FIRE

Fluffy_Round8419

OG Female Bitcoiner here! I've been here since 2013!!! But I'm weird. I like boy things like videogames, Magic the Gathering, computers, IT etc. I'm glad I got into Bitcoin. I was able to barista FIRE because of it.

Walking-Tomato

I need a lot more for a FIRE test... anyone?

penty

>Respectfully, I don't care what you have read.. So DYOR... >I'm in the game since 2016 Eyeroll :And I've been "in the game" since 2012-2013. >I can say without a doubt that this cycle is on a whole other level than previous ones I can, and with research you can too, quote the exact same thing at this point in the last two cycles. >If you have a decade long experience in bitcoin, it's something that you can literally feel when observing price dynamics, slight decorrelation to previous patterns, and overall decorrelation to high risk tech markets. OIC, you're using 'feelz' and 'argument by authority' not anything substantive. Sadly for you, my 'thirteen years' trounces your 'nine' by a wide %. Maybe when you actually get to a decade... I kid. Just hold and don't worry about cycles. I've gone from Sabbatical to lean FIRE, to FIRE, with this cycle pushing me to Fat FIRE... WAGMI

coupl4nd

FIRE.

jamesnaranja90

FIRE

Zwetzak69

I also recommend this on my local FIRE sub, with every chance I get. They always downvote me and I just laugh at their stupidity. They then throw tantrums with a lot of name-calling, but never give me a good reason why not to invest in Bitcoin. They say that gold and stocks are the better options, lmao.

Yesthisisdogmeow

Yeah I have funds ready for a dip, FIRE SALE!

xBrodoFraggins

You're going to need to save a lot more aggressively if you want FIRE...

fringecar

lol clearly this is not the right subreddit to ask this question. The commenters are probably mostly kids in their 20s or earlier it seems like? Or in that mindset still. Try one of the FIRE subreddits.

Solana_Maximalist

Glad to read such a heartwarming post. For me I bought a lot of solana under 15 and btc under 20 k eoy 2022 Managed to get a roof of our own for my family (no more rentals) and clear all debts. Sold a majority of my positions in December last year leaving the rest for ultra long term hodl. Crypto changes lives. I’m still working and not retired but the peace of mind it gave me and my family was priceless. I come from a poor background. Congratulations on achieving financial independence retire early (FIRE).

Red-Oak-Tree

Barista FIRE LOL - i never heard of that but I instantly knew what it meant.

JeremyLinForever

Somewhere out there, there’s Uber drivers who have been stacking early and very hard. They probably have a huge net worth and are just doing Barista FIRE lol.

United_Finance2258

🔥 BREAKING NEWS: @GetTangi is EXPLODING onto the scene! 🔥 Four years in the making… and it’s READY TO DOMINATE! ✅ Bank partnerships LOCKED & LOADED ✅ Market tests? Absolutely CRUSHED it! ✅ Public listing dropping Q4 2025 — GET READY TO ROAR! Tangi is SHAKING UP the $33 BILLION cannabis payments industry like never before. Round 2 presale — LIVE and ON FIRE right now! Don’t miss out! 🚀💥 #TangiToken #Club15 #FutureOfFinance #CryptoCannabis

m4rM2oFnYTW

So your thesis is BTC will have a trailing 10 year CAGR of 40% by 2029 at 300k but will not be able to handle a recurring yearly 10% interest and principal using only 10% of your stash? If you don't believe you will survive a bear market with the remaining 90% then simply lower your target down to 5% or adjust on a year to year basis depending on loan terms and the market conditions. With the FIRE route, yea you are safe and sound but you are also not building generational wealth.

mangoMandala

playing poker 2017 bull. shitcoin degens shouting out prices every few minutes. Made it clear this was all scammy (except bitcoin) 2019 got a more sober intro. first utxo. 2001 FIRE overseas. Contracted with someone that wanted to pay contract in BTC. This was super useful for international transfer. fell down rabbit hole for real.

cl3ft

Bitcoin thesis, you must be ready for an 85% downturn, total stash 4m. thesis we'll hit 300k next bullrun in ~4 years, retired so no other capital to inject. The numbers don't add up. If I had 40m I might stand a chance to have a safe comfortable 160kPA income. But I'm better off just withdrawing the 4m and investing in a safe collection of ETFs and obeying the 4% withdrawal rate the FIRE community espouses.

Leading_Document_464

No. If you ask this question on the FIRE page they’ll chew you out and call you a retard. Im 33, just bought a house, about to rent my basement out which will cut my mortgage by more than 50%. Every says “NO DEBT” but it if I had 300K, why would I pay off the house when I’ve already cut my mortgage and I can let that 300K grow. Then I’d be 33, no mortgage, also not a Higher earner and I’d still be working until 60 which I sure as hell don’t want to do. So yes and no, the yes part would be a few more years down the line when I have a lot more that 300K to throw at paying off a mortgage.

Amddiffynnydd

I score each coin 1-5 to guide how much weight I give it over 5, 10, 15 and 20 years, with a “hold-for-ever” status only for any 5-pointer. **Solana (5)** leads because its ultra-fast L1 and exploding DeFi scene scream long-term utility, even if the SEC keeps stalling ETF approvals for now. **XRP (4)** benefits from Ripple’s fresh settlement, which strips out most regulatory fog; **Hedera (4)** scores equally thanks to its governing council of multinationals, which are already shipping real-world pilots. **Avalanche (3)** and **Cardano (3)** have strong tech and engaged dev bases, but their ETF bids are still in limbo, so I’ll keep adding only on dips until the SEC gives clearer signals. **Polkadot, VeChain and Stellar (2 each)** tackle specific niches—inter-chain messaging, supply-chain tracking and cross-border payments—but need bigger user numbers before I crank up exposure. **Litecoin and Reserve Rights (1 each)** are pure speculative punts: they can run hard in a bull market, but lack moats and regulatory narratives, so I cap them at pocket-change size. I’ll revisit the list every cycle, yet right now the 5-point bag is locked up for the very long haul. (DYOR, not financial advice.) I already HODL Bitcoin and Ether as my base layer – they’re the “never sell” tickets in my FIRE plan. The scores below cover everything I’m adding on top of that core stack.

Huge_Monero_Shill

It's the problem with any simple concept community. FIRE: Save more than you spend, get \~25x your annual expenses in investments, chill. Boggleheads: Buy VT and chill. Bitcoin: Read the whitepaper, buy BTC, store it, chill.

hufflepuff_98

Same here I have a 90% bitcoin portfolio but I tune it out and enjoy the discussion, perspectives and resources from FIRE. I check both communities everyday

Calm-Professional103

There’s the high savings rate but the secret to FIRE is learning to live on a drastically reduced income. That’s what makes FIRE possible. 

wkndatbernardus

This is what I did recently and I have absolutely zero regrets.In fact, my new stash of BTC etfs is helping me to FIRE now, if I want. Real estate is fine if you have a family and want to settle somewhere for 10+ years. Or, you are willing to hustle and manage a handful of rentals for cash flow. In my case, my 3bd house was more space than I needed and all my equity was locked up. .So, I sold and put the profits into the greatest asset known to man.

SlooperDoop

I'm all in on BTC. Never heard of FIRE.

ProfitConstant5238

FIRE requires that you sell assets for money to live on. Hodlers ridicule people who convert BTC to fiat. The two communities are not really that compatible.

wkndatbernardus

It probably has a lot to do with heros of the FIRE movement (MMM, JL Collins, Warren Buffett, Jack Bogle, etc) being anti-crypto in their rhetoric. BTC also doesn't have anywhere close to the historical track record that traditional stock/bond investing does either. Lastly, I think the left vs right political divide has something to do with BTC's lack of acceptance in the FIRE community, because most lefties believe in the goodness of govt institutions (like the Federal Reserve or fiat currency)and BTC enthusiasts tend to not.

DrThirdOpinion

We’re definitely here. I’m into FIRE and make mostly conservative investments. I put about 5% into Bitcoin. It’s been my biggest winner over the last 5 years and now makes up 20% of my portfolio. I like Bitcoin a lot, but I still feel like it’s too speculative to make up the majority of my investments.

thethrowupcat

FIRE with high risk will need a bigger emergency fund plain and simple. It’s been shown over and over that diversification is key. All this said, if you’re younger you probably have a better bet buying as much bitcoin as you can while contributing to the match of your 401k. That’s “risky” but I’d do it.

alineali

In this example when I see that price is good enough I sell bitcoin and put, say, $200k i cash. When I see next good price I replenish this if needed. Basically no strict schedule. And I fully expect that in 4 years AT MOST there will be another price rise which will increase my wealth several times. But this is actually very good example of mentality difference - FIREr wants guaranteed schedule and low risk, bitcoiner is much more flexible and opportunistic. As for strangely huge emergency fund - I mean outside of FIRE, for people with job - well, if you lose job and cannot find another in a couple of month - at lest something acceptable than you did something really wrong with your professional education.

infernal_celery

Slightly disagree. FIRE people often think that the system is designed to trap you and the way out of it is to run up the stairs and out the fire escape in the roof. Bitcoiners point out that there’s a fire escape on the ground floor and you can just leave without walking up 50 storeys. I’m working on both, but even though BTC is a big chunk of my portfolio my standard equities and bonds investments were my biggest contributions until very recently. Logical? No, but it gave me peace of mind. Bitcoin sounded too good to be true, but now if Bitcoin does drop 50% I’m basically OK anyway. Not rich, but not left with nothing.

GivePeaceaChancex10

I think FIRE is a weird trendy movement where it's more about bragging how much you pinch pennies and save the majority of your paycheck, work too much and forget to live in the moment. I am well on track to retire early, estimated around age 42-44 I'll be done and do hold BTC, but I will have nothing to do with that annoying community/movement FIRE crowd.

danster__

FIRE is based on scarcity. Bitcoin provides infinite abundance of time ♾️.

thethrowupcat

Sure…but achieving fire is part of the process so if you’re not prepared after you “FIRE” then you didn’t really FIRE….

HVVHdotAGENCY

People into FIRE are careful with their capital lmao. Crypto is about the furthest you can get from low risk.

thethrowupcat

I think you miss the point. Let’s say you have $500k in BTC. Let’s assume you have to spend 50k/yr (for this example). If you hit a bear market of 70% down in one year and assuming 500k net worth was the top, that’s only 150k at the bottom!!! So now you have your next annual prep to sell and use for the future but you end up selling 1/3 of your stack not 1/10. This is a key fundamental to personal finance to have an emergency fund. If you’re FIRE you are likely not working which means you need an extended runway. If you’re invested in more volatile assets, even longer. You’ll drag your retired days in the example above form expected 10 years to only 3.

KlearCat

> FIRE needs a lot more reliability. If you were all in on BTC you’d then have to hold a ton of cash reserves for like 3-5 years of expenses just in case you give terrible bear markets. What you are talking about here is post-FIRE. The vast majority of FIRE community is achieving FIRE. Anyone who is looking to achieve FIRE and has done so in large part using bitcoin would absolutely diversify at some point to lock in FIRE. That is my plan. It will be some form of liquidating some % of my bitcoin into more traditional assets that give a return along with hopefully selling low risk options on my bitcoin.

KlearCat

> This is it. Most FIRE people are saving over 25% of their income. Some over 50%. When you’re putting that much of your hard earned money into investments, you need something slow and steady, like index funds. You don't **need** something slow and steady, but it is the lowest risk option. And the FIRE community overall are staunchly against risk.

alineali

Not really. It is a different (and a bit crazy, as for me) mentality - while bitcoin is about "get complex thing right and bear fruits of it with a very high probability but with no specific deadline" FIRE is more like "work hard, be disciplined and bear fruits of it - strictly by schedule".

Angustony

Not much investment in gold either, from the FIRE community.

JefferyTheQuaxly

almost everyone in the fire community are ETF and index fund investors your def right about that. bitcoin is just too risky, im sure some in FIRE have some bitcoin as a more speculative asset but at least 80-90% of their money is going to be in safe index funds.

zombiecorp

I lurk on r/fatFIRE not FIRE.

Cant-Decide-Name

Why does this thred feel like its massive bot influenced? Not a single comment about what the heck "FIRE" even is? Just that it seems to be so good. Isnt this the BITCOIN subreddit?

Secret_Operative

Some people are both. I started on the FIRE path and Bitcoin around the same time. It meant I made some conservative fiscal choices compared to other Bitcoin folks I knew early on as I balanced my strategy. In the end I was early enough for it not to matter, and also the FIRE stuff was a good foundation for how I live now. Most people I know don't even understand what an index fund is.

Vegas_FIREd

There's a number of us Crypto FIRE'd people. But the subreddit's downvote anything crypto fairly aggressively so it doesn't get a lot of traction

Designer-Beginning16

I also think about it often. If only did they know, they would FIRE 2x quicker. Too much Boggleheads focus. On the other hand, already FIREd dudes want to preserve wealth and they don’t know Bitcoin is the best store of value. They’re afraid of volatility.

Tossmefamfr

A large majority (not all but most) of the FIRE subreddit have absolutely insane yearly salaries of $150-$350k and up…Bitcoin is too volatile when they can get guaranteed ROI on a traditional portfolio while still clearing multiple hundreds of thousands of dollars a year.

9999999910

Ok yes that is also true in crypto circles! You couldn’t pay me enough to be a trad FIRE type.

thethrowupcat

FIRE needs a lot more reliability. If you were all in on BTC you’d then have to hold a ton of cash reserves for like 3-5 years of expenses just in case you give terrible bear markets. The fact is BTC can be a portion of their allocation but it’s still a bit tough with volatility.

Mundane_Papaya9009

I think people don't like to be wrong, and so the fact that they ignored a massive opportunity gives them cognitive dissonance so they just stay away in general and use the BTC-hater talking points to justify why. I think most FIRE people see BTC as a very risky asset (it still is), however I think more of them will start investing a higher percentage into BTC moving forward now that it is institutionally adopted...and many of them will probably see that they could have FIREd a lot sooner had they took on more risk. No risk, no reward. Or, But everyone has to do what they are comfortable with. I'd be more inclined to ask all of us, FIRE and BTC maxis, to read the Die with Zero book and make sure you are optimizing your life for Net Fulfillment, regardless of anything. I don't think many people are doing that.

Aggressive_Lobster67

I FIRE'd last year at 35 and only have about 4% of my assets in Bitcoin. I imagine that number will increase as that's the last thing I'd ever sell. Philosophically I'm totally on board, but for the purpose of early retirement I preferred something less volatile as the bulk of my investment.

bananabastard

The FIRE communities on reddit will downvote you into oblivion for any mention of Bitcoin. My FIRE play is 100% Bitcoin. My main bag is up 17,000%. Decent.

usrname_chex_out

Yep. I’m part of both communities and see them as compliments to each other. Most FIRE people are tradfi though, heavy on stocks, and *perceive* Bitcoin as too risky or as a non-productive asset.

tekn0lust

This is exactly me. I am 52, semi-retired(retired from full time job) w both a FIRE and and BTC plan. Wife retires from education in 3 years. Kids grown and graduated and on their own. BTC decisions in 2014/15 made it possible.

swiftpwns

FIRE people are like Neo in the matrix, they were shown the truth but chose to take the wrong pill and continue being cucked.

ElPeroTonteria

I’ll compound that with: The FIRE thing honed it’s thing when BTC was still considered a huge risk/gamble and TBH, even in 2018 “going to zero” wasn’t out of the picture. It could definitely be banned and was looking within the realm of possibility…. FIRE was well established by that time… it’ll take time for them to catch up. I’m basically following their steps (albeit not nearly as strict as others) but instead of diversifying I’m all-in on BTC and DCAing

Tricky_Gap5575

I sold a property in 2022 in which I made 36K a year in Rental income. Put all the sale proceeds into bitcoin at 25K avg 2022. I now have the equivalent of liquid 30 years of rental income unadjusted for inflation. I’m 59 years old so I think they might be a good trade, far less headaches, and still plenty of upside. Living the FIRE dream. You need the creative vision to understand bitcoin , which perhaps that demographic lacks.

Syonoq

The only person I know personally that FIRE'd, was saving 70% of (their - DINK) income. I was astounded. Of course, I'm still working there and he's in Europe now, so....

Natural-Spirit3171

What is FIRE exactly?

MarkoDavido

BTC could be 20k next year or 200k. FIRE people prefer something more predictable and less risky

Strict-Comfort-1337

FIRE people likely need high income via dividends and bond interest. That need for income makes any non income bearing asset risky for them

110010010011

This is it. Most FIRE people are saving over 25% of their income. Some over 50%. When you’re putting that much of your hard earned money into investments, you need something slow and steady, like index funds. Personally, I’m only FIRE because of Bitcoin. My savings rate has been pathetically low, literally zero for a long time now, but a couple small purchases a decade ago made all the difference. I think had I been saving a high percentage of my income, I would have taken a different approach.

BTCMachineElf

They're normies and don't fully grok bitcoin yet. There are plenty of FIRE Bitcoiners. I'm one myself.

KingWormKilroy

I’ve thought a lot about this, having been involved in both communities for over a dozen years now. I started learning about FIRE first, and about Bitcoin a few years later. I agree with other commenters who characterize FIREfolks as risk-averse and point to that as the reason they’ve found Bitcoin unappealing. I think this has a lot to do with how Bitcoin is presented to people, how the information shared is framed. Is Bitcoin an investment, or is it a computing network? When framed as the former, it tends to be perceived as a much riskier asset to hold. When framed as the latter, it’s clear that many of bitcoin’s perceived risks are overblown or mitigated without much trouble. But why would a FIREr care to learn about an innovative computing network’s rules and implications? They’re just not going to be interested in that as much as a potential new investment, but the framing used to get their attention is the same reason they give a quick pass.

naminghell

I think they are just not aware, because BitCoin is the ultimate FIRE tool..

Suspicious-Local-901

FIRE people don’t necessarily believe in the strength of Bitcoin

JimFay

You’ll never convince someone who’s been focusing on FIRE to suddenly go all in on bitcoin. They’ve been disciplined for years, maybe decades, slowly and methodically building their wealth in an historically proven method. To them, bitcoin is just noise and another distraction. I think it makes more sense to present bitcoin as diversification and a hedge against the possible collapse of the debt bubble, financial institutions and fiat money. As a means to protect yourself, a 5 or 10% allocation can sound prudent.

rochfor

You’re missing the fact that BTC has been and continues to be an extremely volatile asset. FIRE community rely on safe % withdrawal rate of investments. You can’t currently do that with BTC. Also FIRE is more about getting your house in order in terms of debt and maximising tax efficient investment vehicles. BTC is the next step after that.

Ill_Turn6934

I just get the sense that FIRE people are much more conservative than those that go all in on BTC. They tend to have a more traditional “work and save as much as you can, invest into index funds and live well below your means” temperament.

MrBones2k

I think FIRE is more focused on conservative investing, like index funds and such. Prob think Bitcoin is too risky. Trey Sellers at Unchained is promoting Bitcoin FIRE. https://treysellers.com/bitcoin-fire/

instant_king

Start with basics. How much do you spend per month? Per year? Multiply by 25, what is the result? That is how much you need to FIRE in the simple 4% rule. Translate to Btc, how much do you hope it will be in 20 years? Done. 

Nitram_2000

I mean, sure, you can FIRE, but I think for that you should still have had at least 10-15 years of hard work under your belt. Then you know what you want to do, or at least what you don’t want to do. One then has the freedom to explore and still have plenty of years left on the clock

Zanar2002

Let's say you have 10 BTC and decide to go the barista FIRE route. So you have $1 M in USD purchashing power + say, $1,000 in fiat from your part-time job at Starbucks. You need $50k to pay rent, groceries, cocaine, whatever. So you first spend the trash fiat ($12,000) and then sell 0.38 BTC. That leaves you with 9.62 BTC. Assuming a CAGR of 20%, you'll have $1,154,000-worth of purchasing power the following year. So you spend the $12k in dirty fiat Starbucks pays you, but now you only need to sell 0.31 BTC. So now you have 9.31 BTC. Assume 19% CAGR, meaning you'll have $1,340,640-worth of purchasing power, and so on, so forth. Even assuming a CAGR around what gold offers (9% historically), you'll never run out of BTC. In reality, the CAGR is expected to be much higher than 20% for the foreseeable future. Around 29%, IIRC.

CXavier4545

Fat FIRE time!

Puzzleheaded-Bid713

Yep, the beef tallow fries are FIRE.

LrnFaroeseWthBergur

Asia doesn't care so much anymore about the US stock market. They seem to have stopped playing with fire. And now they're getting rewarded with FIRE instead. (Financial Independence and Early Retirement)

Huge_Monero_Shill

There are studies and blogs on the optimal live time consumption curve (basically, when do you spend money for maximum happiness outcomes), and it isn't "save until you splurge at 80". The FIRE community also has a lot of these hyper savers who have trained their thrift muscles so much they find it hard to transition out of that mode. My recommendation, if you feel like your stack is large enough to buy the future of your dreams, stop DCA and treat it like CoastFIRE (where you no longer need to make contributions to investments, but still earn an income) and spend within your current earning. Still might be worth maxing out your tax advantaged accounts, but depends on your goals and situation. So don't sell, just stop buying and enjoy the effective boost to your income! IMHO, only sell partial amounts of your stack ever and only to secure some big anchor of your dream life.

penty

This is kinda me minus 'dirtbags". Thanks to bitcoin and my 3.6k cost basis I've gone from Sabbatical to lean FIRE and this run will take me to easy FIRE and probably Fat FIRE. Still hang with my working friends but can do what I want as it comes up.

Zwetzak69

Yes, they're all like that. What worries me is that this one of the most upvoted comments in this thread. I had to check that we're still on the BTC sub and not some anti-BTC sub like Buttcoin or one of the gazillion 'Investing' or 'FIRE' subs. Nope, still BTC. So many people *still* do not get it. Even people who own Bitcoin. Truly fascinating, like the guy above you said.

ResponsibilitySea327

I'd take any BTC FIRE calculator with a grain of salt. It told me I would retire a multi-billionaire.

Banana_Crusader00

Look. Buying bitcoin, however profitable for you, is highly speculative, and that is a first strike for investors. There is nothing tangible behind bitcoin - in opposition to physical gold/silver, property or the companies of which shares you could own. Also: - It's highly correlated with stocks. Whether you want to admit it or not is besides the point, but tariffs and Liberation day proved it. When stocks fall, crypto falls. That is directly in opposition to the idea of diversification - when one thing falls, something else should rise. Thats why people would much rather invest in gold than btc. - It's not generating any money or value for the FIRE community or dividend investors - There is no way to retire on btc. You will have to exchange it for something else in the end anyway - and investors don't want to be late to the party, when all the btc owners try to exchange it for something that can sustain their early retirement I don't see anything inherently bad in crypto. Don't get me wrong. The only reason why i don't have any is that i'm saving for a downpayment for a house and i can't live with the volatility of btc. Main rule of investing is - Invest in whatever lets you sleep at night. I don't see anything bad in keeping 5~10% of portfolio in speculative assets like btc - speculation is literally the reason why leverage, CFD and options were created- but i don't think that keeping everything in btc is good for your mental state

Nice_Presentation353

If you want to consider more scenarios, including pessimistic ones, you can also consider this tool : https://www.dontbuybitcoin.com/bitcoin-FIRE-calculator/

Zwetzak69

It's the same in my local FIRE sub, and any other financial sub I ever visited before. It's the same reason why Buttcoin exists; they're just all mad because they "missed the train" - or that's what they think. When you tell them that BTC will still (at least) 10x in the not-so-distant-future, they all call you a gambler and say the classic "past performance is no guarantee of future results" line. That is the reason why I don't visit any of that garbage anymore, because I can only guess that if you constantly look at anti-BTC FUD, you'll eventually start to believe some of it. These people got rich slowly over the span of 40 years, and they don't want some youngsters to basically do the same as they did, but with twenty times the speed. Most people over there are finally rich, but the downside is that they're old and have no energy left to do anything. The one thing they absolutely despise, is someone who is way younger than them that is in the same boat. These people don't wish the best for you, they just want you to follow the same path as they did (at best).

elidevious

Same thing is true with the FIRE community. Too bad for them because I would have loved to share the strategy that enabled me to retire at 35.

Designer-Beginning16

I always say that the Spain FIRE number is minimum 1.5-2M€, but of course I’d rather live in a fancy balearic island or in Madrid. 1M€ might be feasible in smaller cities like Soria, Teruel, etc … or in villages. Also to take into consideration family and kids.

notlooking743

I think it's going to depend on the individual. If you were doing a FIRE sort of strategy, for instance, you should probably sell as soon as you enough to retire. I don't think there's much of a point in making it dependent on a fixed price target

FieserKiller

what profit? my BTC \_is\_ the profit. However, I don't go for price but time: when I'm 50 yo I'll FIRE and live off my BTC, which sadly means selling I guess

Personal-Reality9045

As someone who achieved FIRE/fatFIRE through early Bitcoin investment and currently lives off it, I want to emphasize the importance of understanding finance. It's crucial to be able to budget and perform calculations that provide concrete numbers. Currently, I'm spending below the rate that by bitcoin is appreciating. From my simulations, I am never running out of money. That can still change though, so I have to be vigilant, and when volatility rises, I adjust my quality of life. Running Monte Carlo simulations can help determine how much Bitcoin you need and what appreciation rate is necessary to sustain withdrawals over time. This gives you probability-based models for making informed decisions, even if they can't predict exact outcomes. I'm surprised by the post indicating a lack of basic mathematical skills needed to calculate monthly expenses and account for inflation when determining retirement goals. These are fundamental calculations. I strongly recommend investing time in improving your abilities here.

AnyWaltzWillDo

You will never be able to retire with that amount. Even if we hit 1 million you are looking at about 100k. Even in poorer countries that won't last for 50+ years. Here is the deal. What you need to focus on is: 1. Making more money 2. Spend less money That will give you more money to invest and over time you will build up savings and investments. Focusing on spending less is where most people see the biggest gains. The bonus? The less you learn to spend the earlier you can retire/have freedom. Focus on that and just put the savings into investments. Start researching FIRE(Financial independence, retire early). They often recommend just doing index funds, which is a safe method, but there is a lot of other advice and scenarios you can learn from.

vnielz

Whats early? Its seems somewhat on the low side for FIRE if this is all to rely on, but who knows. Keep stacking.

FieserKiller

I'll FIRE in 5.5 years when I'm 50 years old by living off my coins till I die

Kie_ra

Aiming to FIRE in mid or late 40s, so about 20 years to go. I just buy as soon as I have any spare cash, ignoring all noise like news, cycles etc. I used to do the same with tradfi investments but with how much BTC has grown, it's now close to being 100% of my portfolio.

Nitram_2000

In a not too dissimilar position, but I stacked hard last year. Still didn’t meet my main target, t I’ve now got enough that in 10 years I can maybe have somewhat of an outlook on early retirement and having set my kids up. FIRE is gone at this age. Comfy retirement and legacy money is the goal.

110010010011

I’m taking a general FIRE approach, which limits withdrawals to 3-4% per year. So it’s more likely that my expenses will go up to match my “income” is the value of BTC goes up. I’m also not currently retired, but that 3% currently doubles my income.

oogally

I've been reading this [FIRE blog](https://mrmoneymustache.com/2024/02/03/how-to-afford-a-house/) longer than I've been stacking bitcoin, but the two strategies are highly complementary.  Finding a home may be more difficult at the moment, but there are still plenty of helpful tips there if you're open minded. Housing has always been my most significant expense - even in my LCOL area - but aside from that, I've found there are a lot of hobbies that are rewarding and don't cost much.  Make incremental improvements and take comfort in the steady progress you're making toward your savings goals. Even spending 40% of your income on housing, you can still sock away a healthy amount of savings in fairly short order. You've got this.

BigLawIPLitigator

Yeah. Bitcoin has definitely made me rethink my FIRE plans. There will come a time when I normally would have stopped working but will continue to work only so that I can keep stacking sats (or at least not sell the sats that I have)...

Icy-Aardvark-1158

Wolf is on FIRE FR 🤩

Huge_Monero_Shill

Say you hit your number today, 25x your best life expenses in BTC. Would you be comfortable retiring? What percent of your portfolio is BTC? Trad FIRE's biggest risk is the sequence of returns, ie, bad market years in the first few years of retirement. With BTC, the volatility is so high I would imagine you would want or need sizeable cash fund and or traditional ETF side to your portfolio.

Decent_Taro_2358

If I had 100 coins, I could probably retire peacefully. But no one likes to sit on the couch and do nothing (well, most normal people). Have a look at r/FIRE or r/fatFIRE and see how many people have an existential crisis when they finally do retire. The only difference is that I would only do work I like. I could say no to anything I want. But I would keep working and keep stacking.

expatfreedom

So true. And there’s also that graphic that shows as your understanding of bitcoin increases, so does your allocation. People start at 1 or 10% and just trying to trade… but then they end up realizing cash is trash and want to hold BTC 110% with fiat loans, for as long as possible. Do you happen to know a comprehensive course , playlist or video series, that will take beginners through the first 50 hours and get them up to speed as quickly as possible? I want to include it on my bitcoin themed FIRE sub if there’s a good introduction like that

brando2131

If you're making considerable amounts of money and already have a lot of money, then yeah... But "do bitcoin full time" doesn't make sense, there isn't anything to "do" in bitcoin full time. I think you mean "retire earlier", look up FIRE (financial independence, retire early).

Secret_Nobody_405

Although I absolutely love your response, it’s brilliant, logical, and seriously aspirational; but death can strike any time well before we achieve FIRE. I have also made the career decision to choose a career that I can work easily work FT, switch to PT, and then Casual as I age. I used to always desire retiring early but after leaving the workforce for 2 years whilst studying I missed the culture, team and friendship from working. So my aim is to travel and do what I want now, with family and continue to work until I die 😎. My observations are that if you stop moving you die. I also have never met a 90 year old who retired at 40, I could be wrong though.