MSTR

greyenlightenment

COIN & MSTR back to $100 . so many ppl regret buying this over nvda, pltr lol

Dingis__Khan

!banbet MSTR 345 11d

Iunatic

I can topple the MSTR/BTC scheme by buying a single share of MSTR. Watch me

jackparsons

My problem with this example is that it distracts me during my workday, and I'm a late riser. I have been doing roughly this technique on $MSTR for several months, and it is weekly. So, I place a trade on Monday and try to ignore it. Cheers!

GrabTraditional3165

I focus on weekly contracts. This year I’ve made the most from NVDA, MSTR, COIN, PLTR. I started selling options in 2022. And I’ve made just over 220k (lifetime net premium). I also document my journey on YT (not for any type of monetization) - send me DM if you interested.

Dependent_Code7796

MSTR RemindMe! 5 years

Scared-Badger-3186

Now I gotta wait another 6 months to exit my MSTR position. Should have sold at $450

jvro1

I've got MSTR inverse bags I've been holding forever. I need it to really really shit.

East-Description-243

The next halving is the end. Long dated puts on MSTR are gonna pay big.

AllCapNoBrake

Hey Alexa, play "Let it go" for the MSTR & BTC Bag Hodlers

Revolutionary_spam

Waiting for funds to clear so I can yolo puts into MSTR.

Beingol

I practiced on paper for a month or so and continued with both paper and real accounts, paper trading is always doing better because less emotion involved. It’s the occasional big losses that eat away my balance. Such as 0dte, and avg down on some options for MSTR / COIN when it’s continuously going down

WallStreetBetsCALLSS

Context: someone bought MSTR for earnings instead of MSFT that week and lost 5% on shares

alexbananas

Hi guys I'm new on this investing thing, I think Microsoft is doing bad should I call puts on MSTR? Is this how it works?

AllCapNoBrake

Believe it: $MSTR & BTC going to $0

Ok-Comfortable-3174

BMNR has a shot. MSTR went up 3600% in 3 years. I know they did it first but Tommy Lee has charasma and love to pump his bags daily!

Soft-Usual-9909

MSTR back to sub 350 tmmrw. I think BTC starts to sell into September

optimizegains

Happy to see this post on r/investing. It’s a serious buy signal. The people on this sub are the least experienced and least intuitive investors across the internet. Bullish MSTR.

Beingol

i used to focus on swing trades, and it doesn’t progress as much as I wish. Recently I tried out some new strategies and focused mostly in intraday trading and that’s when my balance is really going down fast. The past week I did a few 0dte trades even though I have told myself never do 0dte trades, and I lost the most from MSTR / COIN and Meta from last Friday 0dte trading..

Hot-Performance-4221

You are regarded, but we do not grant you the rank of MSTR.

OptionSellingRegard

I member selling $90 strike puts on MSTR September 2024, shit hit $400 by March 2025 not missing the ETH train, in for 500 shares BMNR at $55 🙌🏽

rawj5561

MSTR is criminally under valued

EnginrA

What about MSTR

SnooEagles2610

Bitcoin is a pyramid scheme and MSTR is a Ponzi Scheme.

Various_Couple_764

IF you want to hold bitcoin invest in BTC. If you want income from bitcoin without MSTR exposure Invest in BTCI (25% yield).

jnight138

MSTR is BTC musical chairs, when the music stops you better not be the one holding the bag. However looking at the macro environment, it might be another 3 and something years before another crypto winter. Trump and administration ain’t gonna let the OG crypto crash after all they’ve done and all they’re planning to do.

WolverineHelpful9775

https://preview.redd.it/7a9k9mak0gjf1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=e1343e216701b862159834811e250b9457a9ab24 This week was a great example of how put debit spreads yielded way higher returns (\~3000%) than straight puts. I closed my position for a 1000% gain. Theta decay was significantly minimized on the spread (showing very little loss throughout the week) while it destroyed the puts bc MSTR didn’t start dropping until Thursday and Friday.

WolverineHelpful9775

Nope. If BTC goes down, I’ll actually make more money with put debit spreads that I have (made over 1000% gain last week). Only way I’ll lose is if MSTR drops about 35% in a week. And that’ll just mean I get assigned. There’s no realized loss. https://preview.redd.it/zt3o344yzfjf1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=cfe8a10bc3f64d67e4dbf8741d01407c5604c79d

Aggressive-Donkey-10

BTC has been almost flat since 12/2024 when at 109k, now 117k. MSTR doesn't sell its BTC, so even if it went up in price, which it hasn't, where does it get the millions to pay the Preferred Shares? It gets it from selling new shares of MSTR to the chumps, excuse me retail investors. Money goes in from retail investor A and instantly goes out to retail investor B as a preferred dividend, next quarter they have to do it again and again. Hence Ponzi. The cash preferred dividend is not coming from MSTR income nor capital gains sales on BTC. "A Ponzi scheme is a fraudulent investment operation that pays returns to its investors from new capital paid in by new investors, rather than from profit earned through legitimate business activities. It's essentially a scam where earlier investors are paid with money from later investors, creating the illusion of a profitable business. The scheme collapses when it becomes difficult to recruit new investors or when a large number of existing investors try to withdraw their funds, leaving the majority of investors with significant losses." I'm not criticizing Michael Saylor or MSTR for running a good scam but just have your eyes open that it is the very definition of a Ponzi Scam and will be prosecuted once a new President who both cares about the rule of law and hasn't received donations/bribes from MSTR gets elected.

WolverineHelpful9775

Like is said, if the stock stays flat, I can close out the contract at 50% gain or most sometimes. I currently have some MSTR puts I sold on Friday and will be near worthless if the share price doesn’t move significantly. I repeat this almost every Friday. The buyer is the gambler (idiot) in hopes of a big move in BTC over the weekend. https://preview.redd.it/kkbhkg42mfjf1.jpeg?width=1170&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5b89c25bd1ad6de0e7d029b92027d37b729681ca

Nemarus_Investor

Wow, that's wild. Then yeah I guess MSTR is your only option.

Nemarus_Investor

If you can buy MSTR, why can't you buy a Bitcoin ETF?

snek-jazz

They've been doing this for like 5 years. At first it was all convertible debt - loans that came due all at once. Those were proportionally bigger obligations than the current interest debt, since there's no principle to repay (except for STRK if MSTR reaches 1k). They had obligations to meet, and they've met them, even with a bitcoin winter in the middle. The risk of bankruptcy without failure of bitcoin was much greater in the past because they had a much weaker balance sheet. In short, their NAV has grown more than their obligations, and the MSTR share price tends to be based on their NAV. > Why put yourself in that situation? For a few extra percent gain on an already volatile asset? Well I made significantly more than a few extra percent so far, but indeed from now on it may not be much, or it may even under-perform BTC depending on how mNAV goes, so I'm mulling over it. I already rebalanced some MSTR to other things, and some MSTR to STRF But I'm not afraid to hold the rest for a while more while I decide. I want to wait longer to see how much demand there is for the preferred offerings, and what prices they trade at. I also have a reason that others don't. In my country I have very limited options for btc exposure in a tax advantaged account.

Nemarus_Investor

Yup, MSTR adds more risk.

snek-jazz

I've already held, and bought more through a winter, and they had a much worse debt to asset situation then. mNAV even went below 1. If you think bitcoin will just outright fail then obviously no MSTR product is for you. If you think bitcoin may have bear markets as it has in the past, MSTR are probably fine, they've kept the leverage and obligations low enough to ride another one out, especially if inflation has continued to lessen the real value of those obligations.

Freya_gleamingstar

Little late to the party, but just want to say that you should check out Mark Meldrum's channel on YT. He has some pretty sophisticated takes on MSTR and crypto in general. [This](https://youtu.be/j_6URnhtQ2U?si=3khoOmpcBlU74Bqi) vid in particular excellently shows just what MSTR is actually up to.

snek-jazz

I'm not sure what your point is, but I'll just say the following anyway: I think you are over-concerned. Issuing a days worth of MSTR volume would cover a year of their interest obligations. I'll be very surprised if they sell any bitcoin in the coming year(s). How the share price will perform is a different matter though.

snek-jazz

Madoff lied, he told people the money he was paying out was coming from elsewhere and not from 'A' and therefore the balances he was telling people they had were not there. The money from 'A' in MSTR is coming in because their btc stack, and its value, have both been trending up and increasing the value of the company.

snek-jazz

> . Their current liabilities exceed their current assets. They have over $74b in bitcoin, and $8b in debt. They also have interest obligations which amount to about a days worth of MSTR volume.

asdafari14

> I foolishly thought MSTR was a levered bitcoin play in a convenient package led by this visionary named Michael Saylor. Say what you will about him but it has been. MSTR has returned about 3x more than BTC.

AllCapNoBrake

Believe it or not: MSTR & BTC to $0! L F G!!!

Ornery_Ant_1758

I'm down $30k on ETFs related to MSTR so I'm almost there with ya

fartcatmilkshake

#disclaimer I think MSTR is a Ponzi scheme. But worth for a swing trade next week? Looking at 400C

CreamyBehemoth

Think I’m going to play exclusivity MSTR next week. 2-3% OTM options and see where I end up

Ok-Amphibian3164

You're wrong abojt MSTR, but OK.

somewhereoverthedune

MSTR has been boning me all week.

Zephyr4813

All he and the shareholders are doing is capturing the rate spread between their fixed income instruments ~10% and bitcoin. If you believe in bitcoin, it would be foolish to bet against MSTR. Everyone knows about the accounting issues from dot com era it was nbd

iLov3musk

The plebs screaming “dilution” don’t understand that fiat dilution is TERMINAL. MSTR isn’t playing that game. They using fiat markets, draining them of liquidity, and stuffing it into the Bitcoin black hole where it can never be printed away. Every MSTR offering is accretive because it increases BTC per share in a manner that compounds over time. Fiat shareholders are merely exit liquidity for Bitcoin in this trade. Each share sold is more bitcoin on the balance sheet. Which is a finite asset unlike the dollars they are selling.

slowlybecomingsane

You did some DD which amounts to learning what its current nMAV premium is. Good job. MSTR might go up or down but its almost entirely dependant on what BTC does so unless you're hedging with a BTC long your DD is pretty useless

warlock22041

MSTR exit liquidity, or shake out weak hands? Retail has been relentlessly buying since 450 --> stock down 20% over the last month Which one of you bought at 450 and sold today at 360? https://preview.redd.it/zqdgi9pv4ajf1.png?width=1070&format=png&auto=webp&s=6bde44af6c5c78c25cb6677882848b05d057ec5d

Easy-Yogurt4939

I have a well paying job. By years of salary I meant post tax and after expense. I also got into bitcoin early and had some nice option wins in ALGN and MSTR

Albert14Pounds

Shorting MSTR is crypto gambling...

agumonkey

His speeches at some outdoor conferences are also fringe-guru in tone. That said I thought his MSTR / BTC contraption was a sophisticated ponzi-but-not-full-ponzi that might work just enough for him to exit with heavy bags.. but i'm just a redditor

jhonnylasagna

Right: Picking great stocks with good timing. Examples: ASTS at 25. RKLB at 10. MSTR at 189. PLTR at 37. HOOD at 28. Wrong, Wrong, WRONG: Succumbing to fear of possible loss and so selling those same great stocks waaay too early for just minimal gains. Example: Too f-ing embarrassing to list.

Aggressive-Donkey-10

Wait, MSTR offers preferred shares? So, it pays dividends to the pref. holders, and since it has no significant business revenue, it gets the money to pay the dividends by issuing more shares, right? So they take money from A and give it to feed B, then need to get more money from A (new shareholders). Isn't this the textbook definition of a Ponzi scheme? same thing Bernard Madoff did, he paid out dividends/capital gains from new money coming in? Yes !!!! Short this Bitch!!!!

Ivo_ChainNET

\> you'll see that MSTR may realistically account for up to 20% or more of legitimate BTC transactions I have no idea where you're getting your data, but trasuty companies like MSTR perform next to no BTC transactions. They pile up BTC and hold it, moving it costs $ Here's a cluster of BTC addresses belonging to MSTR, they do very little transactions, way lowe than 0.001% of Bitcoin transactions, 20% is just insane: [https://intel.arkm.com/explorer/entity/microstrategy](https://intel.arkm.com/explorer/entity/microstrategy) \> "legitimate" BTC transactions are because the grand majority of BTC transfers are actually done by the miners, validators, exchanges and so on trading between each other that inflates the market volume. BTC miners don't send transactions to earn bloc krewards BTC has no validators, it's not a proof of stake chain Exchanges perform transactions on behalf of users, idk why you consider that illegitimate

iLov3musk

What type of DD is this? There no substance in your Mnav reasoning at all. Every share of MSTR you buy entitles you to significantly more BTC in the future, due to accretive financing and optimal deployment of fiat liabilities. Each equity, convert, or preferred issued via ATM is a catapult, launching MSTR toward 700,000+ BTC because when your treasury asset outperforms your equity cost of capital, you don’t stop issuing, you accelerate. This isn’t dilution. It’s temporal arbitrage. Why do you think MSTR has outperformed bitcoin since they started their bitcoin treasury.

harpswtf

Yeah you know what, you're right. Just leave MSTR alone and forget about it. I was just trying to be insulting towards it.

lucianothegoat

MSTR calls

SwitchedOnNow

Yeah, I'm with you. I wanna short it bad too! I haven't because of the fast rise in BTC. If/when it turns down, it'll wreck MSTR.

Wowmuchrya

Because one has a cult chairmain and this… has nothing? Both are trash ponzi schemes just like MSTR, but “tOm LeE”.

bbatardo

Remember, markets will remain irrational longer than you can stay solvent. As long as BTC still has opportunities to hit new ATH's you have to understand that shorting MSTR is risky. MSTR falls under the type of stocks that don't follow logic. Like would you want to short Tesla? Financials say it is overpriced, but I wouldn't risk betting against a cult.

crazybutthole

>Short MSTR and get out of crypto gambling. Uhm - MSTR is tied directly to the price of BTC. If you short MSTR - you are getting further into crypto gambling unless you own an equal weight of FBTC or IBIT or similar to offset your losses with MSTR if BTC goes up.

ChampionshipLoose446

got some longs on MSTR for next month.

gamjatang111

unless you are long IBIT and short MSTR, you are making negative free money

joe4942

I think it was a mistake for MSTR to launch preferred shares. In just the last month, -17% underperformance relative to IBIT.

umirinbrah29

It's not trading at a 100% premium to its holdings. mNAV is around 1.6 currently, so it's at a 60% premium. I find it interesting lots of posts are popping up recently about this, why only now are you spouting short MSTR after its mNAV has already dropped over 50% from its ATH when it was trading at $543 with a BTC price significantly lower than today's price. If you are so confident about shorting MSTR, why do so at one of the worst possible times when mNAV is at a historical low?

tktytkty

Crypto treasuries. MSTR, BMNR, SBET, etc.

ManBearPig_1983

Is MSTR finally outted as a ponzi or what?

Same-Brilliant2014

Seeing how there are multiple leveraged ETFS for TSLA, UNH, MSTR, PLTR, COIN,GME. Id say yes there is alot of leverage going around.

arBettor

I don't hate the trade. The chart looks rough so you probably have some wind at your back. If I were going to express this, I'd prefer a pair trade of long BTC, short MSTR (and maybe that's essentially what you're doing, based on your first sentence). BTC is still bullish enough it could float MSTR's boat a bit longer. But since MSTR's high last year, MSTR is down 21% while FBTC is up nearly 25%. So it's definitely not acting as leveraged bitcoin recently and while it has worked off some of its overvaluation vs BTC, I bet you're right that there's more to go. But I can never bring myself to be short anything bitcoin-related since short squeezes can be brutal at times, and we're still in the bullish part of the cycle. Hope it works out for you.

KifDawg

SMST 2x leveraged MSTR. I will be loading up in october

TheKittyPetter9000

If it’s trading at an MNAV at 1 why short now? Historically MSTR has traded at an MNAV 1< to BTC holdings. Now is a time to watch, you’re basically saying to short BTC in MSTRs current point time with a history of MNAVs exceeding 1 relative to BTC holdings. Given the volatility around BTC this is a speculative play imo. If MSTR has trouble paying dividends on the preferred then it would signal an opportunity to short. Don’t get me wrong, I wouldn’t invest in MSTR personally as I would prefer to just hold BTC in itself but I don’t think the current market conditions don’t given any edge to a short.

harpswtf

I am shocked that a financial criminal is involved in a BTC scheme. Short MSTR and get out of crypto gambling.

NewKiddoTN

MSTR dumping lol see you at zero

DoubtFlashy2926

MSTR = MarianaTrench Stock Retarded

TheWayIAm313

Holy shit I’m catching a falling knife with MSTR

Stunning-Cheetah7647

People who missed MSTR, KULR🚀🚀 is the opportunity now.

1M-to-Zero

Im going to watch BTC and MSTR.

AllCapNoBrake

on shorting BTC and MSTR.

Initial_Ad_9250

Watching the MSTR guru youtubers coping with the price action rn and one fella literally drew a couple of parallel lines to capture range in the last year or so and extrapolates it back to 2000s during and after the fucking dot Com bubble collapse. Another reads out Chatgpt response to the price decline investigation lmao.

1M-to-Zero

MSTR to moon tomorrow?

1M-to-Zero

How stupid am I? BOUGHT 10 MSTR Aug22'25 320 PUT @ 2.79 today before market close.

InternetEqualToReddi

And, I own no bitcoin. Unfortunately, I am not stupid enough bitcoin. Though, I have good money trading naked calls/puts on MSTR.

Dane314pizza

Yeah I haven't looked into it much but here it some information I found: TTM Revenue: $5.45 million One analyst expects them to do $6.82 million in 2025. Current Market Cap: Over $10 billion. This makes the end of 2025 P/S ratio over 1500, which is extremely high. After further research, it appears this company is basically just MSTR but for Ethereum. I guess they hold 1.15 million ETH = \~ $5 billion. So it seems that the "NAV Premium" is about 2x. This actually isn't too unreasonable compared to MSTR. For reference, MSTR trades at about 1.5x, and it has not been uncommon for it to trade at 2x (source: [https://strategytracker.com/mstr.com](https://strategytracker.com/mstr.com) ). So this is basically like a leveraged ETH play in my opinion. With ETH being at near ATH, there is certainly downside but nobody really knows what will happen. I personally am not gonna touch this. I would rather just buy ETH on RobinHood if I wanted ETH exposure, which I also personally don't want.

brucekeller

google finance is such trash, I don't use it too much but every so often will look up a cap... no more, it just lies too often. It says MSTR has a cap of $2.54 bil lol.

Mother-Chipmunk2778

Wells Fargo bought 124 million in bitcoin and 143 million in MSTR

Wows_Nightly_News

Wait, $MSTR actually makes software? I thought that was a joke.

GiveInsteadOfTaking

MSTR

Low-Buyer-8758

going heavy on these stocks in a separate tech portfolio to retirement account (which is 100% ETF) thoughts? any other decent tickers? GOOGL TSLA V CSCO CRWD DDOG ZS PLTR MSTR KD thoughts? GOOGL TSLA V CSCO CRWD DDOG ZS PLTR MSTR KD

byggusdikkus

Full port MSTR, Big daddy B knows shitcoins are the future

Sweaty_Platypus69

Buy MSTR... MSTR is the next MSFT ;p

G0RD0N_CLARK

Uhhhhhh. No MSTR Puts

NineAsiansAtSubway

Geez MSTR feeling the bukake

ThatChrisGuy7

MSTR going to collapse lol

Dekuthegreat

If you are still a MSTR permabull after the last month it’s had you are truly regarded

Samjabr

"MicroStrategy Changes Name To Strategy; Continues To Trade Under MSTR" Bullish?

Hussle_Crowe

Feels like MSTR permabulls should be a little more worried here

greyenlightenment

MSTR down 20% in a month vs QQQ being up 5% lol.

achshort

I bought a shit ton of MSTR calls. Am I going to be margin ☎️ or 🚀🚀🚀