GBTC

Nice_Collection5400

Fair point, GBTC skews things. Let’s back them out completely. Now it’s 2x inflows of mined BTC during the period (not 3x).

harvested

They hold it. You're forgetting GBTC existed for years?

LNCrizzo

I made a killing buying GBTC at a discount.

mcr55

Every solution besides holding your own coins has been disastrous for the past 15 years. Mt.Gox- RIP BlockFi-RIP GBTC- Lost double digit % FTX - RIP HODLing your own coins is the only long term solution.

oprahfinallykickedit

GBTC baby

ResponsibilitySea327

It is still early. But IMHO, long term MSTR will closer to an ETF/trust in terms of valuation with no NAV premium like GBTC before it. Possibly a discount once it faces real headwinds, again like GBTC did before it. In that sense it will be forced to be more like TradFi. At some point investors will want their skin back and Saykor (or his successor) will have to make it more investor friendly when it comes to owning the underlying BTC.

iamez221

Also interesting from the article: For the year to date, Bitcoin ETF flows remain positive at $215.2 million, despite the recent outflow trend. IBIT leads with $2.3 billion in net inflows for the year, while GBTC has experienced the largest outflows at $1.23 billion.

RANEDJ

Check Out $GBTC $BTC & Cheers

ShotgunShane286

GBTC (Green Bitcoin) hasn’t been rugged. Been out for a while but people keep buying into coins with high supply and getting rugged and just generally not understanding crypto or money at all. I do not care about use case or coins with a “community” Shib will go nowhere near $1. Marketcap and supply is what we should all look for in a crypto currency. Green Bitcoin was thought to be a scam in its pre-sale. And while it did lose 90% of its value in the months after its release it does have a staking website up and running and is tradable in your wallet. Currently around 11cents per coin. With a 20.81 million supply. (Roughly same as actual bitcoin) do the math. Not advice or saying people should buy it. Its just got potential is all to be roughly worth what bitcoin is due to its low coin count. Just needs a better marketing team.

Freedom_58

You are right that you have exposure to 1 BTC. But to be a whole coiner, you must at least own 1 Bitcoin. You can have .3 BTC in Coinbase, .5 in a cold wallet, and .2 in another wallet. Then you're a whole coiner. I have shares in MSTR FBTC IBIT GBTC(long story), etc. But I would categorize them as Bitcoin proxies. But I am a whole coiner because I do own at least 1 Bitcoin. Hope that helps.

jawni

because markets aren't perfectly efficient, if you think that's bad, greyscale's BTC trust (formerly GBTC pre-crypto ETFs) was pretty much never at it's NAV.

GrouchyAd9824

I bought it the minute it was released and wouldn't hold BTC any other way after GBTC converted. I used to buy GBTC in the bear markets for the discount and get around 2x leverage selling it in bull markets, but that's not a thing anymore. I've done self custody, exchanges, whatever since 2014. ETFs are the way to go IMO. Now I can only get nervous over the price rather than my holdings being lost or stolen.

Holicron78

The OP is obviously from Europe and we don't have the same prices as US * *VanEck Bitcoin ETN* (Xetra) has **1.00% fee** * *Fidelity Physical Bitcoin ETP* (Xetra) has **0.35% fee** * There is no GBTC in Europe The only one that challenged BlackRock after their launch was *WisdomTree Physical Bitcoin* (Xetra) with similar **0.15% fee** until the end of year

guns_n_limeritas

Yes. And not only that, but the market investments going up while everything else is tanking, are BTC ETFs such as GBTC (Greyscale), and BTC based companies like MSTR (Micro Strategy).

5FenwickRd

Central banks have been buying Gold. No I’m not a gold bug. The worldwide physical gold market $5-6 trillion. Bitcoin is still a peripheral asset as far as world banks are concerned. I do own IBIT and bought GBTC before it was an ETF.

ResponsibilitySea327

If you think about why they buy and sell -- there are two components. The number of outstanding shares of FBTC (e.g. demand of FBTC) that is irrespective of price -- people can buy and sell FBTC all day even if BTC doesn't move an inch. And then there is the component of the value of those shares that are a component of both number of issued shares and the underlying BTC/cash holdings. FBTC's prospectus is to match the performance of their proprietary average BTC price index -- basically a composite index of prices across multiple exchanges. To match that price, they have to buy and sell BTC as well as manage the formation or redemption of FBTC shares. As another poster mentioned, these are done in baskets (of 25,000 shares). Again the aim is match BTC performance. FBTC does self custody which is different than most other ETFs (GBTC used to self custody but now uses Coinbase Custody). They own approximately 195,888 BTC as of yesterday. In many ways it is cheaper to buy via a low cost ETF and avoid Exchange or DeFi fees which can be substantial. Transactional use of BTC is on a decline (with speculative use well up) so investing via an ETF is a good way to go

donmulatito

Actual banks 🤣 coinbase an actual bank? Or you mean the actual banks that caused all other financial crisis in the history of the world? There will always be people who push the envelope, or like subprime mortgages the whole industry pushing the envelope. What happened there? Why didn't the interest cover their losses? SBF's downfall was not that he lent too much, its was that the hedge funds he lent to stopped paying back their loans. Most of this was due to those hedge funds losing their ass on the GBTC arbitrage as the market started to turn.

3Puttz

I have moved all my stock holdings across my Roth, 401k and HSA into FBTC, IBIT, MSTR, and IBIT calls. I have private equity on the side and my wife’s 401k and Roth are mostly in traditional equities. I’m like 85% btc but combined we are weighted at 65% btc and btc related equities. I didn’t do it all at once though. Started with a small amount of GBTC and MSTR back in the day around 2021.

arioch376

Timing the market is dumb, but boy does it feel good. Finally sold off my GBTC I bought right before the etfs went live because inexplicably there was still a discount. Moved the cash over to an exchange to buy some genuine corn. When all was said and done sold at 90k, bought back at 78k. Feels good man.

bittenbycoin

For the time being it seems similar to the first few weeks after the ETFs were approved, bitcoin price spiked a bit then went down more than 20% from that spike, people were shaking there heads watup? they were pointing to GBTC as the culprit but others bought what GBTC sold so idk, but I wouldn't be shocked by a big turnaround in the not too distant future, or maybe after more than 2 years of up and sideways from 15k to 109k it's time for a deep breather, clear out some clutter time? Not financial advice.

Smile_And_Dance

I will “cash out” when they declare a capital gains holiday that applied to GBTC. I will sell it all and promptly reinvest it in the Bitcoin ETF with the lowest fee rate. Grayscale really needs to lower that rate. Just a matter of time before all their “lock ins” sell for lower rates.

Smile_And_Dance

How might this impact bitcoin ETFs? Would they also be capital gains tax free if held beyond 1 year? If so, GBTC is screwed, as everyone will sell and buy lower fee funds.

BottomTimer_TunaFish

I was able to long the big coins with leveraged ETFs, not on margin, during last week's crash using proceeds from selling GBTC at 108k Bitcoin and 17x profit from Palantir. It's retribution day for those who bought the dip.

kpooo7

YES, As a thank you on this dip I bought into IBIT vs. Grayscale GBTC in my 401, well and their fees are a bargain for now…

BottomTimer_TunaFish

Since the price touched down at 82k, I'm thinking anywhere between 82k-79k could be the bottom. I'm still up 6x on GBTC for this bull cycle. Just bought the dip by getting into BITU (2x lev ETF). Whether or not 82k is the bottom of this crash, this is where bulls would buy the dip.

Ok-Sympathy9768

Yup..dealing with banks can be a whole lotta BS. Happened to me on vacation and with major purchases… what is fucking nuts is the more responsible you are with your finances and the more money you have.. the more you are at risk of losing access to your money..it has to with software/ai monitoring for fraud…what a gigantic pain in the ass.. Gotten blocked from accessing my bag and it really was annoying. Best thing to do is use multiple institutions + have multiple cc processors ( example have at least 3 different cc processors one visa, one MC, one Amex or JCB.. example if a possible ai generated fraud alert pops up on one visa it will hit all your visas) + if married keep your finances separated… same thing with BTC..why have all your exposure in one place/ or single cold wallet? I ask myself what’s more likely to happen me lose keys or one of the institutions like blackrock, fidelity, GBTC, or arc losing them??? Back in the day GBTC made it so easy to invest and get bitcoin exposure.. buying shares was super easy in a tax advantaged account .. felt a lot safer too.. literally a couple keystrokes in the retirement account and bam I just bought shares equivalent to 10+ BTC at like around $5/share.. worry free…. And DCA was also easier.. at this point if the shtf with the ETFs.. say like an ftx .. It would probably crash Bitcoin .. the ETFs are the key to mass adoption.. which brings us full circle… spreading risk includes have a some in CS because an you really trust institutions .. but I am too much of a Fucktard to figure out how to do CS .. so I rely on institutions..

blyatspinat

GBTC, it has utility and is very undervalued

Financial_Design_801

Goldman Sachs has $2.3 billion in Bitcoin ETF exposure, per 13F SEC filings today. - IBIT: $1.9b - FBTC: $374m - GBTC: $3.6m Up from $710m in Q4 last year 👀 https://x.com/julian__fahrer/status/1889396972173533325?s=46&t=ihVglVXC0BQSbw6j57EoaA

CressMysterious8401

If you want crypto/Bitcoin exposure and to get paid while having exposure, you may want to research and consider converting some of your Bitcoin into a covered call Bitcoin ETF that pays a yield. For Bitcoin, the GBTC ETF is one strategy. If you want more leverage, MSTY is a MSTR covered call ETF with MSTR/Microstrategy/Strategy is essentially a Bitcoin holding company. Note that I am not a financial advisor and this is not financial advise. Also, covered call ETF yields/dividends are generally taxed at income tax rates. Finally, these are fairly new financial instruments that carry as much risk as crypto.

Ok_Firefighter4282

I didn't know GBTC has been around that long, TIL.

watch-nerd

Some of it leaves via BTC ETF sales and that doesn't get rotated into alts, but goes completely off chain into Trad Fi assets. When I sold some GBTC in my Roth IRA (tax free gains), I rotated that into stocks.

H2crypt0

Tariffs may have some contribution, but we have to remember that this highly volatile (crypto) market can be easily influenced by various external factors, such as global economic conditions, geopolitical tensions (tariffs), and investor sentiment. The current market is experiencing a downturn due to a combination of factors. A strong US dollar, fueled by higher-than-expected US retail sales and a rise in US Treasury yields, is exerting selling pressure on Bitcoin and other cryptocurrencies. Additionally, liquidations in the crypto market have led to a surge of sell-offs across the derivatives market, with over $137 million in long positions being liquidated in a 24-hour period. This sudden liquidation, coupled with a lack of buying pressure, has negatively impacted crypto market prices. Other factors contributing to the decline include the impact of crypto spot ETFs and GBTC activities, as well as regulatory uncertainty and delays in policy decisions concerning the cryptocurrency market.

probabletrump

I started at 50% three years ago with GBTC in my Roth. Since then it's floated between 50% and 75%. I will admit I occasionally peel a little off to buy stock in an aggressive tech company. My portfolio has largely been built on the back of bitcoin. It's quadrupled since I made the decision to invest three years ago.

moonRekt

I went for GBTC ETHE and GDLC when they were at a 35% or so discount, at least Grayscales make sense to me

Extra_Supermarket_29

In hong kong and china, we cannot buy btc directly, since the government ban all the larger trading platforms such as coinbase/ binance etc. government only provide very small platforms under their control. They also banned all Btc etf such as Ybtc, IBIT, GBTC We only can buy MSTR and BITO

AdamFitri2005

Have we gotten GBTC's numbers for yesterday, on farside it hasn't updated it yet

RemarkableShape8137

Bought 20 in April 2019 @ 4800 in a Roth BitIRA. USB key was kept in vault literally guarded by armed security guards in Fkn Vegas. 💩 in pants everyday  thinking about it. Sold all in March 2021 @61,000. Tranfered cash to personal Roth , sat on it for awhile then purchased  Closed end fund GBTC at 50% discount when btc fell to 17k in Jan 23. After GBTC converted to spot ETF the discount was gone and instantly doubled in value and then btc hit 69k again in Mar 24 Sold it all. Bought 42,000 shares of FBTC in Sept 24 @48 when btc was 56k . Sold 20 k shares yesterday at 106. Will hold on the remaining 21k shares until 2030. The key take for all of you is that everything was tax free. I strongly advise you put as much as you can afford in Roth IRA, convert a portion of your 401k to traditional ira then convert that to ROTH. Your older self will be skn ur younger selfs dck when u turn 59 1/2 and sitting on millions$$$$

flutter180

easily google/chatgpt-able information: 1. **Tesla** \- Tesla announced in **February 2021** that it had purchased **$1.5 billion** worth of Bitcoin and would begin accepting Bitcoin as payment for its cars. 2. **MicroStrategy** \- Led by CEO Michael Saylor, MicroStrategy aggressively adopted Bitcoin as its **primary treasury reserve asset**. \- By 2021, MicroStrategy had purchased **over 100,000 BTC**, investing billions and encouraging other companies to consider Bitcoin for treasury management. 3. **Square (now Block, Inc.)** \- Square, led by Jack Dorsey, invested **$50 million** in Bitcoin in late 2020 and expanded its position in early 2021. \- Square’s Cash App also supported Bitcoin transactions, further enabling mainstream adoption. 4. **PayPal** \- PayPal allowed its users to **buy, hold, and sell Bitcoin** (and other cryptocurrencies) directly on its platform starting in **late 2020**, but 2021 saw an expansion into allowing crypto payments at millions of merchants. 5. **Visa and Mastercard** \- Both **Visa** and **Mastercard** announced initiatives in 2021 to integrate cryptocurrency into their payment networks. \- Visa, for instance, began settling transactions using USDC (a stablecoin), while Mastercard announced partnerships with crypto companies to offer crypto payment cards. 6. **Goldman Sachs and Morgan Stanley** \- These major financial institutions began offering **Bitcoin investment products** to their high-net-worth clients. \- Goldman Sachs also reopened its cryptocurrency trading desk in **2021** after shutting it down in 2018. 7. **Coinbase IPO** \- Coinbase, one of the largest cryptocurrency exchanges, went public via a direct listing on NASDAQ in April 2021. 8. **Grayscale Bitcoin Trust (GBTC)** \- Grayscale’s Bitcoin Trust saw immense institutional interest as a way for investors to gain exposure to Bitcoin without directly holding it.

jorgehn12

I started buying GBTC since it was below $8

BoomerSooner-SEC

It’s just simple. There are fees but I’m just not tech savvy enough to navigate all this self storage stuff. (I’m sort of old). I’ve had GBTC for a few years now. The fees are high but I’m sort of trapped.

OffThread

Yes, every single one of you should have a small amount going into any of the bitcoin ETFs within a ROTH 401k. GBTC has the largest fee, but their all 'comparable' beyond that.

cyger

That is what I did in 2015, well maybe it was 3% of my IRA, I put into GBTC. Now it makes up 80% of my portfolio. Best financial move of my life so far, holding on through all the ups and downs.

Ok-Sympathy9768

🙄… yeah …get BTC exposure via BTC ETFs, before that GBTC and make millions in a Roth taxed advantaged account .. terrible idea…

Herosinahalfshell12

Why is there a constant outflow from GBTC like every day people keep wanting to exit because of the fees. What's stopping it all from flowing out at once? What are the circumstances from someone who sells tomorrow why aren't they just selling today?

Herosinahalfshell12

Why is there a constant outflow from GBTC like every day people keep wanting to exit because of the fees. What's stopping it all from flowing out at once? What are the circumstances from someone who sells tomorrow why aren't they just selling today?

2CommaNoob

Yep, there is no reason to hold GBTC over the others because of the expenses: GBTC 1.5% FBTC .25% IBIT .12%

ChaoticDad21

GBTC expense ratio is absurd. I hold FBTC and BITB.

Xavimoose

Care to elucidate? I don’t own any gbtc but i was looking into efts and ibit and GBTC caught my eye.

ChaoticDad21

Get the fuck out of GBTC and into literally any other ETF

jk3639

Fucking GBTC smh

JashBeep

MSTR stock is valued at roughly 3x the value of all the bitcoin they hold. Sometimes that's referred to as a premium to 'net asset value'. They issue new stock and sell it because it's "overvalued". They then use 100% of the proceeds to buy bitcoin. Each time they do this, they improve the amount of bitcoin per share that all existing stock holders have while also bringing down the value of the stock (since they issued new stock just like a money printer). I said theoretically because what has happened in practice is the underlying value of MSTR increases because a) they get more bitcoin and b) the price of bitcoin moves up due to MSTR buying off the market. This is why people are saying it's an "infinite money glitch". The higher the premium, the more they can do this. The confusing thing is why is MSTR valued at 3x the Bitcoin value. If you can buy bitcoin directly you could get 100% of your $ invested as bitcoin. However, if you can't do that because you're an institution that can't buy commodities or can't custody bitcoin, your next best option is to buy the ETFs. They attract a small annual fee, which is not ideal. Or you could buy MSTR and get \~33% exposure to bitcoin, no fees, and be invested in a company that uses "intelligent leverage" to acquire bitcoin. I think a lot of people are waiting for the stock to come down in price so that the premium is much smaller (like maybe 10% instead of 200%) but they may not be prepared to see the price of bitcoin rise up (if bitcoin 3x price then MSTR is valued appropriately). Of course the conundrum is if bitcoin went 3x you would probably expect MSTR stock to go ballistic as well. I don't own MSTR and not planning to buy it, but would consider if the premium ever went negative again. A similar (but different) thing happened with GBTC back in 2021-2023 it was initially trading at a premium to NAV during the BTC runnup and then went to a negative to NAV during the bear market.

kpooo7

Some are - some are not, me 61, gym 5-6 days per week actively mange my 401, been investing in GBTC dips since 2021, up over 150%….

ProfessorThom

Other than crypto, my portfolio is incredibly boring. I realize I essentially hit the lottery buying GBTC back in 2016, so I'd go index funds like the rest of what I own. My dabbling in penny stocks and the like was not successful at all, so I don't see a need to fritter the profits away,

Secret_Operative

My IRA and Roth both have bitcoin ETF shares, and before that they were in GBTC. It's quite amazing how much those accounts have grown in the last few years.

RandoStonian

GBTC only turned into an ETF in the last year or so. Fidelity was definitely letting people (like myself) put self-directed 401k money into GBTC at least as of 3-4 years ago.

Tasty-Window

ya well 401k had the tax benefits, but I tried to put it in bitcoin like 8 years ago and they wouldn't let me. I think the ETF at the time was GBTC or something.

_526

For sure. I feel like a few years ago around the time GBTC came out people viewed the ETFs a bit more negatively.

SmoothGoing

Blockfi was more about paying interest on bitcoin than giving out loans. They took bitcoin to grayscale, exchanged it for GBTC shares at cost, waited out the hold period then sold shares when it enjoyed a fat premium. That did not work out for them. There is no easy secure way to do this. No they don't want your keys that you also know, you will send bitcoin to THEIR keys. They might do whatever with those coins, run off to Angola maybe. Interest rates on those loans are pretty high too. And if the price moves down fast you do get liquidated which a) sells at a bad time at worst price b) locks in a taxable event.

johnnyBuz

Even if MSTR eventually trades back to par with NAV, he’s still incentivized to continue issuing convertible debt as long as the premium to NAV is >0%, and to further front run the rest of the Magnificent-7 (and sovereigns for that matter) to build an insurmountable lead that could conceivably pay dividends for generations. So at the current 3x it’s a no-brainer to keep the convertible debt gravy train going, and debt markets are far larger than equity markets so this could continue for quite awhile. But yah, I’m bummed I didn’t personally allocate anything in my Roth IRA to MSTR. It was in GBTC for years since March 2020 and then I swapped it for FBTC once Fidelity launched their ETF. But come next bear market, I will put a healthy chunk into MSTR, especially if it ever trades at a discount to NAV which is more or less how the bitcoin market bottoms (when STH-price trades below LTH-price or realized cap).

Anon_Bitcoin_Dude

4.84 BTC and still around 5 in GBTC. 

Defusion55

Love seeing GBTC holders still selling despite all the others buying. such a beautiful thing haha

probabletrump

I did something similar. Did GBTC got a really nice pop when it converted to ETF (was trading at a discount to BTC when I bought) switched to FBTC, switched later to IBIT because of fees. Don't see any reason to be in one or the other besides which has the lowest fees.

Interesting-Pin1433

I took a bit of a risk with GBTC back when Bitcoin was under $20k, before ETFs were approved. IIRC it was a "trust" at the time. Switched to FBTC for lower fees. Incredible tax free gains in my IRA

FiB_VIKING

They were arguing with me few weeks ago that all the BTC ETF inflows were from GBTC.. when I wanted to provide data and correct information then I was banned for "not using a flair" I mean cmmoonn! :D They mods are pretty ignorant and want to keep their community in their own eco-chamber.

Shaglock

Grayscale is filing for SOL ETF. It’s going to dump so hard for a couple of months then, same shit like GBTC and ETHE.

GeneralZex

It’s wild to me that Vanguard allowed me to buy GBTC before Bitcoin ETFs became a thing and now they don’t allow buying it or any of the other Bitcoin ETFs.

El_Peregrine

Told them 4+ years ago, which was serendipitous - my mother was moving her retirement account to a new advisor. He was recommending GBTC the time, and they’ve told me they would have declined to work with the guy had they not had discussions with me about it.  So my mom - retired school nurse - has ended doing nearly 10x her money with that and MSTR. She can’t believe it. Recently donated some highly appreciated shares to a soup kitchen, too. 

johnnyBuz

Yes. I’ve onboarded roughly 10 family and friends in 2020 all for $20-30k so they are all whole-coiners now sitting on at least $100k in Bitcoin. My proudest achievement was getting my dad to allow me to buy $20k worth of GBTC in his Roth IRA in March 2020 when Bitcoin dipped below $5000 — so he’s got about 4 BTC now in a tax-free IRA which will significantly increase his retirement nest egg in the years to come.

alfa-ace1

I’d recommend companies such as Celsius, Blockfi or Genesis Capital , lol Now talking seriously, the securest way to borrow against your BTC is owning BTC ETF. I own GBTC and IBIT and in both you can borrow against your position (special maintenance of 50%, while most of common stocks’ maintenance is 30%).

Efficient_Reach8656

I don’t actually own any bitcoin I own a lot of GBTC and bought it when it was low. My cost basis is like $27.30. Been buying since March of 2020. Have made a decent amount but nothing life changing or even close to it

Defusion55

Thank God the other 11 ETF's went live with GBTC converting to an ETF. GBTC selling off 400k coins over the year would have been brutal without the others absorbing most of the selling.

Secret_Operative

What's shocking about this? GBTC wasn'tan ETF and because of the weird model, it carried a huge discount or premium over spot. Not exactly what investors want to deal with.

Secret_Operative

I would like to thank Bitcoin, and GBTC for where my IRA is today. All these latecomer ETFs also great. Thanks to all of them :)

Financial_Design_801

[US spot bitcoin ETFs (ex. GBTC) hold $100bn in AUM.](https://www.reddit.com/r/Bitcoin/s/TSRlm06Yvn) Shocking because GBTC has been around since 2015, first as a closed end fund (then open with ETF uplisting)

LiveFreelyOrDie

I still love my GBTC

greenskeeper01234

Thanks for chiming in. Brad was very specific about 5 or 6 crypto's being in this "basket ETF." And I'm pretty sure he's referring to the NYSE—just like the many Bitcoin ETFs that are listed currently (IBIT, GBTC, FBTC, etc.).

cryptolipto

They are absolutely borrowing money to buy bitcoin, otherwise known as leverage. I’m not sure if they will cause a grayscale like implosion but it’s possible? This is slightly different than what grayscale was doing with 3AC and GBTC premium.

HSuke

These are futures contracts, not spot ETFs. They're supposed to represent the price of GBTC 6 months from now. Buying GBTC during premium is pretty risky, and almost as bad as buying MSTR at a premium.

HSuke

The GBTC premium bubble is like pocket change compared to the premium that MSTR has. When it implode, it's going to hurt.

HSuke

> The biggest scam this cycle has been getting newbies to invest in shitty memes + centralized VC chains Uh. That was even bigger last cycle. Biggest concern is this cycle is the MSTR premium and bubble that's even worse than the GBTC premium last cycle.

Armadillodillodillo

It can trade under NAV in certain scenarios, like GBTC did.

The_Realist01

Shareholders don’t really have the same claims to the company’s btc as did GBTC though. It’s different.

Rydog_78

His stock will be trading like the GBTC trade. At times it will trade at a premium and other times it will trade at a discount

SmoothGoing

No that was tokenized GBTC. That's dead. You can only sell shares now, can't exchange them for bitcoin.

Ok-Sympathy9768

I do similar last year during the holidays.. told a relative during a holiday gathering.. I said “you see what bitcoin is doing? It’s going up you should look into getting yourself some, or even get some exposure through GBTC .. I’d kicking myself if BTC doubles, or even hits 100k and I didn’t get in on the action ” … holidays season gathering will be interesting this year .. told another relative pre election this year in September when it dropped into the 50s .. get some bitcoin now.. this will be like buying SoCal beach front property in the 1940s and 50s..said the same to very close friend and he laughed at me..and .. nah I’m fine with my 5% return in money market.. these were the last times I’ll be mentioning it to them.. if they ask.. Ill just say I closed my investment and took the profits

douginrpb

Same here. I’m 67 and got into Bitcoin a while back. Really has made for a secure retirement. All bc in cold storage, got burned with some apps and learned the hard way. Also got into GBTC thru broker and have done really well. Us seniors rock! Back and forth, but we rock. Now get the hell off my lawn.

douginrpb

Same here. I’m 67 and got into Bitcoin a while back. Really has made for a secure retirement. All bc in cold storage, got burned with some apps and learned the hard way. Also got into GBTC thru broker and have done really well. Us seniors rock! Back and forth, but we rock. Now get the hell off my lawn.

GBeastETH

I bought $MSTR one year ago when my broker refused to sell me $GBTC. Incredible stroke of luck! Up 635% to date!

mikael7878

GBTC 💯

microwavesan

Can you elaborate on why not GBTC?

SmoothGoing

Yes, but probably not GBTC. Holding keys in IRA is somewhat complicated, and comes with some fees. You can offset gains with losses or be under the limit for 0% LT gains tax bracket.

Financial_Design_801

In a 13F filing today, Goldman Sachs disclosed the following positions as of September 30: $461 million IBIT (12,769,510 shares, an 83% increase from the previous filing in August) $95.5 million FBTC (1,720,291 shares, a 13% increase from the previous filing ) $71.8 million GBTC (1,423,069 shares, a 116% increase from the previous filing) $59.7 million BTCO (940,443 shares, unchanged from the previous filing) $22.5 million BITB (650,961 shares, a 156% increase from the previous filing) There are also several smaller BTC ETF positions in today’s filing. Note: This 13F filing covers all of Goldman Sachs, not just the internal asset management business. The discretion designation on all the above positions is Goldman Sachs & Co. LLC. Filing: https://www.sec.gov/edgar/search/#/q=Bitcoin&dateRange=custom&category=custom&entityName=Goldman%2520Sachs&startdt=2024-11-14&enddt=2024-11-14&forms=13F-HR Source: https://twitter.com/macroscope17/status/1857207080282673430?s=46&t=ihVglVXC0BQSbw6j57EoaA

JazzlikeEmotion7367

Never hurt to take some profit. I'm glad you didn't sell all of it. One time I had a lot of GBTC in my IRA and it doubled so I sold half. Then it 3x so I sold the other half. Then it went up 10X and I still think about how dumb it was to sell all of it.

LiveFreelyOrDie

You can invest BTC in a Roth via ETF. It doesn’t have to track perfectly, I’m still happy with GBTC. Of course 49% annual growth is probably not sustainable, but in the long run, yes I think it will outperform the S&P.

DPSK7878

I'm buying a property in the next 6 months. Had already started cashing out partial MSTR and GBTC. 1 year holding is a big gamble to hold BTC.

GBeastETH

Merrill Lynch would not let me buy $GBTC or any crypto ETF so I bought $MSTR instead. Turns out to have been an incredible stroke of luck. Up 600% in one year.

Hwoarangatan

Suppose you bought GBTC in your Roth IRA at vanguard. Then they decided their clients can't buy these any more, only sell. So years later when the ETFs came out, you want to trade your old ETFs for the new spot ETFs. Vanguard won't do that for you, so you have to transfer your whole account to Fidelity.

HerboClevelando

Or you can use your Fidelity personal or 401(k) brokerage account to buy one of the Bitcoin ETFs (FBTC, GBTC, etc.)

Herosinahalfshell12

Will GBTC ever be drained?

Canik716kid

This! And that's the beauty of never having the need to sell my crypto...I hedge with indirect exposure in GBTC and BTC (mini trust fund) . I need to divest, I sell shares, not coin 🪙😉