FTX

DangerPager69

FTX selling fake coins ruined the bull run. that is a fact.

heyhihowyahdurn

I’d pay front row seats for that. Sometimes I forget about how Celsius and FTX users got no vaseline too. Terra Luna as well.

jjduhamer

I was thinking about how the Luna incident precipitated the previous winter, followed by the collapse of Celsius and then FTX. In 2017 we had the fork, and in 2013 the mt gox hack. The pattern being that there’s always been some major shock which triggered the crypto winter. It’s nice this cycle is focused on the financial use case of blockchain. It feels like less can go wrong. However, I’d agree the greatest existential risk would be that a highly leveraged firm such as microstrategy might wind up needing to liquidate huge amounts of bitcoin because x, y, or z… tbh I don’t see it happening, I think we are on more stable ground.

Green4311

I got nothing. SbF, FTX. Blockfi. Robbed by all. So you have .35 more than I do and ever will again. They stole my child's future. I have nothing now and probably never will

eetaylog

FTX called. It wants its sarcasm back.

longonbtc

I recommend buying from [Strike](https://strike.me/), [Swan Bitcoin](https://www.swanbitcoin.com/), [River](https://river.com/), or [Cash App](https://cash.app/bitcoin). They all charge low fees and they don't peddle shitcoins. I recommend you to withdraw your bitcoin from the exchange once you have accumulated 0.01 BTC on the exchange. If you would have done this when you were using FTX, then you wouldn't have had a problem. If you want to move bitcoin from one exchange to another exchange, then you should not transfer bitcoin directly from exchange-1 to exchange-2. You should first withdraw the bitcoin from exchange-1 to your own wallet that you control and then you send the bitcoin from your own wallet to exchange-2. Some good hardware wallet options are Coldcard Q, BitBox02 Bitcoin-only edition, Blockstream Jade Plus, Trezor Safe 5 with Bitcoin-only firmware, Foundation Passport Core, and SeedSigner. These six hardware wallets are all good hardware wallets that have publicly available source code that can be reviewed. There are some older & cheaper versions of some of these wallets that are still safe and those are the Coldcard Mk4, Trezor Safe 3, and Blockstream Jade Classic.

transatoshi_mw

FTX crashed well in to 2022...

ask_for_pgp

i think if FTX wouldnt have blown up, we would have gotten 100k 2021; it still would have crashed to similair lows we had. perhaps 20k would have held. 200k i dont think we should have had last year. ETFs always needed time. the GBTC winddown (genesis bankrupcty) was also a major drag. perhaps 100k reclaim should have could have happend eventually around 2024 yes. now we are the cusp of next supply shock and we cleaned up all those bad players. we are onboarding new scammers though and some of them will blow up in the next bear again. but i think first we squeeze to 500k.

Sco_420

Short term bullish. Until they all start blowing up and we get a bear market worse than the FTX collapse. Don’t forget to take profits.

waldito

It's not about collapsing... It's about the institution and the ones who controls it. Remember FTX? >Binance has been the subject of lawsuits and challenges from regulatory authorities throughout its history. As a result, Binance has been banned from operating or ordered to cease operations in some countries, and has been issued fines. In 2021, Binance was put under investigation by both the United States Department of Justice and Internal Revenue Service on allegations of money laundering and tax offenses. The UK's Financial Conduct Authority ordered Binance to stop all regulated activity in the United Kingdom in June 2021. That same year, Binance shared client data, including names and addresses, with the Russian government. >In November 2023, the company pleaded guilty in a US federal court to money laundering, unlicensed money transmitting, and sanctions violations. >In April 2024, Zhao was sentenced to four months in prison after pleading guilty to violating US money laundering laws.

DankShibe

Nah. We are not on 2014 anymore. (FTX collapsed after a year and was much smaller than binance). Of course nothing beats self-custody, but a reputable exchange with track record is good enough for the average person nowadays.

waldito

If you can afford to lose your BTC and you trust Binance, store away. But lemme tell you, they can disappear out of the blue at any moment, and your money will be gone. It happened with Mt.Gox, it happened with FTX, Bitfinex, Bitstamp. One day you wake up, your money is gone, and no one is able to give it back to you. Not your Keys, Not your Coins. [NYKNYC](https://blog.theya.us/not-your-keys-not-your-coins/). Check Wikipedia's Page for Binance, not exactly the cleanest of the records. It's a ticking bomb, in my opinion.

NugKnights

I thought Teather was pegged to USD not gold? Isn't this them double dipping, which could leave them over leveraged just like FTX? Say we discover a huge gold deposit and it crashes the price of gold, now their investments no longer match the issued teather, and it all falls apart.

MrBluoe

yeah so... I'm not a lawyer, but if the company isn't a DAO, that means the CEO can make any decision on his own, no matter what the token says. So if tomorrow the CEO goes crazy and decides to sell everything, he can. Of course it would have legal repercussions, but this type of implementation doesn't inspire confidence in users to buy the token. I mean, why would they? Just another FTX situation waiting to happen. There is no real garantee.

rgnet1

Agree. The market is working. This is not FTX obscuring their bookkeeping. Everything Saylor is doing is open. He issues stock and debt and people are buying it. I want to know what these naysayers think he should be doing as a person who believes bitcoin has no bottom. He has an obligation to himself and now his shareholders to buy as much as possible with every legal financial tool he has available. It’s insane no one else is picking up his playbook at this stage. It’s not like there’s a competitive advantage or secret sauce here. The market wants this bitcoin proxy clearly.

Salvisurfer

FTX would like a word

Popular-Let-4700

It was thanks to FTX manipulation that we actually had an altseason 😔 No more now

DBRiMatt

Shout out to those who avoided Terra Luna and FTX.

coinfeeds-bot

tldr; The article revisits key figures involved in the 2022 crypto winter, a period marked by major collapses in the cryptocurrency industry. Sam Bankman-Fried (FTX) is serving a 25-year sentence for fraud, while Caroline Ellison (Alameda Research) received a reduced 2-year sentence for cooperation. Do Kwon (Terraform Labs) awaits a 2026 trial for the Terra-Luna collapse, and Alex Mashinsky (Celsius Network) is serving 12 years for fraud. Su Zhu and Kyle Davies (Three Arrows Capital) face legal disputes after their firm's collapse. The industry has since partially recovered, but these individuals continue to face repercussions. *This summary is auto generated by a bot and not meant to replace reading the original article. As always, DYOR.

VariatCA

Bitcoin was doing anything *but* rallying when the Fed raised interest rates back in 2022, and the 2020-2021 rally enjoyed a Fed interest rate of practically zero, at 0.25-0.50 percent. Rates climbed 4%, from 0.25-0.50 up to 4.25-4.50 before 2022 was over. During that time, BTC fell from around 40k in March down to a 16k low. Of course it doesn't explain the full story of BTC's bear market, as it began to regain ground in 2023 even though interest rates climbed another 1%. So the 2020-2021 rally had basically zero interest rate, and suffered while interest rose drastically in comparison for 2022? Doesn't sound terribly "decoupled" at all. But 2022 also saw other macro events as damage to the economy lingered on from the Pandemic, Russia invaded Ukraine in February, Terra Luna collapsed in May, and FTX collapsed in November. While 2013 and 2017's BTC crashes had no S&P correlation, they absolutely correlated towards the end of 2021. The stock market basically topped-out towards the end of November, tried & failed to rally beyond those highs in December, and had dropped ~25% by October 2022. That correlates very succinctly with BTC topping out in November and also suffering through all of 2022. So imo, the 4-year-cycle theory has just two data points relating specifically to crypto (2013 and 2017), and a global black-swan of a pandemic that showed up in 2021 to throw a wrench in *every market* for 2022-2023.

VariatCA

I'm still a firm believer that the 4-year-cycle theory was simply coincidental timing, and basically required a global pandemic and high interest rates to thwart inflation just to trigger the next cycle. If the underlining theory is simply "something extremely shitty happens every 4 years or so and causes a cascading market degredation", that's one thing. But those who believe "Crypto is due for another huge crash simply because it's been about 4 years since the last one" are entrenched in a baseless theory. If you exclude the forces that negatively affected the global markets (Pandemic, economic slowdown, high inflation, high interest rates, the re-ignition of the Russian/Ukrainian war), Crypto might very well have just continued chugging along upwards. Though specifically relating to crypto, the FTX / Terra Luna collapses would have still done some nasty damage on their own, and easily could have triggered a less-intense bear market downturn.

bricarp

> What do you mean by it’s not a reputable exchange? It is one of the biggest exchange as far as I know right? For what you're trying to do, I would think it's fine. A lot of people are upset by the manipulation of the "CRO" token and the fact that the rewards for their crypto debit card seemingly get reduced quite often. Think of it like this: when a hotel in Las Vegas charges you $8 for a can of Coca-Cola from the hotel room's minibar, have they committed a crime? It's a hilarious upcharge and takes advantage of some people who don't know better, but the prices are actually advertised and they aren't actually breaking any laws. The exchange that you mention might have done many douchy things that are unsavory, but no one has yet been able to prove that it's a blatant fraud like FTX or Bitconnect.

Awkward_Potential_

>We live and we learn buddy, or we don't 🙂 You're no different than the millions of other young men who hope for life changing moments to happen to them for free It's funny that you view it as "free" gains. I was buying Bitcoin after the FTX collapse. I was buying Bitcoin when I was down bad. I was buying when I absolutely wanted to puke. Knowing it would probably go down more before it went up again. >Remember, most life changing moments don't happen, they creep up on you for many, many years I'm not sure why you think I'm a youngster who needs your sage like wisdom on how to be a Luddite. Do whatever you want to do. But no one's going to come save you. I didn't buy Bitcoin for short term gains. I bought to hold for years.

pickleBoy2021

OTC is over the counter. Common in tradfi. You hear it all the time. Not pleebs. You call OTC and say you have 5 million coins. You get quoted a price. If you take it they send you the money. Some cases you transfer coins to another wallet. Sometimes people just dump the wallet. OTC can then sell to another buyer. SOL had a lot of action around the last unlock and dump because the coins were from the FTX auction and you knew the price paid. You are buying big blocks. Not doing a DCA. OTC can then unload to a customer. Sell of in chunks. Loan out for a price if someone needs inventory. This is all stuff that has happened in tradfi for years. But if I’m selling at scale, you get a TWAP price and it gets sold down gradually. The reason again OTC. Not going to crash the price. Going to get the price range I want. They have a network of buyers they are going to sell to. This is their business. It’s like high end real estate that sells and never lists. Same with art. The money world is different.

oopy8

Most people don't know the difference between FTX, Bitcoin, and Doge. When they hear Bitcoin they think about a hack that happened to an exchange or a meme coin or NFTS that took people's money. They haven't used it so they don't know the difference. They just know it is something to stay away from.

coinfeeds-bot

tldr; FTX has frozen over $500 million in distributions due to global crypto restrictions, with China accounting for 82% of the affected funds, or $435 million. The FTX Recovery Trust cannot proceed with payouts in 49 jurisdictions where crypto activity is restricted, citing potential legal complications. Many claims from Chinese residents are in limbo as FTX was never authorized to operate in China. Additionally, nearly 400,000 customer claims were disqualified due to KYC violations, further complicating the recovery process. *This summary is auto generated by a bot and not meant to replace reading the original article. As always, DYOR.

jj4fun2025

True true. :) It's is fun wondering how high it might go and then what will end the cycle. I wonder what narrative it will be this time. FTX was the last cycle crasher.

TewMuchToo

November 2022 after FTX, traded all of my alts for bitcoin. Best trade ever.

coinfeeds-bot

tldr; FTX has proposed a plan to block creditor payouts in 49 countries, including China, citing legal risks. This move could disproportionately affect Chinese users, who represent 82% of the impacted claims. The plan involves designating these countries as 'Potentially Restricted Jurisdictions,' with claims treated as 'disputed' unless legal opinions allow payouts. If deemed restricted, funds will be forfeited. The proposal has sparked backlash, with critics calling it unfair and unethical. Some suggest transferring claims to allowed jurisdictions as a workaround. *This summary is auto generated by a bot and not meant to replace reading the original article. As always, DYOR.

partymsl

The FTX saga simply not ending...

GasPasser73

Converting to an LLC IRA so you can own your own keys…it takes some time but then you eliminate the risk of CEX failure (FTX, BlockFi)…don’t ask why I know….

makerTNT

Moving my funds from Binance to FTX

Nyanzerfaust

There is no media and social hype like before because retail and altcoiners were left behind. I know some people working in traditional finance that somehow still think that BTC never recovered after the FTX crash. As a BTC only guy, seeing Bitcoin over 100k is just crazy enough, I don't need to be entertained, I have had enough these last cycles.

Impressive_Quote9696

I bet you are not able to trade your tokens against the stock whenever you want. you have to sell the token and then buy the stock, hence its NFTs or FTX 2.0

Steak1994

FTX 2.0 in the making...

HmmmWhyDoYouAsk

I would need to know more about your personal finances and your life to give you an answer. But I’ll tell you that I continuously borrow money to buy BTC and it’s worked amazingly well for me. First time I did it was following the FTX/SBF scam so BTC dropped bad down to $17k. I took out a $17k personal loan and bought a whole coin. Then I took out zero % credit cards and put life expenses on those while investing the cash I would have spent on life. So those are basically BTC backed credit cards. I roll over after the 0% period is done. 3% each rollover so as long as BTC gains 3% a year, I’m winning. Easy math. Lastly, a couple months ago I found out I could take a line of credit against my BOA credit card. So I did. Borrowed another $18k and threw it all in BTC. The strategy works but you can’t bitch up and start fearing the debt. If you sell your BTC to pay the debt off, then you failed. So my personal finances & budget comes down to this… make enough money to service the debt and if I never have to touch the BTC then I can’t lose.

tj78492

You want to do this when FTX collapses not near all time highs.

NomadicSplinter

FTX, Celsius, blockfi,….

partymsl

The good ol days of Celsius imploding just like FTX...

drhiggs

They probably will soon, but I used to blockfi back in 2021 and almost got a liquidated a couple times when btc was in a bear market. I kept having to add more collateral. Eventually bought out my position and got my btc back before blockfi froze assets. Don’t worry I moved it somewhere safe… FTX 😎

jawni

Part 2 >Actual users are benefitting from the things that I've noted because they do matter. USERS 👏 WILL 👏 SHOW 👏 YOU 👏 WHAT 👏 THINGS 👏 ARE 👏 BENEFICIAL 👏 BY 👏 USING 👏 THEM Just saying it's a benefit because you say it matters means absolutely nothing. Tell me specifically when a user goes to make a transaction on Litecoin and Solana, what things will they notice? And how would they actually notice them? At least in my experience, no matter what type of transaction you make, you'll notice the speed and the cost. How is a user going to notice the things you think matter? >If the VCs and others promoting new chains validated this narrative, they couldn't dump their insider bags on the market at a profit. If it was a real narrative, you wouldn't need people to validate it for you, it would come about naturally. Also, you need to stop treating VCs as anything other than early stage investors. This sub seems to think VC is a code word for some type of inherently nefarious group, rather than just a group of connected investors who have a lot of funds to employ... >I'm trying to understand your criticism of Litecoin - I could not care less about selling you on it. It all seems to boil down to: I don't believe number will go up as much If you haven't figured it out by now, there isn't much hope, but I'll spell it out as simply and plainly as I can for you: Blockchains need to sustain themselves -> they use block rewards to bootstrap the network and subsidize network operator pay temporarily -> generally block rewards asymptotically approach zero(aka they get smaller and smaller due to things like halving for LTC or in Solana's case disinflation) -> if the network does not have enough users paying for blockspace then the network operators won't get paid enough to keep operating -> chain dies. I don't know how many times I have to repeat this, but far less people use LTC than Solana, so when I say users aren't benefitting from those, it refers to the lack of usage on LTC, despite it having those qualities. If it has those qualities and users choose something else, they likely see no benefit in those things, or higher relative benefit elsewhere, like Solana (or in the case of payments, often Tron). You also haven't been able to quantify how a user would have any indication of which networks had a fair distribution, while it's extremely easy to quantify how a user would have immediate indication of what network is cheaper or faster. Litecoin *used* to have a fundamental advantage when it came to the area of payments or transfers, now it objectively does not with respect towards blocktimes(speed) and fees(cost). If Litecoin isn't the best coin for payments or transfers anymore, then how is it going to sustain itself? Where is litecoin going to generate it's revenue from? >Market doesn't have to care about what I see as fundamental in the short term. Current stats suggest that 99% of crypto investors not buying BTC will be bagholders and lose over the long term. The odds are worse than a slot machine at a casino. Winners in the short term must time their exits and avoid emotional attachment to their investment. Most won't be capable of doing this and it will leave a bad taste in their mouth about crypto. ok? My point was just that price movement, although an imperfect measure, is often an indicator of fundamentals and also future expectations. Because it seems like you have trouble identifying what is and isn't getting traction from more direct indicators, so instead of being confident in an inherently limited view thinking "Am I wrong? No it's the market who is wrong!" you might have a bit of reflection. But if you just dismiss all price movement it can lead people to assume their thesis is fine despite it being the opposite. >Seems like we agree that these new chains are not really sustainable. Bit of specificity needed here. They are sustainable, they generally aren't self-sustainable at launch though, but they can become self-sustainable over time. Keep in mind this is why I'm bearish on Litecoin, it hasn't proven a good path towards self-sustainability. And obviously Litecoin also subsidizes block production as well to provide a better chance at long term sustainability. >They require marketing to grow and every person who buys a memecoin on the chain and proceeds to lose most of the value of their investment is not going to come away with a flattering outlook on that chain or the market it provides access to. In the case of Solana, there are thousands of projects that call it home, they market for themselves which in turn acts as marketing for the chain they use. Solana is the \#1 chain for revenue generating apps and has been for 14 straight weeks now. As it is, Solana does need to grow, but is on a good pace. Seems like growth is going fine for them, but what is Litecoin's plan for growth? Litecoin generated ~500 blocks a day and ~$500 worth of LTC every block, for a total of $250,000 worth of minted LTC per 24H but it only generated ~$700 in fees in that same time. ([source](https://bitinfocharts.com/litecoin/)) How do they increase that number when people seemingly don't value the things that you think are so important? >So do you see Solana through a "better Ethereum" narrative? Not necessarily, I just see it as a blockchain that can facilitate enough transactions to sustain the network while keeping individual fees low. I see it as better for certain purposes, but they really only compete in the sense that both of them are head and shoulders above everyone else when it comes to the activity of their respective ecosystems. >Long term, I think the market has always been triangulating on the story of value + scarcity and when BTC becomes too expensive for the smallest fish, there will be very few blockchains with a narrative that can sustain the demand without getting dumped by bagholders who have been trained to watch and wait for their exit signal. Yeah, and judging by usage, by the proxy of revenue, Solana seems to be one of the few that will sustain. You've now vaguely referenced "dumping" as a threat to Solana, not sure how tangible that threat is, especially considering the 2022 bear market and FTX fallout are lows that will likely never be reached again, as well as considering that making it through that inspired a lot of confidence in Solana. So I'm really not sure what you're insinuating here. Considering the supply is 99.99% unlocked I'm not sure what "bagholders who have been trained to watch and wait for their exit signal." is in reference too. Do you somehow think Solana is more vulnerable... to people selling coins? >I agree that the narrative for short term speculative gains is easier to understand and believe in than the fundamental long term value proposition of a coin towards its designated purpose. I think every blockchain with a rational long term narrative does not require timing the market or a marketing team to continue growing. Like I already mentioned, I'm a long term holder and every investment inherently requires timing the market to some degree, you have to enter and you have to exit and that is the only timing my long term narrative requires, just like literally any other type of buy and hold investment.

spawspa

I was playing around with ICO and sold at the bottom in 2018. Thought I would go back in 2020 right before COVID and just aimed for 1 BTC. Slowly it was 1 BTC for each family member (5 of us) Then I aimed at accruing 10 BTC. Lost some of it with FTX and Celsius about. Picked myself back up and slowly added back in in 2023 and now I am at 25 BTC. Goal for 2025 is to be at 30 BTC. Hopefully 50 BTC by 2030.

Theverybestestintown

I think this is highly unlikely. Sure, we may top out below 200K if we really do continue the 4-year cycle trend (which itself seems less likely today). But barring some extreme situation a la FTX, BlockFI, Celsius etc. we may not go below 100K ever again. It we "top out" at 180K we could see a strong retrace to 120-150, or we could break the 4-year cycle and continue a modest increase for the next year or so.

ubermensch1001

Yeah, all of this talk about how BTC is never going to see a bear market again and how it is going to 500k this year convinces me otherwise. I'll genuinely be surprised to see BTC break 200k this cycle, thinking something around 140-170k or so, maybe 180k in a very bullish scenario. I think the bottom for the next bear market will be in the 70-80k range, basically the lows we had earlier this April. We could get into the 60k range or even the 50k range if things got insanely scary, like after the collapse of FTX in late 2022.

CourseDazzling9537

I would not want to keep my money in a bank in the old west. Similar risks exist in the early day exchanges for BTC. As time moves forward the risks will minimize. Crypto.com for example keeps the majority in cold storage so almost no chance of theft. They also insure up to $600,000. A lot of people that yell, not your keys not your coins are group think smooth brains. Many might not have done their due diligence and got burned in the past. If you just took a moment to look at the pimply teenagers running FTX without even studying their books, any sane person would have seen giant red flags. I have my stack split between my tradfi bank in a tax free savings account, a secure well know exchange and cold storage. One goes down I only loose a third. Be wary of people simply repeating a catchphrase without any substance to follow it up.

Xryme

People will bring up MtGox and FTX as exchanges that failed like you’ll lose everything, but both of these went through bankruptcy courts and customers did get a lot back paid out to them (not 100%). It did take years though. Reputable exchanges are gonna be fine, like Fidelity isn’t going anywhere.

Bred_Slippy

I think you're either very trusting, or have a short memory. Exchanges can get hacked, go bankrupt, carry out outright fraud (e.g. FTX), go down when you most need them (e.g. Coinbase and its numerous "outages") . They're also a honeypot for future confiscation/restrictions. I really wouldn't hold anything substantial on them. If you think an exchange will always replace your BTC you just need to look back at what actually happened to investors that held on the numerous failed ones.

coojw

I see your FTX account, and I’ll raise you a Voyager account

Linkamus

Mt. gox, Celsius, blockfi, FTX, Quadrigacx, crytopia, BTC-e, Voyager digital, genesis global capital, 3ac. Just some of the collapses that resulted in customers getting screwed over. Some of these were very "reputable" exchanges.

CoinCornerMolly

Google FTX.

RoyYourWorkingBoy

There is a long history of bitcoin exchanges going out of business. Sure you might get your some of your money back years later, but maybe not. Look up Mt Gox, QuadrigaCX, Celsius, FTX, etc. I prefer to hold my own to eliminate that risk.

calethai26

you deserve to have an FTX account.

ApprehensiveEye6386

That is an interesting perspective. Definitely buy the dip, buy the top, UTXO management, send to cold storage with you there. I think we will have some sort of Corporate Survival of the fittest coming in play. The weak companies that cannot keep up with inflation will cease to exist and the strong companies that either can grow their way up or use BTC treasuries will survive. Those who entertain the idea of BTC IOU’s will again cease to exist. Example being FTX. And youre right there are still companies out there doing stuff like that too and we never find out in the bull market. Just like in the Big Short. No one noticed the corruption on a mass scale until home prices were stagnant or declining. That is when the hell broke loose. Same with the BTC IOU companies of last cycle. Once that becomes more mainstream i think that countries will follow. I dont think that the world has the patience or a hard enough head or strong enough morality to get rid of any country backed fiat currency but i do believe there to be a day when BTC is the main world reserve currency. Its the main corporate reserve currency. Its the main personal reserve currency. Its the measure to success with regards to value added. Will be used for most major purchases like homes, businesses, cars. It will be the currency that is used with interplanetary travel. Those are my beliefs

ec265

FTX, Celsius, Voyager, BlockFi, Genesis etc. There are multiple examples of centralised platforms failing One of cryptos main value proposition is self sovereignty and self custody, using smart contracts to eliminate trust with third parties

solomoncobb

Noone money is safe. They don't have your money. Study fractional reserve banking. You loaned them money as part of a ponzi scheme they don't pay you any interest on, or very little, and if you and more than a few other "customers" want your money back at the same time, they are fucked. What's any different about that than the FTX collapse?

costef

You absolutely can, although not forever. FTX literally did this in 2021. They rehypothecated customer assets and naked short sold bitcoin to suppress the price

Initialised_Underway

The single best investor in BTC I know set up a DCA in 2017 and then forgot about it. They had someone who was paying them a small sum each week. They didn’t need the money at the time so they said “pay me in this bitcoin thing”. The wallet was set up and the automatic payment loaded, and then they forgot about it and moved on with life. When others thought altcoins would beat BTC they didn’t notice. When BTC soared they didn’t notice. When BTC crashed they didn’t notice. When Celsius said they would pay interest they didn’t notice. When FTX blew up they didn’t notice. When Bitconnect promised endless wealth they never even got the email. That stable regular buy was all they needed.

fairlyaveragetrader

Everyone has their own thing, I had done the same thing since cost averaging in starting in November 2017. I started mining and buying the whole way down into 2018. The hard part came in 2021. When I had enough to pay off my entire house. Sold, did buy the FTX blow up and I'm currently camping waiting for another euphoria event. Haven't had one yet

No_Suspect1982

Pretty much everybody can say that though, I could have took an equity loan out on my house and bought 10BTC 2 years ago at 15-17k. I may have struggled some on the payments for year or two but in the end I’d of paid the house off, taxes, and be sitting on 6-7 BTC. Me and the family would be sitting nice. I did not have the balls to risk my home and all I worked for, that’s the thing, you have to believe in BTC going up that high. Now with that said, the bottom price of BTC was after FTX crash and the SEC & government wasn’t being very nice to crypto in the U.S. Who would have thought we are going to 100k+ and all the regulatory overhauls we are getting, ETF’s, ect. Stack as many sats as you can and don’t sell them, because if your regretting today your still gonna be regretting it 10-20 years later. If you don’t like buying 100k, try buying 200k, 300k, 500k. Think sats not BTC, eventually it will be valued in satoshis, and your gonna hear 1000 sats, 10,000 sats. Let that sink in, definitely what Nakamoto made satoshis for.

arioch376

80% It's a replay of last cycles double top where everyone thought it was going to 100k. Instead of FTX MSTR gets investigated for fraud and pops like a balloon, and nuclear winter commences. Personally my base case is we double by the end of the year, but if I had to put together a bear case it would be that.

riscten

Ever heard of banking crises? Were you around in 2008 when major banks defaulted? Ever heard about fractional reserves? MtGox, QuadrigaCX, FTX, BlockFi, Celsius. Rings a bell? That's how your Fidelity/Coinbase account goes poof. Bitcoin on a centralized exchange or in an ETF is just a number in a traditional database. You have no proof that the Bitcoin is actually held as it is entirely decoupled from the blockchain. I cannot understate this. **Bitcoin was invented to fix this very problem: Banks saying they have your money, when really they don't.** If you're trusting these institutions to hold your Bitcoin, then you're back to square zero. You're back to fiat. You're back to fractional reserves and all the "creative" shenanigans and houses of cards built with layers and layers of debt-backed financial products. This is the *entire* point of the blockchain. That everyone can look at it and see with their own eyes where the money is. There is *no* trust at all. It's all verifiable. Centralized exchanges are a necessary evil to convert fiat to Bitcoin. That's it. The moment the conversion is done, get your coins the f out of there.

NomadicSplinter

🤦🏻‍♂️BTC is not a proof of stake protocol. If you are “staking” bitcoin, you’re lending out your bitcoin to someone who wants a loan. Hopefully they pay back their loan, if not you’re not getting your BTC back and you will be lucky if you get your dollars back. Likely at a much lower price per BTC like FTX people.

TopKekistan76

I like blending both strategies. Have a set DCA amount that is relatively low. On noticeable dips w/ what is IMO over reacting news/negativity (FTX, tariffs, war) I put larger sum amounts in. I’ve never bothered to go back and see if my strategy is out performing pure DCA. My hunch is scoring that larger amount in April around 75k was better than spreading that over the last several months at average prices in the 90’s. Certainly feels cooler LoL

Square_Plastic_8407

Safe as in not going to end up like FTX.

Aggravating_Fold1154

Not discounting your concerns but there have been altcoins in the past with bigger inflation that still managed to massively outperform btc when the conditions were right. Sui had huge token unlocks this year and it still did 250% this year (after cooling off). Solana had a huge amount of tokens locked back in 2021 and yet Solana reached 200 dollars (thanks to FTX). Of course, conditions need to be right. Right now the market is still relatively risk-off with gold mooning this year, and the US money market funds are still growing. If J Powell cuts rates, or if the bond market breaks and yield curve control is introduced then it's massively bullish for risk-on like alts. The government has decided numbers must go up, and so it will.

writing_all_day

Yeah, and they probably won't peak again until 2027. In EOY 2017/early 2018, Ethereum ICOs were the notable alt run killers, with a side of Bitconnect and OneCoin pulling billions out of the market. In 2021, it was unsustainable yield farming, the FTX failure, and LUNA. In 2024/early 2025, it was meme mania, Hayden Davis-powered rugs, trade wars, and actual wars.

MaleficentPrune652

I've noticed that Coinbase tends to be on the safer side even though the fee bite can be pretty noticeable, while Kraken feels like a steady ride. OKX and CoinEX come off as more of the experimental type - nothing cataclysmic like FTX so far, just different trade-offs in fees and certainty. This is just my two cents.

Typical-Green-7352

Because it will be these companies panic selling and capitulating, that will create the next bear market. They will be the 2026(ish) equivalent of FTX.

CakeAndBitcoin

They were able to make FTX their b*tch. And then Binance thru front-end. Who knows where it'll lead. oh wait..monopoly.

USN9580

The same kind of people that were on Voyager and FTX 😆

East-Day-7888

This is a rinse and repeat of FTX, purchasing ad space in sports, hosting political campaign fundraising, and now times magazines. Time to move away from coinbase.

fairlyaveragetrader

There's an interesting history with some of those guys. The most jaded seem to be the type that at some point owned or bought or kept a Bitcoin and then panic sold the lows, watched the development over the years and disbelief and after years of that it just kind of does something to your psyche a lot of people did buy the November to December 2017 top between 10 and 20,000 only to panic sell under 6,000 believing the asset was doomed. I'm sure even more were created during the FTX blow up. It seems like one of the common themes is it is people who have bought towards a high point and they get sucked in during a mania phase only to go through months of this belief as things go down eventually capitulating and puking what they have at much lower prices. They get mad, they want everything to fail and when it doesn't, they get a membership in buttcoin. Personally I think it would be kind of cool if they had flair over there on how much money the individual poster had lost doing exactly this

galehufta

Bitconnect, FTX, Blockfi, Celsius etc. beg to differ..

MakCapital

Long response: Myself, and only me. I can tell you the popular opinions are almost always wrong about everything. Especially on Reddit. Double so this sub. People here have no idea how to invest and know even less about the tech. Most everyone is the blind following the blind because they think if enough other people are following someone they must know what they are talking about. 🤣. Nah, the KOL's are mostly just dumb tribal personalities with charisma at best or smart traders leveraging their platforms to trade against you, at worst. If you would have followed crypto Reddit from the start you would have been convinced in semi order for over the past decade (The majority only shifted opinions after they could no longer argue the price.): - Bitcoin is a scam. - Ok maybe Bitcoin isn't a scam but it's worthless. - Ethereum is a scam. - Ok Ethereum isn't a scam but smart contracts are worthless. - Alts that challenge Bitcoin like BCH, LTC, XRP, Nano, aren't worthless and better than Bitcoin. - All crypto is worthless again. - Ok, Bitcoin isn't worthless but all alts are definitely worthless except maybe LTC, XLM, XRP. - Wow, some of these other alts made people rich for some reason. Why not mine? At least I know those new NFT things are a scam. - Bored apes and all NFTs will never have value. No one would ever pay for digital ownership over a collectible. - Ok some NFTs have value to people but memes will never have any value. Doge is only a joke (To their credit, they just underestimated the left curve, and trading attention can be fun.) - Solana is a scam. Completely worthless. It's just an FTX scam coin. Ignore it. - If Bitcoin can be worth trillions with no revenue so can alts like Cardano. Luckily Solana died because FTX died. - All crypto only goes up if Bitcoin goes up. Crypto is just tokens that try to beat USD and BTC. Buy the tokens this sub repeats are good! Ignore the years of losses. - I don't care everyone now uses Solana. It's definitely a scam. Buy hbar, ada, XRP. Trust me! There are dozens of us using them! Crypto social media is still so broken that most don't understand a token is just ownership of some other asset that can literally be anything from a security to a commodity or ownership over publicly managed equity exposed to revenue from numerous protocols to L1s like Solana/Hyperliquid. We're currently sitting around last couple bullet points of retarded. Over the next few years the majority will start to learn everything is crypto. Everything gets tokenized. You need to determine the value of each token based on what you own, and a rSpacex private security token could care less how BTC performs. L1s that capture web 3 rev go up with rev. Tokens without ownership over rev or something with fundamental value trend to 0 long term. No one wants to buy your meme or vaporware L1 coin that produces no value for more than you paid over longer time frames. Know what ownership your token provides before you buy. BTC moving up forever without rev is the exception. Not the rule. Nothing else is Bitcoin. Rev or bust. The world will trade and own all assets on chain. Even if they don't realize it. Have fun owning and trading all different types of assets on a single global network. Whichever network takes the majority of transactional web 3 revenue is worth trillions. Bitcoin is a better ledger for the world's wealth than a shiny piece of metal. It'll continue moving up at an accelerated pace until it becomes the dominant ledger. Learn these concepts. Learn the fundamentals. Learn the tech. Learn economics. Learn investing. The fastest road to accomplishing all of this is just start using the popular networks, and protocols. As a bonus, active users are constantly showered with free airdrops. You'll get paid for learning. Do it. I've personally made hundreds of thousands in USD from just using everything over the years. So much stupid opportunity out there. You'll find it when you break from crypto tribes, and start getting curious over what all is being built and why. GL and remember you have no idea if I know what I'm saying. Don't trust. Ignore the comments. Verify by using, examining the free data with sites like defilama/Coingecko and leverage AI. You guys have it much easier these days. Everything you need is right in front of you.

nesselzzz

I’m actually curious about this and hoping someone can enlighten me. We say in the crypto world, “not your keys, not your crypto”, when you buy bitcoin and hold it on the exchange. When buying the spot ETF, it’s a step even further removed from that right? You aren’t actually buying the bitcoin, you’re buying a share that is backed by bitcoin. You own the share, not the bitcoin. Blackrock actually “owns” the bitcoin, and Coinbase holds it in their vault (which by the above logic, makes them the actual owner). As the buyer of the ETF, I have no access to the bitcoin itself. I can’t move it or take self custody of it. All I can do is buy or sell the share and trust that Blackrock will buy or sell the underlying Bitcoin correct? My question is how is this any different than in the old days when you would buy gold, and pay someone to safely store it for you, resulting in you getting a certificate for it? We know how that story ended. What protects consumers of this ETF from the same thing happening? Assuming Blackrock is insuring the Bitcoin (I actually don’t know), in the event of the underlying asset being stolen from Coinbase (long shot, but trying to understand the concept), would they not go the route of FTX and pay you the dollar equivalent of the Bitcoin at the time of the theft? In that case, you get a depreciating, inflating asset that is printed out of thin air, in the event of malicious activity, that likely has less purchasing power at the time of the payout, than it did when the hypothetical theft occurred? Im hoping someone can correct any and all flaws in my thinking.

Hot-Head0801

Let me be clear: this situation reeks of the same hype-driven frenzy we saw with NFTs and the FTX debacle under Sam Bankman-Fried. Take a close look at the founder, Shayne Coplan, born in 1998. His claim to fame? Being in the right place at the right time during Ethereum’s launch. That’s it. There’s no substantial track record or credibility beyond that. Polymarket’s setup has all the hallmarks of a potential large-scale scam, and the red flags are impossible to ignore.

BasedSpades

My knowledge is limited but my bet is It’s about whether the bitcoin being issued to people is actually there. Like FTX they promised people in the surface but didn’t actually have the bitcoin to back it. ETFs are “supposed” to be backed by actual bitcoin.

GrandProfessional856

Don’t trust them!!! They’re now blocking accounts and withdraws!!! The next FTX?

HeavyRightFoot89

Happened to me already, I hopped in the 20Ks after FTX. I'm told it's a scam by everyone I talk to about it I don't care about their opinions but I let them know I personally believe in it and I've been saying that for years now. I don't tell everyone how right I was though, it's none of their business but I can tell they keep unsuccessfully probing me for financial advice now lol

GoodResident2000

FTX was an honest, family run business that was taken to the cleaners by corrupt SEC

Kitchen_Image_1031

FTX lied. Why shouldn’t others?

Acceptable_Main_5911

Can’t we just use an exchange in peace? Mt gox, Circle, then voyager, then almost Binance after FTX collapse from 3AC.

Awkward_Potential_

And why has that not happened? Why did it not go to 0 after Mt Gox or FTX? Shouldn't a Ponzi be less resilient than that?

jawni

>That’s not what this source says: https://solanacompass.com/tokenomics Messari is a professional research firm, I think if there is a discrepancy, I'd lean towards Messari being more accurate. The Messari dashboard is also much newer, so I'd expect the newer source to me more accurate or up-to-date. The only unlocks I see on *any* source are the FTX Estate sales, which obviously have changed hands since TGE, so even if that is locked, that still proves my original point that distribution has changed over time... [This is another source, shows 88% unlocked, but has 9% untracked, and 3% unlocked.](https://cryptorank.io/price/solana/vesting) If you scroll down to the vesting schedule chart, it shows 473k SOL for FTX+Alameda bankruptcy and 164k for Alameda bankruptcy. Roughly 600k, unlocking over the course of a year and proportionately, 600k out of 500m is .1%, which aligns with Messari's data. Regardless, the point is that the vast majority of the supply has been unlocked for years, and the starting distribution likely has little to no bearing on the current distribution. >Running a validator costs around $10k+ worth of hardware and has operational costs north of $10k a year. They basically must be run in a data center because of the needed internet speed. And tons of people still run them. Alpenglow also will be lowering operational costs for validators. >The Solana team is also lacking in transparency/honesty which is a huge red flag. They are exceedingly transparent. Not sure why you'd think this. Care to elaborate? Is this in reference to something specific? >They claim to have similar decentralization to Ethereum despite having a very centralized governance structure and validator concentration (80% of solana is in top 10% of validators) 175 validators having 80% of the stake is not bad at all. Seems pretty similar to ETH: https://dune.com/hildobby/eth2-staking Although I'd expect ETH and Cardano to be far ahead of everyone, being around for so much longer. I'd be curious to see how it measures up to chains around the same age, but ultimately we don't really have any that would compete, things like SUI or Aptos or Sei aren't even in the same ballpark and most of the other most popular chains are L2s who are clearly less decentralized. But ultimately decentralization is a perpetual process, not a one time checkpoint to hit.

Consistent-Baby5904

Raoul Pal on Real Vision They run macro analysis, and the way things are looking - we're in stage 4 of 4 (final) of global collapse. 18.6y housing market cycle crash in here. just a few more FTX collapses and bank runs from 2022-2024, and we're headed in the right direction of euphoric dot com bubble burst of crypto and ai markets, and perfectly aligned with housing market crash. stock up on food and defense, you know what I mean, lol... "click click"

Soft-Stress-4827

A centralized exchange can fail just like FTX. Personally i would prefer a decentralized system like morpho or teller finance since the rules AND escrow  are always fully onchain and transparent 

swiftpwns

Bitcoin has a pretty good track reckord of recking anyone and anything that tries to abuse bitcoin. FTX is a prime example

CommiRhick

Price manipulation ≠ BTC manipulation?... Ok. That's what they say now, but give it a while and you'll see the same system of *derived* or *backed by*... How many companies say they hold 1-1 for financial purposes, and it turns out they in fact don't... IE FTX... It's a bubble which inflates the market.

lavastorm

smart contract wallets have security measures built in. https://www.ready.co/learn/what-is-a-smart-contract-wallet if you REALLLLY want insurance then you can get that too https://hedera.com/learning/decentralized-finance/defi-insurance when all that is hidden behind some slick graphics you get apps like https://www.zeal.app/ and dont loose anything to exchange hacks and corruption like mtgox or FTX

RandoDude124

You had an FTX account. 💀💀💀

Awkward_Potential_

Honestly, I started buying BTC seriously after FTX. So it's kinda felt like a bull run all along.

coinfeeds-bot

tldr; FTX's bankruptcy lawyers have challenged a $1.53 billion claim by Three Arrows Capital (3AC), calling it illogical and self-inflicted due to 3AC's excessive risk-taking and ignored margin calls. The dispute involves margin trades and a $120 million credit facility from FTX, which 3AC allegedly mismanaged during the 2022 market meltdown. FTX liquidated 3AC's account to prevent further losses, recovering $82 million. FTX argues the claim unfairly targets its creditors and seeks to salvage 3AC's failed liquidation process. *This summary is auto generated by a bot and not meant to replace reading the original article. As always, DYOR.

inShambles3749

30% hmmm very sustainable. What could go wrong *cough FTX, Celsius, countless DEX rugs, Luna, cough*

another1degenerate

What's the best trading platform for Bitcoin? I haven't traded Bitcoin since FTX went under.

NatalieMichaael

Yeah, the whole perception about MMs is completely different after the FTX fallout. Still, there’s def a big difference between the shady ones and MMs Kairon Labs. They've been around for years and seem to operate pretty transparently.

Every_Hunt_160

I remember major alts being crushed -40% on FTX day

Atavacus

I'm no fan of Biden on a good day, but that was really the FTX scam really. It's not the same if we're going to be honest.

GasPasser73

I feel this very clearly. I’m in healthcare (subspecialty physician) and despite growth of our professional services income, our family’s level of comfort/conspicuous consumption has clearly degraded over the last 15 years. I was introduced to BTC first in 2013, refreshed in 2017, went in as a HODLr and even mining in 2021 until FTX/BlockFi erased 6 figures and 18 months of effort. Brutal. I’m refreshed now in 24-25 knowing that (besides a little known /s computer retailer) BTC is the only asymmetric asset left to protect my and my family’s future. Armed with the Bitcoin Standard I am now gently introducing my boomer parents to BTC and normalizing BTC and satoshis to my kids…

Muted-Main890

nah market is just overleveraged, same way bitcoin dropped cuz of FTX, it would drop anyways but the news just pushed it

Simke11

It wasn't pretty when FTX collapsed but it was a lot easier. We were in bear market, BTC hitting bear lows, buying was a no brainer. Now it's supposed time to be bull market time, yet last few months have been anything but.