technically, your bank can know if you cashed out a large amount of BTC if you did it via "direct bank transfer". Most people would use P2P or multiple transactions to make it more legit.

hughvr

Hey man, if its any comfort, Im the same as you: lost about the equivalent of around 3 BTC to dumb shenanigans (yeah, shitcoins) trying to--as you said it--"get there first". Around your same age, so not a spring chicken that can easily eat that loss. Now Im just set on diligently getting there. Balanced portfolio of stocks, PMs, and a small alllocation of BTC ETF. Slow and steady wins the race, I had to experience it to believe it, sadly. Its hard, not gonna lie, but strong spirits will recover. Im sure you are one.

Possible-Magazine23

Yes. But still a lot safer than many people handling it by themselves. There's nothing wrong with someone using IOU to gain a safe exposure to BTC price.

quantumdot44

Bitcoin itself does not store your private keys for you. The protocol can be decentralized while key management still has risks. Hardware wallets are just tools to protect the keys that control your BTC. The question is not Bitcoin vs third party. The question is how to minimize the number of things you have to trust.

Shoddy_Trifle_9251

Bitcoin is quantum vulnerable garbage. It's the true shitcoin. The oldest slowest blockchain in existence, and it's nothing more than a giant Ponzi scheme. The sooner BTC goes the way of VHS the better off the blockchain space will be.

Canongirl88

If you live In a third world country there’s no way you’d be having over 1 BTC sitting in a wallet. You’d have cashed it out and be living like a king.. this makes no sense

ConcernedPen15

I tried this with a contractor who ran away with customer deposits, it just led to more heartache and legal bills. All OP can do is move on with his life and perhaps find the strength to stack again. My faith has been shaken as well but wtf else can you stack? The protocol still hasn't been hacked. This really does suck but it's the fault of the vendor and to some extent the community that trusted them (which I am part of, mk4 owner here). THis is an issue with the BTC eco system but not BTC itself.

TheDigitalPoint

Do you use XRP for something (besides watching its value and hoping someone else will pay you more than what you bought it for)? It’s actually a real question, I’m definitely not a BTC maxi, but I do tend to stick with cryptos that I personally do something with.

labatte

Is your friend u/Friendly-Lettuce1 ? It's a bit odd that 2 different accounts posting about losing BTC are both mods of r/MumbaiFitGirls

TheRadishBros

Anyone who has been here at least one full cycle knows BTC is the only way.

FitCompetition1804

A $50-55k low would still be a “mildest bear ever” low from a percentage standpoint. If you believe in the cycle, which has remarkably held pretty true, BTC is going to do what BTC does to the same extent, even if it’s not as extreme as before. Now if we have an event like a huge market collapse, a significant escalation in the war, etc… we may see lows more in line with typical bear market low percentages from previous ATH’s.

Lissanro

It sounds like you forgot that Bitcoin price now and 10 years ago was different. Given the same salary it would be much harder to save over 1 BTC in the next ten years than previous ten years.

TheRadishBros

BTC doesn’t need the clarity act to succeed

tjackson_12

BTC is 👑 just accept it

Calm_Recognition_940

8 year BTC holder 1st time poster

Zelma_de_lafe

How did you get your BTC in the first place?

Gooner_93

All of this is hindsight. Prior to the draining, people wouldve said having a cold card and generating the 24 word seedphrase, wouldve been sufficient. People wouldve been giving credit to someone for saking that step to self custody their BTC. Like I said in a previous post, this has sent shockwaves through the self custody space. Of course the rules have now changes. Dice rolls/passphrases/multi-sig. You can expect people to be using one or a combo of these, from now on. Passphrase is the easiest one.

K2P2C

If BTC ETF gets hacked, every BTC holder through self custody, exchange or ETF itself have a bigger problems my friend.

Nago31

This wasn’t playing the odds and losing a percentage of it. This was a hack that wiped them out. It’s not really that different than him talking her into buying gold bars and then their house being robbed. The price of BTC going to the moon would change nothing about the situation.

99999999999999999989

That's still bullshit. The blockchain did not get hacked. The RNG for the ColdCard had very bad code on it. Instead of 2^256 they had 2^72. That is not a failure in BTC nor the blockchain. I will still exercise self custody 100%.

Ok-Sympathy9768

I believe in the idea of bitcoin, but I have trusted GBTC and the ETFs more than I trust myself with remembering passwords/ pass phrases. There is a reason why 1 in 5 coins ever mined have been lost forever, or stolen. BTC self custody is too complex for a vast majority of people . The real security vulnerability is the people doing their own self custody. The risks associated with self custody is the issue that has kept bitcoin from mass adoption..it’s complexity and self custody security are it’s limitations How does bitcoin ever get to a point of being truly safe and secure with self custody, and at the same time where you can spend your bitcoins freely to make every day purchases without worrying about losing or getting them stolen, and having your stack drained?

quintavious_danilo

Diversifying wallets is a bad idea. Look, I was unharmed by the ColdCard attack because I don’t use their services. If I had used them to diversify my funds, I now would have less BTC than before. I believe in a single device, properly set up, creating your own seed and a good entropy passphrase.

00WORDYMAN1983

You put every dime you have into BTC?! Sucks it got stolen, but damn....you put all your eggs in one basket. Never a good idea.

anymonero

If it was converted to L-BTC the Liquid federation could seize it. But whoever did the attack wasn't smart. Why put all the stolen outputs into one address?

thats_gotta_be_AI

That would reflect their idea of buying property with 2BTC. Sounds actually realistic.

brandnewmoo

Why not grayscale BTC mini trust etf since it’s cheaper?

quintavious_danilo

I mean I agree that they were lazy but unnecessary? BTC is a digital asset. You need a middleman to store it safely, how else would you store your coins without a wallet?

reddituserVibez

LMFAOOOOOOOOO exactly the same thoughts.. i read the post from the Indian dude with 1,XXX BTC with salary a YEAR of 300$ … sure bro, sure

deadlock_jones

I paid 100€ for 0.15 and received around 0.11 back I think in 2024 + BHC and few hundrd in fiat. I think it was around 66x increase in value at the time with BTC alone, but that includes the part that was lost.

Forded_Fiction24

We have them accessible with a ROTH ira here, which means no taxes on capital gains. Imagine what that could mean if Bitcoin goes to $1M or $5M in another few decades. This is why I hold BTC on a wallet and own IBIT and FBTC within my Roth. Have a huge tax advantage in the Roth account

Adamn27

>not a regulated spot ETF trading on the NASDAQ. Very different  True that. I have one problem with ETF, in my country it has bigger taxes compared to holding spot BTC. Stupid? It is, but it is what it is.

Legitimate_Stuff_347

I just diversified by BTC, some on hw wallets, some on sw wallets, some on exchange, some on metal. That I wont be losing all when some shitty thing happens with one of those

Gooner_93

Absolutely devastating. This has definitely sent shockwaves through the self custody space. How could a company have be so lazy when it comes to security, that people used to protect millions of dollars in BTC? Which company is gonna be next? Is a passphrase really secure enough, when people thought their 24 word seedphrase on coldcard was secure? What is going to be the next bug that costs people their life savings? My crypto is still there, in a wallet, created on a different device than coldcard but I still dont feel safe right now.

Fearless-Sherbert-40

I’ve been DCA’ing on Cash App for year. There’s no fees on auto buys, keep the change, and direct deposit into BTC. Also when you transfer .001 or more to a cold wallet, you pay no fees. I have used all the platforms, exchanges, I’ve had lots of hardware wallets, I always go back to Cash App. Looking into a bitkey now with a multi sig setup and inheritance planning.

unvac

Given that an exchange can close your account and keep your money, claiming you broke TOS without specifying which TOS you broke or providing you with the opportunity to prove otherwise is just as bad as having your wallet drained. ACoinbase is a prime example, as they will and can close your account, keep your funds, and do not have to explain why. They did the same thing to me, taking $100,000 in Bitcoin. They even transferred my Bitcoin to a personal wallet for 8 months while my account was closed. Fortunately, in the UK, we have an ombudsman; Coinbase shit themselves when I contacted them, along with my lawyer, and was given 72 hours to withdraw all of my funds. When I logged in, I discovered that they had withdrawn and redeposited my BTC. Look at their Trustpilot reviews; it happens regularly.

True-Lychee

A black swan event would have nuked the price immediately. BTC barely reacted - in fact it's hard to say it did at all because there were other catalysts unfolding like Iran, a US bond yield revolt and the fact we're in a bear market.

Josh0G

(Don’t hold BTC, forgive the ignorance) Is there not a way to add 2FA to a wallet cold or otherwise preventing transactions? I’m sure there is a reason people can’t have such a feature to quash any unwanted transactions or it would’ve been implemented.

Dry-Orchid3696

Can someone help me understand what has happened ? I have been looking into BTC and now unsure if I should buy.

EuphoricDealer4133

Fair. All this has me rethinking where to store my BTC. Currently use Blockstream Green. Multisig and 2FA

boycottsocialmedia11

Same concern, different cycle. Next top everyone will be buying and saying they will become millionaires overnight. You must either understand the cycles or invest only in traditional assets. I am not, by any means, expert on technical analysis but when BTC dipped from 120k to 90k and was asked if it was a good time to buy my answer was that I believed it would go down to the 40-60k range before bouncing back. It might drop even further, who knows? This ain't for those faint of heart. I do believe in BTC long term (and I am talking about a minimum of 10 years from now) but I also know it's volatile and I wouldn't put more than 15% of my wealth on it, it's all about balancing your financial strategy (crypto, stocks, real state, etc).

Clear_Item_922

I do remember a product that I saw by BTC sessions which was basically a pot with all 2048 words in it. All you had to do was pull 24 words out like a raffle. I think a human could probably choose 24 random numbers linked to the words better than the randomiser of software.

EuphoricDealer4133

All this has me rethinking where to store my BTC lol

tenor_tymir

What does a software bug which caused weak entropy has to do with the very fundamentals of BTC? I’m slightly confused. 🤔

AreaFifty1

You're probably did well. After this whole coinkite fiasco BTC will plummet some more. And I think from there the public's view on Bitcoin is toast..

LevelStationaryPlane

The time lost is worse than the BTC lost CMV.

Longjumping-Dog-6852

This Coldcard hack is a great topic for the karma farmers. This is the third 38 year old that has >1.5BTC stolen I've read about here in the past 5 minutes.

sumtib

I'm realistic, WTF else he could possibly do to have his coins back? It's over. Only way is work more and he still believes in BTC then save again but with proper F care this time using a F passphrase and multisi, can't believe people put their life saving in this shit and didn't take security seriously, there is no CEO you can call and fill a complain here.

Apprehensive_Page_48

There is no way they can cover these losses: however,BTC is traceable

Affectionate-Ebb2283

man that’s a heavy loss, can’t imagine waking up to that kind of gut punch. the cold card thing messes with my head too cause everyone swears by it and then you hear stories like this don’t throw in the towel on everything just yet. maybe step back from crypto for a bit, let the dust settle, but 2 BTC is years of discipline and sacrifice and that doesn’t just vanish from who you are whatever you decide next, hope you give yourself some grace. not your fault some slick thief found a crack in the armor

SpontaneousDream

Not sure why you're being downvoted. BTC is a must, for obvious reasons. HYPE also is a must given how much revenue + buybacks they do along with clear PMF. BNB is okay but looking at the BNB/BTC chart isn't too great- seems like it peaked Oct 2022 and has been trending down since then, although you could argue that since June 2023 it's been somewhat stable...my issue with BNB is that HYPE is continuing to eat pretty much all of Binance's market share at an insane pace.

Powerful_Quarter691

BTC is not dead and at the moment there is no hype, sentiment is pretty low and it will get even lower after this coldcard mess...people often tend to forget that cold wallet is not a guarantee safekeeping by itself thus the saying not your seeds not your coins, and this whole mess could be easily avoidable if people used a passphrase.

SuspiciousMix31

BTC still didn't change, just saying.

Remarkable_Check_997

>Federal interest rates can change and impact your capital. True inflation can outpace 5%. Yeah, and BTC can lost 5 times is value, or someone can be hacked. Nothing is perfect, but still, OP was millionaire and he isnt now. Whatever how we look at it.

Remarkable_Check_997

>The dollar is going to zero, that's far riskier. Yeah, we just seen how the BTC is far more secured.

Baseic

How can they get caught? I thought Monero had complete privacy. I'm honestly interested to learn about this. Why can you not DEX Swap BTC -> Monero -> BTC to a fresh wallet -> Offramp Sure, you end up with a bunch of millions you cannot explain to the authorities, but as I understand it, there's no way to trace that this came from this specific hack.

zante2033

Been through Mt Gox and the most concerning pattern of behaviour I see is zero change in talking points and a massive deficit in technical literacy among people who consider themselves savvy. Big money is getting out of BTC, any hype you see is funded to provide an exit ramp for those organisations. Any effort to spur adoption in third-world countries is with a view to inflating value in an unregulated environment with zero liability. Massive changes are coming to standard encryption-based protocols over the next few years because of how vulnerable systems are going to be to AI, photonics and quantum computing. The chain cannot be upgraded without forking and when wallets start getting drained on chain, any nuance won't matter, confidence will be gone for at least a decade.

Omaha_Poker

I know this isn't much consolation but I lost 1 BTC to the whole Celsius fiasco. It still often plays on my mind and I did get a little recovery. You just can't let it get to you. Hopefully other opportunities will arise. Sorry for your loss. 

Captain_Lou_Albano

The practical problem with your thesis that BTC is "the future of money after all" is that there are precisely ZERO people world-wide who actually use BTC like they do currency or even credit cards.

flannel_jackson

If BTC is only held in ETF wrapper and not actually transacted it’s value verges on zero.

eyesofthewhitewolf

The first time I purchased BTC was at a bitcoin ATM inside a Walmart. Fees totaled up to about 20%. Steep

Objective-Walk6780

Just stay out of BTC and get a CD with CHASE. Thats as safe as it gets

MedivalBlacksmith

Not to 85 necessarily, if he starts to drink he don't have to work to that age. I know the feeling of losing BTC. Lost around 15 BTC years back.

Blade_Runner_69

Fun fact the UK governments BTC holding is predominantly from seizures! They have hardly bought any just stole it, or claimed it from Ill gotten gains. Modern day British piracy is real!

skydiver19

Totally agree. This is why financial advisors need to be licensed. People have no place influencing others to by BTC under the guise they know what there doing trust me bro

skydiver19

This is precisely why people need to mind their own fucking business when it comes to telling people how they should invest their money when it comes to BTC and bang on and preach about it. More so them who tell other you should self custody. What might be each for you and technically ok with, that isn’t the same for others, and people make mistakes and mess up ie lose their seed, forget things etc etc Honestly this whole thing about having to convert people “ orange pill them “ is not only pathetic but irresponsible. There is a reason why you need to have licences to be a financial advisor.

asherlevi

An individual should not be carrying 100K plus on cash all the time. There is something wrong with BTC self-custody and the endless defense of it by BTCers just makes the community look idiotic.

Slimfictiv

Oh , wait and see the "get a loan to buy BTC" guys. Where are they now?

HedgeHog2k

I think in this case, BTC does mind.. the very fundamentals of it’s purpose are just invalidated.

Objective-Walk6780

This is 2026. I know Coinbase holds Blackrock’s BTC. Same thing. And yes if you think an ETF is safer for you, by all means buy those. Thats why it was created in the first place. Personally, I’ll just use a very strong seedphrase and not put all my eggs in Bitcoin.

Winston_Sm

Same here. Should have nuked it all last ATH. Moves retirement up considerably. Could sell now as well and be golden, but I'm also greedy with BTC. Next pump I'm out

HedgeHog2k

BTC IS better then banks, that’s not even up for debate. Every day people get scammed out of their funds with refunds from banks. I’m still a “btc fanboy” like you call it…

OldHamburger7923

I've been in BTC since 2010. Everyone I know who holds from that period rolls their own. Reddit is filled with morons. If you look at discussions from lat week or prior you will see tons of people saying don't use passphrases because it adds complexity.

Big-Finding2976

Well I got BTC stolen by Cryptsy and didn't get anything back because I couldn't prove what I had on Cryptsy. So it would have been better for me if it had been in my hot wallet, which has never been hacked.

kachurovskiy

Some folks have mentioned using leveraged BTC futures - I think that would be a far inferior strategy since there's a liquidation and holding price on top of crypto commissions. With MSTR, there's none of that.

sharkboy450

Who would insure BTC transactions given the increasing vectors of attack and the rise of cheap AGI?