EV

vandalizethethief

I would have lost a lot of money (I did) not believing Elon. He never delivers on his promises but no one ever cared with Tesla. No semi, cheap economy EV. Roadster 2, FSD w/ no AI (Another Indian ready to take over) and the list goes on. They stopped caring about vehicles & are making robots and everyone just shrugged. 🤷 He has been bulletproof. HE SIEG HEILED AT A PRESIDENTIAL RALLY.

Mimir_the_Younger

We actually did this. Sorta smelled it coming and we’re in SoCal. Have had the solar and battery for two or three years, but we finally roared an EV in May because this is the most telegraphed energy shock in human history. Stock up on beef, frozen veggies, etc.

Nerfarean

Already here in Cali. Solar + EV + battery wins

Jzeeee

Difficult and expensive part of EV is the battery, which China leads in producing at mass scale and cost due to entire supply chain being within the country. The main selling point are the features Chinese EV offer at their cost that western companies can't compete. German EV brands can't compete cause they don't make their own batteries at large scales to reduce cost.

moonspeakdj

You're making a hasty generalization. You're absolutely right that building a rocket is not the same difficulty as building an EV, but that doesn't mean China can't catch up with or outpace SpaceX. There's many other factors on both ends besides difficulty that can impede or accelerate progress for either one. Like OP said, China has the political will and money to do whatever it takes to try to win this race.

billypalmier

If it's debt-driven… are these core sustainable earnings or a cycle bump? EV/S for most companies above 2000 levels… just saying.

Latter_Olive_6801

Hey there. You've written three thousand words to avoid noticing that you're risking $457 to make $42. That's 1:10.76. You need eleven wins to pay for one loss. At your own 96%, the odds of stringing eleven straight together is about 64%. So there's a one in three chance you eat the loss before you've even funded it. That's the number your write-up never does. And the whole thing hangs on that 96% being right to within a couple of points. Drop it to 92% and the edge is gone. Tail probabilities are exactly where models are least trustworthy, and you've bet the entire trade on one being precise. Three things your own analysis is telling you and you're not listening: Your HMM says bear at 30% confidence while bull is the single highest state at 60%. That's a model shrugging, and you've read it as a bear signal. VIX 15, positive curve, SPY 9% over its 200-day, breadth bullish, put/call volume 0.236 (extreme call dominance), unusual options activity flagged. That is a bullish tape and bullish flow and you are selling calls into it. And nobody's said this: you expire 21 August. MSFT reports late July. You are holding short calls through earnings on an AI mega-cap. That is precisely the bullish catalyst you identified as the only thing that kills you, and it's not a tail risk, it's a scheduled event you've booked yourself into. Also $42.50 credit on a $5 wide spread — slippage on both legs in and out will eat a real chunk of that. When your edge is forty quid, the bid-ask matters. It's not that the EV is negative on paper. It's that the paper is doing all the work, and one earnings gap undoes a year of it.

DiamondOfThePine

There other most is US government contracts. The US isn’t going to use Chinese rockets to send payloads up. This gives SpaceX a level of stability. But if China and now Japan are able to make reusable rockets, then SpaceX’s growth potential is severally limited. Private companies and other countries will probably switch to Chinese rockets eventually the way international buyers have switched to Chinese EV’s or Chinese solar panels.

Qwertagone

Oh for sure. No one can compete with tesla, they pioneered the EV, other car manufacturers would never be able to catch up to tesla, right? - Everyone and their grandmom ca. 2016.

creepy_doll

Making electric engines is a lot easier than ICE. Also the batteries are the largest chunk of an electric car, and that part china did master while manufacturing for tesla etc. The precision machining equipment for making modern ICE engines is really quite impressive. I think ICE engines are cool as hell(imagine harnessing the power of explosions to such precision), but it doesn't make sense for china to try to get better at that. They're developing the infrastructure for EV's and they don't need to spend all the money on getting their ICE tech up to scratch.

zmagickz

true space stocks are basically EV stocks and SPCX / TSLA is the only relevant one for memes only

Master-Weight-2676

There's a 2011 interview where Musk was laughing about BYD. It didn't age well. He thought he had already won the EV race back then too.

SuspiciousSpyderman

Laughs in EV

Fresh-Judge-4595

Wow, oil futures are mooning. If you don't drive an EV you can ride the bus broski

Logical_Lie6478

We are buying our first EV this fall for this very reason. Tired of being held hostage by the petrodollar and manufactured oil and gas crises

Saeonic

You know, If we all switch to EV we won't need middle eastern oil anyway, Iran Shmyran.

terminalguy007

Six years and a 90% loss on NIO is a genuinely difficult position to be in, and the sunk-cost framing is worth examining carefully. The psychological pull to hold is strong — the brain doesn't want to "lock in" the loss — but the relevant question is never what the stock has done to you. It's what the stock is going to do from here, with no memory of your cost basis. NIO as a business has deteriorated significantly since 2020. Revenue has grown, but the company has never been profitable, free cash flow has been consistently negative, and the competitive environment in Chinese EVs has intensified dramatically — BYD and domestic players are in a price war NIO is structurally disadvantaged to win. The thesis that made NIO exciting in 2020 (premium EV brand, battery swap differentiation, growth at any price) hasn't translated into durable economics six years later. The $700 position you have now isn't tied to a business on the verge of a turnaround — it's tied to a company still burning cash in a more competitive market than when you bought in. The practical framework: ask yourself if you would buy NIO at today's price with fresh capital. If the honest answer is no, you already have your decision — you're just not acting on it because of anchoring to the original purchase price. The $6,000 loss is real whether you sell or not. The question is only whether the remaining $700 has better expected return in NIO or redeployed elsewhere. Tax-loss harvesting is also worth considering — at your income level going into dental school, realizing the loss this year could have real value depending on your other income and gains.

visionarymind

Is a car company when the EV narrative works for them, is everything but a car company when deliveries in the 🚽 Undefeated 🗿

SageMaverick

The Chinese have: Found ways to develop lower-cost AI models, putting pressure on lofty valuations of American AI companies. Successfully demonstrated reusable rocket technology, challenging the perception that SpaceX has no serious competitor. Built dominant positions in critical minerals, batteries, and EV manufacturing, increasing competitive pressure on key U.S. industries. US stock market valuation is fucked

LuckyDuckyCheese

Another negative about these strategies is that the high win rate (assuming deep OTM CSPs) can cover up how bad the strategy actually is for a long time. Imagine you're selling insurance for clients that have 1% probability of breaking a leg, in which case you'd have to pay out 100. Fair value of that insurance should be at last 1, but even if you sell it for 0.5, it may take years before your customer actually breaks a leg, during which time you may be completely fine. This is why thetagang may look like geniuses for long stretches of time, while running a strategy with garbage EV.

MundaneOrdinary7493

Did you buy puts? Vertical spreads? It was obvious, but I've been wrong before about things I thought were very obvious. I did buy a bear-spread on spcx and made 16k about an week after the ipo. That was not the point of what I said though, sometimes people want to put money on stupid things to chase a dream, knowing it may not be very profitable. Smart people know casino bets are -EV, and still do for fun sometimes.

Madmagician-452

Not just biotech but EV startups

StephenMorphIQ

Externalizing the decision process is useful. I’d separate hard risk constraints from signal confirmations, though. RSI, MACD, moving averages, Bollinger bands, support/resistance, and breakout volume are mostly transformations of the same price and volume history. Agreement among them can make one underlying signal look like six independent votes. Likewise, “3 of 5 models agree” only means something if the models are calibrated out of sample and their errors aren’t strongly correlated. I’d also be careful making “positive EV” and half-Kelly checklist assertions. Kelly sizing is extremely sensitive to the estimated edge. For an options trade, I’d size against scenario loss under spot gaps and volatility changes first, then treat an ATR stop as an execution tool rather than a guaranteed loss boundary. For each item, I’d ask: is this a true constraint, an independent signal, or a risk control, and what evidence shows that adding it improves the process? More gates always produce fewer trades, but not necessarily better ones.

Ridge_Capital

Huge thanks for your comment! I try to select value with growth, that's what I think has the most EV. You mentioned: 'I wouldn't make it the entire portfolio. Something can be at a 5 year low and seem cheap but if it doesn't have a catalyst it can go to a 10 year low' — How would you avoid that?

Dabbler_much

Google, Microsoft, Amazon, Meta & Apple. Fortress businesses that will do well in AI best case scenario, & will survive relatively well even if AI crashes & burns. Nvidia is great and essential currently but will crash the hardest on any capex slowdown scare. Tesla is vibes imo, lost EV leadership after years of over promising & is now overpromising on robotics, rockets and what not.

billypalmier

Markets have a bullish bias. No broker, investment banker, ETF peddler, fund slinger, debt hustler wins being bearish. It’s an entire industry of people without skin in the game making money through fees. This industry might be bearish sometimes but that’s just to rotate into something else, but they’ll never say get out of the market. Right now retail participation is at all times high as well as EV/S for several benchmarks. That’s all you need to know. There’s no way telling when what could happen though. That’s the data you need to deal with.

Saeonic

There is a real Market Opportunity for Classic Cars to come back as EV. There are some neat kits for Volkswagen Bugs, would be cool if they could come back as a "Lightning Bug"

Fission-235

Yes this bull market will last forever. It was proven in the other Planet Earth in some multiverse millions of years ago. I’ve been in communication with one of their earthlings via SpaceX communications. Once the S&P out paces commodities for a record 16 years straight, there is no reversing it. It has too much inertia. At this point the “ other earth “ realized they didn’t need any more oil and all products and industries related to oil and oil refining. That earth was able to replace all gas cars on earth with electric cars that outpaced the diminishing oil production due to a lack of exploration during said 15 years. And their Middle East war also helped to drastically reduce oil production and SPRs. Those who could not afford a new EV were just given one to them by their government free of charge. This had no effect on the government fiscal policies and balance sheets. I’ll get into that soon. And since all refining ceased, there was no more mining capabilities due to the lack of sulfuric oxide which is a bye product of refining oil. Since they also had a growing need for Silver, Copper, Nickel, Lithium, Cobalt, Molybdenum, etc… which supported all the needs of their S & P tech companies, they just simply used sea water to solve all their needs. The sea water possess all the capacitance, conductivity and resistance (simultaneously 🤔 ) while providing its own power by splitting H from O in the water. Yet materials never degraded or lost performance. Everybody stopped eating food because there was no more nitrates produced during oil refining processes. They simply switched to Soylent Green. I don’t know what this is, but it sounds amazing according to my multiverse friend. Since debt was at an all time high for all countries, all the countries just decided to accept this as the new norm and wipe the slate clean for one another. This included credit card debt too. It was very generous of all the private institutions that ran a clean balance sheet to simply accept this process where they had already invested in other countries and other companies debt. Even though this devalued or wiped out their investment with the other over leveraged companies, countries and individual people, these profitable private entities were willing to accept this just to keep the S&P in that perpetual bull market. No currency ever got devalued moving forward. Put all your money in the S&P and just forget about it. And look forward to the new superfood Soylent Green.

rain168

That’s why institutions are throwing money into EV companies like Rivian…

Funny_Requirement166

EV took a backseat with AI on the wheel.

Grateful5150

Yeah that’s how tariffs are supposed be. Targeted. Thats not anti Chinese. That is pro American EV production. 

InvestitorPraduitor

People have already started to use cars less (at least in countries where public transport and/or cycling is an option) alongside an accelerated EV adoption. Also, let's not ignore the fact that 80% of oil production worldwide doesn't go through the strait. There's plenty of options that will get us through this. And honestly, it seems like there's no other choice now, the Iranians broke the truce after getting a very good deal and humiliating the US, whether we like it or not, there's no path forward, the US were in the wrong for starting this war, but they accepted a humiliating peace and the Iranians still chose to continue the war.

ChaseballBat

The lack of dropped interest rate hasnt effected you? Electricity prices havent gone up? Hope you werent looking into a an EV any time soon. Must not own a condo/townhome in a metro area, H1B1 restrictions have caused a ripple effect that has seen massive price slashes in those homes. But dont worry the rising inflation and interest rates will be perfect for new developer so you'll find a home eventually. I envy the lifestyle you must have that avoids being impacted by tariffs and rising gas prices. But yea I am sure you thought all this through.

MakeMaxousMaxed

QS is a safer bet than SLS. And likely higher upside as well. They have the highest quality product, partnered with the best manufacturers in their respective fields, 300 patents, a battery that works, and are the closest to the finish line in terms of scalable manufacturing. Once the Eagle Line is confirmed, it will be too late. I also know it’s just rumor, but I believe Tesla will be announced as their Pure EV play OEM when it’s all said and done. The bread crumbs are there.

Joepool11

Manufacturing cars or energy is never going to be a high margin business. You need a monopoly with solid IP protection to be a high margin business. Same for robotaxi 'dominance'. No evidence they wont have competition driving down prices. You need something like the dominant social media company, the dominant search engine, the dominant operating system etc to charge high margins. They have already lost their global EV advantage, the only thing keeping them aflot in the US is chinese EV tariffs. 

SpicyElixer

Yet they consistently rank number one in owner satisfaction. I’m not a rivian fan and don’t own the stock, but it’s a new car maker. They will improve. Consumer reports: 2020 Tesla Model Y 36/100 2026 Tesla Model Y 81/100 “Best EV Top Pick”

midweastern

If you need the money or don't think the company has a future worth investing in, just sell and take the loss. You can claim the full capital loss up to like $3,500 and carry the remainder forward. FWIW I really like NIO at current prices and would buy more. Apart from BYD, they're best poised to capture international EV market share and are already sold in Scandanavia.

dudeatwork77

Sounds fun! I’m actually quite optimistic about China. They seem to be very strong in tech and production. Battery EV solar etc. I’ve been putting all my new money into VXUS. I know that’s not China focused but I figure their pie will grow as their public companies grow.

cuteman

> It is also entering a very complex geopolitical and competition when it comes to Space stuff. Yes, very complex like SpaceX revolutionizing the industry and reducing launch costs by 1-2 orders of magnitude. >Spacex in AI stuff is way behind. Behind whom for what? Google and Anthropic, two market leaders in the category are now leasing their facilities and Meta is following suit offering their data center remanent. >I am kinda surprised how Musk missed that, being so immersed in relevant FSD tech. Either he really was not that interested or saw the FSD only as a way to scam money and not actually relevant for the future. Otherwise he should've seen bottlenecks forming in the chip trade. How are the two related? xAI colossus was the fastest AI data center ever, Jensen of Nvidia himself praised it. you're looking at this wrong. Elon doesn't have to win on LLM, Model, etc to get a huge piece of the AI pie. >So he missed the mark a lot this time. He is kinda in a hole with Spacex, why the fuck did he step into the AI datacenter pile? Because a lot of really smart people believe space data centers for AI are the future for which SpaceX leads. >I bet he could've done the same valuation with pure space+starlink play and this way all of the dilution could add into the musical chair play of flashy stuff and renderings of mars bases. Now it actually has to be used to purchase way overpriced chips and this my friend forces him back to planet earth every time. I'm sure you know better than EV/Rocket man

purplecatfishbettie

ambitious: "Hyperscale Data, Inc. owns and manages a data center and provides mission-critical products for the defense and aerospace, industrial, automotive, telecommunications, medical and biopharma, and textile industries. It operates through the following segments: Sentinum, Energy and Infrastructure, AGREE, Gresham, TurnOnGreen, Technology and Finance, and ROI. The Sentinum segment involves crypto asset mining operations, colocation and hosting services for emerging AI ecosystems and other industries, and digital asset treasury activities. The Energy and Infrastructure segment involves crane rental and lifting solutions provider for oilfield, construction, commercial and infrastructure markets. The AGREE segment involves hotel operations and other commercial real estate holdings. The Gresham segment involves defense solutions with operations conducted by Enertec, Relec, Microphase and Giga-tronics. The TurnOnGreen segment involves commercial electronics solutions with operations conducted by Digital Power, and electric vehicle (“EV”) charging solutions through TOG Technologies. The Technology and Finance segment involves commercial lending and trading through Ault Lending. The ROI segment involves askROI, which operates OnlyBulls, a consumer-facing financial research and market intelligence platform developed and operated by askROI as well as ROI’s own operations. The company was founded by Milton C. Ault III in 1969 and is headquartered in Las Vegas, NV." despite all the past dilution, it might be worth buying a bit...

gatsby209

I would offset capital gains with it. So for example, suppose you sell another stock and make a $1,000 profit. Usually, you’d have to pay tax on that during tax time. But instead right after you sell for a $1,000 profit, sell off $1,000 of NIO stock. That way you get to keep that $1,000 you just made and you won’t have to pay any taxes on it. Repeat until you no longer have any NIO stock. (Then, buy a few shares at a much lower cost basis on the off chance we get another EV hype cycle and it 10x)

Such-Distance4019

I had NIO. I sold @ a loss years ago, thanks God. I doubt EV is coming back, but what do I know. S&P will give you better return than holding on to NIO. SPY would have given you more than 70% return on your investment in the past 5 years.

sonofalando

It’s the Iran war never ends It will accelerate electrification and reduction in dependence on oil. Of course, oil will always be needed but it can be reduced en masse. We’ll see a resurgence of stocks like ENPH. If electricity gets expensive enough you’ll see more residential houses begin purchasing solar and more people reducing their reliance on fuel. You’ll see more push for electrification of logistics fleets via EV technology. This is the opposite of what saudis want by the way. They know the writing is on the wall. 🥭 has somehow pushed the economy even closer to a green energy boom. 😂

sonofalando

It will accelerate electrification and reduction in dependence on oil. Of course, oil will always be needed but it can be reduced en masse. We’ll see a resurgence of stocks like ENPH. If electricity gets expensive enough you’ll see more residential houses begin purchasing solar and more people reducing their reliance on fuel. You’ll see more push for electrification of logistics fleets via EV technology. This is the opposite of what saudis want by the way. They know the writing is on the wall. 🥭 has somehow pushed the economy even closer to a green energy boom. 😂

Remote-Ranger-7721

Sounds suboptimal in terms of EV unless you’re retiring in the next decade

Superb_Departure7082

When China does these kinds of priorities it usually means they go all in. Look what they did to the EV market in a few years. They OBLITERATED competition

Formal-Option-4405

My EV: bzzzzzzzzzzzz

MNSoaring

As someone who lives in the Midwest, but grew up in California: this tracks. One other thing: not a single EV maker has conquered the range loss when it’s -20F up here. People up here are waiting for a 400+ range car so that they can still make 200miles when it’s -20. Also, there are no chargers along the gunflint trail. How to EV makers expect people to take their canoes to the boundary waters?!?

blingblingmofo

To be fair most the other US EV makers that IPO’d in the last decade went bankrupt - Lordstown motors, Fisker, Nikola, Canoo, and Mullen. Only Tesla, Rivian, and Lucid have survived

charliekirkbread

Stop gambling retirement bags, it’s not rocket science . Options and futures are negative EV instruments

cuteman

That were available to every other mfg which they couldn't seem to capitalize on, let alone make profitable? Tesla makes more per vehicle than most brands while the largest car companies are writing down their EV businesses and canceling full EV models even with rebates. Wild! How was Tesla able to succeed where Toyota, Ford, Honda, BMW, Mercedes, etc couldn't?

cuteman

Not all. I see a lot of face value analysis on LinkedIn that is insightful and doesn't contain bias like the "EV Space man bad" stuff you see on reddit and other low brow social media

Smok3dSalmon

Proof that people are sleeping on Ford. Those cars were FOMO because California required everyone to sell EVs by 2020. Also the Y was the most popular EV. The MachE was just designed on spreadsheets. But they’re moving away from MachE and Lightning. Also, the people who green lit those vehicles are gone.

Regular-Hotel892

It is widely known that this is true actually, selling volatility is +EV. You do have to be able to dodge the blowouts though

LordFaquaad

Still don't understand given its making profit on cars unlike many other EV makers / EV operations of legacy automakers. But sure

LordFaquaad

Can you explain this. Idk anything about the factory process but when I went to go EV shopping, the MY was pretty competitively priced especially with the discounts they run

tacobellbandit

“Let’s take a beloved muscle car classic, but hear me out guys, we revive it! We remove everything that is remotely reminiscent of the classic. Now make it an EV, yes yes and now, make it a 4 door family hatchback! Make it oversized and bubbly, the more airbags the better, we don’t need any more driver visibility. SLAP A FUCKIN IPAD IN THE DASH” \-car manufacturers for some reason. Seriously what the hell I want to know if anyone here has one of these, just why?

SnooHedgehogs5162

I miss old times when EV cars, chargers and green energy stocks stocks were rallied up like 3000%

YourChildhood5762

There is legitimate manipulation by every administration. Biden manipulated defense, solar and EV stocks and others that were less obvious. Obama manipulated industrials and infrastructure. Clinton manipulated the financial sector so much that it crashed. If you want to stop that, you need to get rid of lobbyists, not administrations. If you believe that a sector is being manipulated, then you need to participate in the action instead of complaining that others are getting rich. Oil and gas are never going away and if alternative energy use rises, the majors are in that too. The sector is a solid one but not necessarily useful for a get-rich-quick scheme.

elpresidentedeljunta

Just recently EV and full self driving. Both likely to actually come online with full impact before AI does. We have a decade of marvels ahead. But each and all of them take longer than quarter traders antoicipate.

CustomerSingle3173

I shouldn't have said they were bankrolled by Amazon. Amazon was an early investor of Rivian. And by 2030 their delivery vehicles will all be Rivian. Im sure you've seen them driving around. I understand your concerns but Tesla did the same thing in their early years. Rivian is building a new plant in georgia as well. The earnings report have been mediocre so far but that was expected with the removal of the EV tax credits. Rivian is making the R2 affordable for EV customers as well. Although, if the R2 fails, then I believe Rivian will fail.

-MullerLite-

Because....trust me bro? More Teslas were sold in California last year than the cumulative lifetime EV sales of all of the Midwestern states combined. Let that sink in to your tiny brain.

alwayslookingout

$200K in a Chinese EV. That’s some conviction.

HungieSumoKid

Chinese EV will be cooking TACO soon.

Slytherin23

Yeah, it's the ugliest car imaginable. The only way it sells if it's the cheapest EV and people can't afford anything else.

TieForeign8827

The EV screen is interesting, but for biotech I'd keep three buckets separate: cash/runway, probability-weighted pipeline value, and future dilution or R&D burn. A low EV can be real mispricing, but it can also be the market saying the approval/timing assumptions need a huge discount.

narullow

Yeah sure. Country that keeps state controlled oligopolies in Telecom, banking, petroleum and energy sectors is all about competition. Same country that used firewall to get rid of the most succesful western online services champions competition. Actually hillarious take. Yes, they did massive government sponsor program to use competition in specific narrow sectors such as smartphones or now car companies that was designed to take over market share. But it is clear as day that it was never to last, only 3 EV car manufacturers in China are making profit right now and it is expected that only 4-5 will survive over next 5 years to control 99% of market.

FILTHBOT4000

AFAIK that's not true. They were subsidized in the past, but currently it's a rather cutthroat and highly competitive industry in China to be the best and cheapest EV maker. That's why they're selling like hotcakes in dozens of other countries; China's government isn't subsidizing the world's auto purchases. Again, this is just what I've heard. Maybe there are some small/vestigial subsidies, but not enough to say they're being bankrolled by the PRC.

helloWorldcamelCase

I don't blame those looking non Tesla alternatives when Elon's greed killed autosteer, a free feature on literally any modern EV. R2 looks very competitive.

GallopingIdiot

Just like every other EV that diluted to otc.

Suspicious_Gap1

Every other EV manufacturer got govt money. Not just Rivian.

WetRacoon

There’s a lot going on in this comparison. For one, Tesla has been at it since 2010. That’s a long road, and they only hit net profit because of credits early on (look at actual gross vehicle margin and see how long that took them). That and like 90% of teslas share value comes from Musk, the eternal snake oil salesman. Rivian is the second comer, launched IPO on the tail end of the early EV hype, and appears to be a pure car company (though if you look at their financials and technology roadmap that’s changing). I think if Rivian makes it it’s just a bit more of a grind, but they have a real shot. The vehicles are great, they have massive partnerships with actual skin in the game, and have endless talent working away within software. But yeah, it’s a tough comparisons to Tesla.

WetRacoon

Weird comment. Good, but average. Which one is it bro lol Reviews suggest it’s an excellent vehicle, and considering there are zero mid sized EV SUVs that are capable of off roading, competition is really only in the mid sized city SUV market which is just the model Y right now. Business sure, needs improvement in execution but given how deliveries are tripling next year and there’s another even cheaper car on the way, I’m not sure the dilution is really a negative (as long as the capital is put into scaling).

cultoftheclave

they will do fine, ironically, because of the protectionist bullshit in the current administration there's really only a viable business model for us-based pure play EV brands. that leaves - Tsla, RIVN and, lastly LCID who seems to have no sub-$50k gameplan and is in much greater danger of actually running out of money, or Saudi patience or both. What RIVN needs to do as fast as possible is get their downmarket models ready to go on faster development cycle because the floodgates won't hold back Chinese zerg rush forever.

cultoftheclave

A lot of former Tesla shoppers we know out here in Southern California have all been adding the R2 to their shortlist of replacements. Add in that in 2026 there are very few three row EV offerings on the US market, and the R1 is still looking pretty good.

kinetic_honda

I'm not an EV investor by any means so I'm not sure how this industry works. I keep hearing about rigian being a great car, but the stock is always in the dumps. What is the problem - why are they not able to get their valuations under control? Is the EV space just this complicated and does TSLA really have this much of an advantage? Genuine question, would love opinions

Moist_Emu_6951

Yes, in a small portion. I have 5% of my portfolio in EV and Robotics ETFs because China is leading these and will likely continue to lead. I wouldn't put all of my money into the Chinese market though (or any market, really, but the lack of transparency in China makes me a bit jittery about allocating more than 5% of my portfolio)

WakeupAtDawn15

Let me split your question: 1. The reason China's economic rise is a result of taking the supply chain since joined the WTO. But now the traditional companies are transferring their supply chain to lower labor costs countries, such as Vietnam. For the high-tech, only the robotic and EV industries are leading the world. I remember Serenity has recommended one Chinese ticker which is a Robot Harmonics manufacturer, and it gained about 50% since her post. If your purpose is getting profits from China's economic, I suggest to focus on the Chinese robotics industry. 2. For the gold, I don't think it has a huge logic connection to one region/country's economic, as it's a floating global commodity. If you think of the copper, as the largest production and consumption country, some Chinese mining companies may have the investing opportunities. Please follow their P/E and Copper price changes.

Gullible_Ad3785

Electricity would be my guess.  Chinese and others EVs, solar, etc.  are a huge demand transfer from more expensive fossil fuel energy (oil & coal) to cheaper electricity (renewables & natural gas, depending on location), in part because they are simply more efficient in a lot of use cases.  That will continue to create demand in grid connection & maintenance. There is a lot of tech that goes into the grid.  That's where I would look to play.  While the AI narrative helps, it's not the only narrative (energy diversification security, solar/wind < carbon, EV are also there) and you benefit even if countries build out gas or nuclear projects too.

thogor

That's a statement I keep hearing and was wary of when I bought my Tesla because it was the only EV that could be delivered within a month when I urgently needed to buy an EV to get a 100% tax rebate. Have that car for 4 years and I've had zero issues. My previous cars needed to go into the shop about once every year for minor issues. Same for two of my colleagues who bought Tesla's. Anecdotal, yes, but no complaints about build quality for me.

SooperShak

Elongated Muskrat not happy about the new California EV incentives.

waka_wear_art

 Chinese EV, fear premium gone, strategic reserves.

bbby7nine

Not sure if you guys still remember the days where solar city was around. I believe his younger brother or some relative was running it. At the peak of its company or downfall, Elon was selling EV panels on roof top that look like roof tiles. Then a few months Tesla acquired Solar City. He has a habit of merging shit that doesn’t work with things that work.

bnh1978

EV sales are picking up for sure. Lol

Samjabr

Or, just hear me out. He knew he would need compute eventually for something (spoiler: He's literally building his own compute factories) And he browbeat Jensen over dinner (True story) to sell him as much as possible. He likely predicted that the GPU demand would only get worse, so locking up chips was a no brainer - He then built a a data-center faster than has ever been done before (Turns out TSLA knows something about building big factories, quickly) and is now making billions every month. A better question is why does your EDS keep you from recognizing someone with that level of brilliance and ability to adapt to a situation? Remember when everyone was amused that some whacky African American was trying to simultaneously take on both the oil industry and the car industry. Yeah, me too. His companies have literally done more for decarbonization than every other company, protestor, and Reeeeeeee combined. If not for TSLA, most other car manufacturers would likely not have started their own EV lines. But like I said, Reeeeeeeee

TomX45

Are you implying that that EVs cut oil consumption that significantly? China is the largest producer of plastic in the world. Practically every single product we consume these days contains plastic produced from crude oil. Oil is also essential for producing fertilizer, and there's a few people in China that probably enjoy eating. This has nothing to do with EV uptake. Kind regards

AllinOptions

Chart shows China imports less oil and use more EV. OP does not explain it but that’s what the charts show.

NinjaWK

Well, Lambo ain't the greatest cars. Had a LP550-4, seldom driven it coz it's so uncomfortable. Get yourself a nice Porsche 911, or if you're into EV, the Taycan is nice. I have both. I didn't buy new, so I wasn't balling like you. Bought both used. A 997 Carrera Turbo, and a Taycan Turbo S. It's an EV so the turbo naming is a bit stupid, but the car is pretty fun to drive.

Strange-Tea7949

People are overlooking the context. He's basically trying to say (in a not very clear way) that "my kids can't buy something because anything they attempt to purchase could be viewed as a conflict of interest because people assume they are buying it knowing something others don't". E.g. He's buying an electric truck now because the government are about to hike EV tariffs next month. That sorta thing.

privatepublicaccount

Yeah, sounds like a gambler’s mentality. Stop trading until you fix that or avoid situations that trigger that response in you. Did you have some reason to think your added trades were +EV and within your risk rules? If not, never take the trade, no matter what is happening surrounding the trade. Worst case: you get lucky and win and train your brain to make more stupid moves in the future.

sleetandbyte

Of course but then you are paying for that protection. All for the right to enter a market that has barely squeaked out inflation over the last 20 years and got crushed by inflation over the last 10 years. A single put leap to hedge would have SO SO much more EV vs playing bonds.

SnooHedgehogs5162

Good growth. Not too cyclical and biggest EV cars battery producer. Just safe growth. Look at 1 year chart.

zerowaitestate

Rotation. Also, it is was assumed they would be the only viable pure play EV company in the US and that turns out not to be the case.

OriginalGoonster

You’re comparing a luxury EV company marketing to a niche customer group to ASTS. This is comparing apples and orangutans

SnooHedgehogs5162

Good growth. Not too cyclical and biggest EV cars battery producer. Just safe growth. Look at 1 year chart.

Sanpaku

South32's enterprise value was AUD 18.68B or $12.96B. For South32, underlying EBITDA by commodity (H1 FY26): * copper 34% * zinc-lead-silver 18% * manganese 10% * aluminum 22% * alumina 16% Selling 38% of EBITDA for 43.2% of EV is a slight win. But they'll also potentially have net cash - debts of $US 5.6 B to go shopping with. Would be chuckle worthy if South32 used a portion of that to buy Element25 (another Australian manganese co), presently trading for US 51M mkt cap.

brainrotbro

I would like a sub-$20k EV please.

cdit

I vaguely remember Elon posting on Twitter that the "blueprint" for Tesla is available for anyone to use to build an EV car if they wish to. That was long ago though (not sure if they were really made available or not). I'm guessing BYD and other Chinese companies took that.

kitbiggz

Tesla is not just a EV company. They also do other things. Bitcoin holding, Robots and AI, EV Charging stations, Home charging, Solar Roof But Yea they are over priced lol.

YanksFanInSF

The news here, they are both scams. BYD valuation propped by the Chinese gov’t (though they have arguable better vehicles); Teslas’s valuation built on vibes. EV’s should never have become the standard vs hydrogen.