BTC

TurnAr0und2

Unless were time traveling to 2012 I think the hype train has come and gone for BTC even if it goes to 200k which it won’t anytime soon enjoy life buy that car and practice semen retention peace love and tranquility

Suitable_Acadia_190

Strategy buying is not a price catalyst. It is a demand floor. Saylor does not time entries. He accumulates on a schedule regardless of structure, which means this tells you nothing about where price goes next. What it does tell you is that the supply being absorbed at this level is not coming back to market at a loss. 845,000 BTC held by a single corporate entity with a stated policy of never selling is a structural fact, not a sentiment signal. The more interesting number in that post is the $1.0 billion USD reserve. That is dry powder, staged and ready. The buying is not done.

Ok_Computer1417

It’s widely assumed that he’s trying to build to be THE Bitcoin treasury. He can borrow against with BTC as the collateral and the underlying asset growth can essentially give him negative interest rates. Alternatively he can loan the BTC and the underlying asset growth can be far more lucrative than normal rates.

HughHonee

This is probably still my favorite playout that I've seen. Not mine, but I've followed it since it came out, zoomed out looking at it big picture its pretty solid https://www.tradingview.com/chart/BTCUSD/Ce2BvgDu-BTC-Wave-Harmonics-within-the-Nile-River-and-the-Prophecy-of-Ra/

submarinefarm

Sure he does. If I had 8 BTC I simply would not be wasting my body doing electrician work 😅

joatmone

Swing Trading! BTC

Strange_Mud_8239

Not just that. Offer a 5% tax discount if paid in BTC

aferaci

Because they don’t understand that the whales manipulate the market down so they can buy low. They want instant gratification and that’s not how investing works. They seem to still believe that someone can become a millionaire by making a very small investment in BTC. Those days are long gone and most all of us missed out on that.

JOSS_KOLDOP

Compra en 80.000, en 50.000 o de 30.000. Dentro de 10 años seguro será un x8. Está en la naturaleza de BTC.

No_Toe710

Take the loan at say 50% LTV then use a portion of proceeds to immediately pay down loan to 40% LTV. If the loan has a liquidation LTV of 80% then you are now safe from liquidation down to a BTC price below $32k. This assumes you do not use all of the proceeds to buy more BTC today. Then turn around and over collateralize the loan. If you did this, then your 40% LTV loan would be safe down to a BTC price below $23k.

Dazlik

If you want to mine BTC, your best bet would be cloud mining. I myself am with the platform gomining . com. They have been on the market for over 5 years. I myself have recovered my initial investment and am just cruising now. If you have questions, you can contact me directly The best thing you can possibly use is to start a bit small. Make sure to use my code for a 5% off your first miner. WTW703N otherwise, start small, see how you like it and then proceed. I have a 1500th farm and I am very happy with gomining

Smooth-Limit-1712

Wow, that's a seriously huge BTC move to share! Someone's making some big plays out there with that kind of capital. Always fascinating to see these strategies unfold and how they impact the market. Good looking out, man!

DankgisKhan

We shall see. In my opinion, it is borderline impossible for BTC to see an mcap above 3-4 Trillion. But we will see.

xtremeironings

It was very hard to mine in 2014. Unless she mined alts and then sold for BTC, she probably mined nothing. You need to find the pool she signed up for and exchanges she used etc. look at her emails during that year

FunWithSkooma

what principle? anyone can buy BTC, there are no permission needed.

LiquidityCompass

Wouldn't creating a Strategic Bitcoin Reserve be a much bigger catalyst? Accepting BTC for taxes is interesting, but a government becoming a long-term buyer and holder of Bitcoin seems far more significant. One changes payment options. The other changes demand.

ShittingOutPosts

I hope you realize you wrote five paragraphs against a claim I never made. I said dumping my alts for BTC was the right call. That became "every country will run on a Bitcoin standard" somewhere in your own head, and you spent the whole comment swinging at it. That's a fight you picked with yourself. The security budget part is the bit you think makes you sound smart, so slow down. You heard that fees eventually replace the block subsidy, didn't follow it, and landed on "so the 21 million cap is getting changed." Those are not the same thought. One is a real question about the fee market. The other is something you invented and then congratulated yourself for. The cap holds because the difficulty of breaking it is a major aspect of why the whole thing even exists. That refusal is the product. You're pointing at the foundation and calling it an artefact of a formula. "An asset that's already mostly distributed." Read it back. By that logic gold never worked, land never worked, nothing scarce that someone reached first ever worked. You didn't think it through. You liked the sound of it. C’mon man. Antonopoulos wrote about the code. Ammous wrote about money. Recommending the second one isn't joining a cult, it's reading something relevant to the conversation. One can enjoy reading from both authors. I merely recommended The Bitcoin Standard because it’s easier for beginners to understand, and provides a solid foundation. Your comment history line is what people grab once the argument already got away from them. Answer what I wrote instead of where I wrote it.

MotanulScotishFold

To me this is Bullish as if the demand for more BTC will continue and hashrate going down, it only increaes the price of the current circulation of BTC due to scarcity.

Tw33die84

I'm far from a crypto expert and mostly reside here for the lols. But it seems wrong to me that one person, company or entity should own so much BTC. Sure, anyone can buy anything if they pay enough and people are willing to sell.. But I dunno. Just seems wrong somehow. Against the principle thst BTC was built for? I'm probably wrong tho.

Pal3-Assignment

Nahh, just look at BTC down 40% and Nvidia is up 45% in the last year. I suppose you could say crypto is bolstering AI from smart money leaving crypto and pouring into AI because that is the new hotness like my comment said.

I_Like_Tartar_Sauce

Guy tanks the market by selling a tiny fraction of his BTC stash, then buys more at a lower price. 🤷‍♂️

-M00NMAN

BTC sub 40k Q4.

cepheids

There has been flash crashes that were only survivable with LTV < 13% - Binance BTC crash in 2021 for example. So, I guess it depends on your definition of conservative.

Fluffy_Connection644

I thought 1BTC = 1BTC. Why are you talking about fiat? Bag holding?

goofygooberxiv

I see BTC I buy BTC simple as

Rafiki_84

BTC will drop to 52-53k around 09.10.2026 and it will be the bottom. Waiting for date to buy. Same old shit.

ShitcoinJoe

Yeah I think so. But I see it as a gamble, better buy BTC (but he asked for alts here)

jkeegan123

They can't afford to be invested. In anything. And that's fine, life is hard... But they should admit that they can't afford to be invested, sometimes expenses exceed the ability to invest for a short time, there is a season for everything... Including BTC.

Fabulous-Stick-973

I got a friend that bought 5 BTC at 33K average cost - sold at $102K to buy his house - then for a brief moment cursed at himself when it topped $120K plus. These days he's been grinning ear to ear as he been buying back in mid 60's. Lesson to be learned ... timing your life is better at times then timing the market.

Squirrel_McNutz

Not sure if sarcastic but yeah, I legit think Hype is one of the only valid cryptocurrencies. It has legit revenue & usage which almost no other crypto has. At this point I’m pretty much only BTC and Hype. Some eth & sol I’ve been holding and will continue to hold but I’m not interested in buying more.

TheGreatCryptopo

Sells 32 BTC tanks the market with piss soaked paper hands folding like Trumps diapers and panic sell. Buys back cheaper a week later. Rinse and repeat.

alwxcanhk

Bitcoin is supposed to represent freedom to buy, sell, keep, transfer, give, … etc without anyone asking why. I have BTC and I have bills and prefer to sell now and settle than go to jail. It’s my BTC.

HSuke

It would be cheap if they had used cash reserves to buy it. Instead, they used up their cash reserves to pay back a 0% loan prematurely last month, and then used more MSTR to buy less BTC.

whetherwhether

MSTR usually buys their BTC early in the week and BTC was crashing all through last week, especially into the weekend.

Educational_Cable405

Happened to me on r/btc a few years back. Posted a chart showing BCH bleeding against BTC and it was gone in maybe 20 minutes, flagged as concern trolling. One thing I learned the hard way: screenshot your own post before you put it anywhere near a coin's home sub, because the removal log is private and you'll never actually get told why.

Mister_Way

The narrative that the whole market collapsed because Saylor sold 32 BTC was always obviously a highly regarded narrative.

DankgisKhan

BTC last peaked at an mcap of 2.4 Trillion, or roughly the market cap of Amazon. To get BTC to 200k, we need something in the neighborhood of 4 Trillion dollars, or about 10% of the NYSE. These are gargantuan numbers. Plenty of room for growth? We're talking about something with no industrial value that somehow managed to achieve a market bigger than the GDP of several industrialized nations combined. There is far more downside risk than there is for growth. The sky is not falling. Crypto will always be around, but I think people are really underestimating the downside risks and overestimating BTC's value in the global financial marketplace.

Own-Huckleberry-1853

**Strategy (MSTR) just bought 1,550 BTC today! If you know you know…**

ShittingOutPosts

Reading The Bitcoin Standard. Converting all of my alts to BTC was the best decision I’ve made in this space.

Fine_Employment_3364

If you're looking to buy BTC, ask yourself why. Nobody is buying it to use as actual currency. The answer is always to sell it for more at a later date. This is why BTC is just a speculative asset at this point. The Greater Fool theory. We've seen how it behaves every 4 years. No surprises coming. The days of Making 10x by holding is over. It's a failed currency. Hell yeah you can still make some profit trading it, but you are not getting rich off it.

BakedGoods

they sold $181Mill of MSTR, with that they bought $101Mill of BTC and the rest ($81Mill) + other cash was added to their reserve.

Blackiris-Code

BTC reads your mind!

HSuke

How does buying BTC increase their cash reserve at all? It cost them more to buy now than before when MSTR price was much higher.

ThisIsNotDre

Bitcoin is only free from such rtlegulations if there's an actual BTC marketplace. That basically hasn't existed since Bitcoin actually became a high value asset, other than like wallet swapping to Monero for special markets, any "crypto" purchase is basically just being handled in fiat at the end point. The era of sending someone hundreds of Bitcoin for a pizza is the closest it was to actually serving its original purpose.

Scarab702

Yes!!! BTC never goes in a straight line. Whether up or down. We're in a bear market. Lower loading. How low? No one knows exactly.

MuscularFrog13

It’s more so I’ve noticed boomers are more prone to not listen to advice from younger people and more prone to extreme arrogance. All of 2016 and most of 17 i was telling my coworkers to buy BTC. One boomer said I’d “lose all my money and have to be a Walmart greeter”. Another didn’t buy until(against my advice) the ATH in 2021 was reached and then sold in 22 for a massive loss. Again, against my advice. The second one is bitter about his losses and swore off BTC, like it’s bitcoin’s fault he lost money. Even at 2021 ATH he would have nearly doubled his money if he held until 25. They have no resolve in an asset that requires conviction and faith in its fundamentals and concepts.

FitCompetition1804

No, because I had a very small position that I bought in 2022 at $18k when I didn’t know much about BTC besides knowing that was going to be a great point of entry to test things out. Sold about half a few years later to see how that worked. I then actually educated myself last year and have been waiting for this bear market to enter. I started DCA’ing in February and have a decent amount of cash ready for limit orders starting in the low $50k range and working down, with orders getting larger as they descend. I self custody now in cold storage and run my own node, this is the year I’m actually accumulating. No regrets, except for wishing I started this earlier in prior cycle bear markets. Hoping for at least a full coin by the end of the year. If it dips well into the $40k range, maybe 2 or close to that. I’m holding for at least 15 years with no intention to sell.

DankgisKhan

Man, no government is printing the tens of trillions of dollars needed to sustain 2-3x all time highs for BTC again and again. We will be lucky to get one more big wave that takes BTC to 150-200k, but that will require Wall Street going gung ho on crypto and that's just not probable for the next 1-3 years. I'm bullish on crypto, but to think that BTC will see new ATHs of 250k, 500k, 1M.. it's just unrealistic. It needs to stop somewhere.

Dominicchon

I think the security concern is probably the strongest argument. A lot of Bitcoin DeFi has depended on wrapped assets and bridges, which add trust assumptions. But if new use cases can be built around native BTC without changing Bitcoin itself, I don't necessarily see that as conflicting with its role as sound money.

Drumroll-PH

You can swap USDT to BTC using decentralized swaps like THORChain-based services or through P2P platforms like Bisq, though they take more time and effort. Some people also use DEX routes like USDT to WBTC then bridge to BTC, but that adds extra risk from smart contracts. I’ve tried both CEX and non-CEX routes before, and the main tradeoff is convenience versus control, so pick the one you actually understand fully before moving funds.

Dominicchon

That's fair, but I also think a lot of use cases need the right infrastructure before demand can really develop. Fifteen years ago, most people weren't using the internet for banking or streaming either. Today there are projects exploring new ways to use native BTC as collateral or access liquidity without having to sell it. Whether those ideas gain traction is another question, but I think it's worth letting the market decide rather than assuming Bitcoin's only possible role is as a passive store of value.

MrRoidsen

Why someone would invest in MSTR instead of just buying BTC?

MuscularFrog13

Generally most boomers I’ve known that have bought BTC love to greedily buy high and panic sell low

BakedGoods

this looks awesome. one thing: would be nice to have (i) mouse overs for each term. for example beside BTC Dominance, Hash Rate, Epoch Progress, etc. I generally know what these are but a mouse-over tooltip would be nice.

t0m0hawk

Shit is crashing? BTC is still at 63k checking in right now. Shit is *correcting*

ChangeHeroOfficial

5 years of chaos, BTC is still standing. That's the answer.

Ge_Yo

I think a lot of Bitcoiners worry that new use cases eventually lead to more trust assumptions and unnecessary complexity. At the same time, protocols like Babylon are showing that native BTC can do more while staying true to Bitcoin's core principles.

Scared-Metal9294

Lummis personally holds both BTC and ETH and continues to receive funding from crypto lobbyists.

Real-Technician831

Take a look at BTC chart and see how brief the peaks are. Most of the time BTC ROI is rather shitty.

jgarcya

Good question.. I don't.... I save cash years three and four.... To lump sum at the start of the new cycle. Since I don't sell most cryptos... And since I only buy the first two years... I am always in profit. . I just ride the highs. By the time you are two cycles deep .... Actually it only takes one cycle... It is very unlikely BTC will ever drop below your first two year average . Any chance you get to lower your average cost... Would be a buying opportunity... But by year three of the cycle, that rarely happens. Diversification is the ideal... I set up a long term hold, self care wallet..... And a trading wallet for alts. You don't always need to be buying BTC... Esp when every cycle it loses 70-80% from its new Ath. It's just about faith in the asset and patience... Let the newbies make the mistakes. Once you are aware of the cycle .... You'd be foolish not to use it to your full advantage. Cycles are the way to invest .. but you need to be cash rich to take advantage of the panic from sellers... That's why you save years three and four.... And lump sum at the start of the new cycle... Then dca yrs one and two... Or only buy if it lowers your average.

BakedGoods

well yeah, the DCA approach is the best, i've been buying every two weeks for years. timing the tops and bottoms is hard, but the power law gives you a range of prices bitcoin could be at in 20xx. so if you buy 1 BTC right now ($63K), and want to see what the lower-band price would be in 2040, it's be worth $1.6MM. overall it could be worth anywhere between $10MM and that $1.6MM. so if $1.6MM is a good enough return for you then the rest is just gravy.

Siludin

I don't get it - why not just buy a BTC ETF instead of this stock? Please explain me very dumb

FloralSunset2

Which ETH projects in big banks? I have not heard of any. With the rest of your BTC analysis I agree. Bitcoin is vapor, cool idea by tech people 15 years ago but no fundamental value is there.

Ok-Astronaut4952

These days it’s really not that big of a deal. Think about how insignificant the amount of bitcoin being mined daily is now, especially after the next halving. Saylor alone already buys more than like 5 times as much BTC per day as is being mined per day. These tiny amounts of BTC have like no impact on the actual circulating supply. Now that the market is so huge mining is just not as big of a thing anymore. The market has just gotten so big. There’s a reason why almost all miners have switched to doing AI stuff

HSuke

> buy cheap Buy expensive. They're buying with MSTR, not cash (and MSTR price dropped harder than BTC price).

Ge_Yo

For me, conviction comes from understanding why a project might still matter five or ten years from now. That's why I'd still start with BTC and ETH, but I'd also want exposure to projects like QANX that are building around long-term challenges such as post-quantum security.

Blackiris-Code

Funny. BTC is my smallest investment and my biggest loss so far. SOL is where I get my profit 😂 (I'm using both long and short)

dj_destroyer

I thought you meant Bitcoin but your argument is even weaker for Strategy. Google just issued more stocks, is it a Ponzi? The company with near infinite cashflow just raised $80B more... why? Convertible debt is at least safer than just issuing new stock. Also, I would suggest listening to Strategy's latest earnings call if you truly think that. Strategy is certainly a leveraged Bitcoin acquisition vehicle using public capital markets but there's nothing wrong with that as long as they're creating shareholder value (which for them is more BTC per share/increase BTC yield).

Upbeat_Aside_9203

I’m no expert but my feeling is lower, quite a lot lower, is coming. 45k is my bet. Nothing is changing right now to stop the fall. SPACX has not yet launched. No pun intended. Cash is going into that. Once the traders finish with that, and other rocket / AI offerings, they’ll scan for the next thing, likely BTC.

ThePugz

I do daily recurring buys. I by 1% of a BTC every 20 days. If it drops more rapidly I have reserves to buy larger chunks. I highly doubt it’s going down to $50K (and definitely don’t think there’s a chance of $40K) There’s a ton of support at $60K. As soon as it gets there the buyers come flying in. Barring something major I’d guess that this is just a retest of the bottom. But no matter what I just keep buying.

BertInv1975

Wait till the forced selling at Strategy of 840K BTC, let's see what the price does then 😄

braamdepace

If BTC is a scam what do you think about Currency?

HSuke

Saylor has control of it. He has 90% of company voting and how to manage their BTC. Retails shareholders have no control.

Proof-Conference-765

So dumb You can trade futures and double your money Sooner than BTC can double At 60k. Retail can not afford. .0025 not going to add up

Azoloutre

Tes ordinateurs quantiques rendront ta banque tout autant voir encore plus obsolète. J’espère que tu as vendu tout tes BTC et liquider tes comptes pour acheter de l’or physique.

zeehkaev

He basically raises it from investors. Literally offers new, freshly minted MSTR (his company) stocks, and invest in BTC. Investors think when bitcoin recovers, MSTR will either grow accordinly or grow more.

Alz_Dee

What's the play though? Own it all and it becomes worthless or hold so much that sell any and it becomes worth less? It's not like he can sell everything he holds for its current "worth". Thats what I don't get. What he holds is X amount of BTC currently worth $Y but try and sell it and the price tanks and $Y then = a shit load less

FitCompetition1804

With the costs to mine and secure the network, BTC dies if it normalizes at $1k. I agree volatility is an issue, but the swings on its way towards its upwards trajectory are become less and less each cycle.

setokaiba22

Difference would be that’s actually used by major governments and businesses daily - Bitcoin not so much to be blunt. And I hold BTC but just realistic

CaltonSmith

If BTC is cash every good is.

SeriousGains

Now imagine he sells 33 BTC…

swordfishy

How does selling 32 BTC affect the market by 15%, but buying 42x that amount only boosts it ~5%? Thinking that they are the reason the price dropped is impressive. You give them way too much credit...All of the changes are pretty normal swings for bitcoin, and the fact that buying 1500 only resulted in ~5% change at most shows that it isn't exactly being manipulated.

BakedGoods

the power law chart doesn't show what the next peak or bottom will be, only what the max ranges for each are. just because BTC didn't reach the upper bounds of the power law doesn't mean the model is broken--it's not supposed to spot peaks or bottoms just the range price will oscillate around the median. and while btc price is a supply/demand mechanic, there are structural variables that affect it differently than equities--ie adoption, node network, population, access to bitcoin, etc. bitcon's price movement is a natural process, the stock market is exponential.

BroolStoryCompany-

Assuming BTC is 250k in that timeframe requires legislation, and a quadrupling of GPD globally. This will not happen.

banananuhhh

And yet, most people who ever owned BTC used an even worse one.

Ok_Mix_5798

Nobody cares about your little BTC transactions. The chain has an absurdly low transaction per second limit, extremely high cost to run the network and no safeguards wrt theft or fraud. Archaic protocol that has no functional use, purely speculative.

Schubert142

He sold BTC just to manipulate the Polymarket

wes424

Can someone actually explain to me why this is a good sign in any way? He has to keep buying or the game is over. I guess it makes more good YouTube crypto click bait to analyze this... if he stops buying, the price continues to crater and the whole thing crashes fast. This is just what he has to do and people are acting like its some sort of "ha gotcha" to skeptics. Beyond that, thinking this proven fraudster has created an infinite money glitch is just astounding to me. And why he needs a private plane and bloated exec team to trade BTC is wild.

skeptic246

The term ranging is the enemy of those seeking capital growth regardless of the asset class. I sold most of my BTC as it was ranging before it started to decline. The money has done far better in specific stock trades

arcrad

Yeah can't believe Saylor bought all their BTC at 120k! What a dummy...

KristiansA1

For me its the only legal way I can get BTC exposure on not taxable account

PopLegion

Microstrategys investment thesis is running larger and larger funding rounds of convertible debt to then purchase BTC so that previous investors holdings represent more BTC per share over time. The only way this continues is if microstrategy is able to access more and ever increasing pools of debt to fund their purchases of Bitcoin. But sure, it's not a ponzi scheme.

dumbcryptoquestions

I think pushing the message of not identifying Bitcoin with the people pushing Bitcoin is a good one.  There is a long line of scoundrels that have latched on to BTC knowing that it will give them an in with the base. We all need to remember Bitcoin is for everyone.

Lefties_TheWorst7331

MSTR doesn't DCA.. that is completely false. They often buy larger amounts when price is high because their assets (BTC) is worth more, therefore allowing them to borrow more money for BTC when it's price is higher.. they don't DCA a fixed amount all year, no.

ecrane2018

Yeah you said anymore, why would you have bought strategy before now if you weren’t looking to get exposure to BTC. I’m saying if you were buying Strategy before you were dumb, which clearly you lack reading comprehension.

maimutaAfricana

Yes, 3k... BTC was above 3k during the pandemic meltdown, before Saylor was even a thing in the space. But yes, Saylor is LITERALLY the only thing... bla bla bla.

AutoModerator

Post is by: Parcon1702 and the url/text [ ](https://goo.gl/GP6ppk)is: /r/btc/comments/1u0b7m4/saylor/ Saylor verkauft für 2.5 Millionen BTC bei 77 k und alle bekommen Angst. Eine Woche später kauft er für 100 Millionen, also das 40 fache, bei 65k. Das war ein Test von Saylor. Jetzt weiß er was zu tun ist wenn er billig BTC kaufen möchte. Kann uns nicht passieren. \#SPX6900 *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/CryptoMarkets) if you have any questions or concerns.*

NobodyImportant13

I don't think it will be catastrophic because the banks *should* be appropriately hedged by shorting a corresponding amount of BTC. MSTR will get slowly bled to death by the interest payments and eventually have to start unwinding BTC over time and/or directly diluting shareholders. But the dilution hasn't happened yet and won't happen for a while, which is what I think confuses a lot of people who have bought into this model.

dj_destroyer

Sure, and gold's market is 30x bigger and 382x older so it's a much more established store of value. It is by far the most scarce desirable asset. You can still draw parallels nonetheless. Namely that the US could sell all their gold reserves and the market would plummet. Or they can manipulate the gold market just as much as Strategy can with Bitcoin. The major difference is you cannot mine BTC any quicker whereas new gold deposits and also drop the market. Gold supply is very elastic -- if the price goes up then so does mining to compensate. There's no difficulty adjustment like BTC. If gold goes to $20k/oz, dormant mines reopen, exploration explodes, marginal deposits become economical, technology improves recovery rates, etc. Bitcoin is different, whether the price is $10k or $100k or $1m, the issuance schedule doesn't change. Tik tok, the next block still produces the same amount of Bitcoin.

CryptoDeepDive

Can someone explain why he had to sell 32BTC only to go around and buy 1550?