ZIM

FunCranberry112122

SPY up 3%. Let me check what ZIM is doing. Down -1.77%. What a dumpster fire.

ZombieFrenchKisser

I'm somehow positive this year. Despite losing 60% of my port on ZIM earlier this year.

UMC_MadAuk

Why ZIM been down so bad?

SirRandyMarsh

Can we play who has the lowest PE ratio? ZIM is .43 and that shits funny.

TradeLikeWater

ALGO’s won’t stop selling $ZIM because, no shit, the rail strike isn’t happening Not even the smallest consideration that maybe the stock is oversold when it has a balance sheet of $40 a share, is trading for $20 a share, and just beat earnings by 10%

bigcig

is the market really even open if you don't receive a notification that ZIM is at a new 52w low?

TradeLikeWater

$ZIM down 33% in one week after beating earnings and announcing a 10% dividend

VisualMod

#Ban Bet Lost /u/_Retrograde_ made a bet that ZIM would go to 30.0 within **2 weeks** when it was 27.08 and it did not, so they were banned for a week. Their record is now 0 wins and 4 losses ^^[**Discord**](http://discord.gg/wsbverse) ^^[BanBets](https://www.reddit.com/r/wallstreetbets/wiki/banbets/) ^^VoteBot ^^[FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/wallstreetbets/wiki/votebot/) ^^[Leaderboard](https://www.reddit.com/r/wallstreetbets/wiki/leaderboard/) ^^- ^^[**Keep_VM_Alive**](https://www.patreon.com/visualmod)

ICY_Issac09

My guess is ZIM's 2023 dividends of (9, 2, 2 and 2) total $15. Bottom Line 60% on $25 in a bad economic year ahead.

themarkedguy

ZIM IPOd at the luckiest time imaginable for them. They IPOd just a few months before spot freight rates 10x’d in a market where they are the only market player that used spot rates. Now that rates are back to normal they are sitting on an ocean of cash. I believe there must be an informal agreement in Israel(the company is mostly owned by KEN which is famously the holding company of one of Israel’s richest) to make sure every penny coming out of the company is taxed. So ZIM has been paying out half of its cash haul in divvies and the other half has been sitting there. So now their business model is crap, their cash flow is collapsing, and they may lose money presently. BUT they have enough cash on their ledgers to take the company private and they are Israel’s largest taxpayer. imo ZIM is a play on next January’s 2023 balance-for-the-year dividend. If they stick to plan they should have a $15 dividend then. And hopefully you can get in before the divy is common knowledge, but dump before the divy and the share price collapse. Thing is ZIM is probably fairly priced between $25-30/share. Buying ZIM at $25 is kinda like buying a pile of $40 for $25. But you have absolutely no way of putting it out. And the longer it goes on the more cash burns, BUT you’re being teased continually that you will be able to pull about $15 out of the fire in 3-4 months. It’s a great WSB play. Considering the divvy murders all call holders, if you hold options you really need to be on the ball. -no position. I don’t like setting money on fire.-

-Dreamville-

I will continue to buy ZIM everytime it gets anywhere near 21-22 range and hold forever , or until I’m rich

SnS2500

Suppose you had controlling interest in a company that made 1,000,000 this year, but you anticipated it would make 300,000 next year... and even if you invested 500,000 next year to get more business, you would likely get back less than the 500,000. What would you do? Would you let that money just sit in the company with no way to exploit it (other than going into a completely different business), or would you put in place a short term dividend policy where most of that million is distributed to you and the other shareholders? ZIM is a legit company that had revenues between 3 and 4 every year between 2012 and 2020. 2021 = 10, 2022 = 13. Now assume 2023 = 4.

rozemacaron

Let's say you bought at the best possible price a month ago of 22.34 USD. The dividend they just awarded is 2.95 USD. If I divide 22.34 USD by 2.95 USD then I get 13.21%, and this is gross. So I don't understand how you get to 25%. I don't think shipping is going away, but earnings are down 50% from their highs. This, together with a lot of other stocks being down 50%, is what I think is causing ZIM to trade at -80% of its highs. I am also invested in the company due to their dividends and currently attractive price. But dividend investing is new to me, I want to test out a few high dividend yield stocks with a low price and see where it takes me.

TradeLikeWater

$ZIM going for a 10% day

VisualMod

Interesting. I will look into ZIM Integrated Shipping and analyze the financials to determine if it is a good investment opportunity or not. Thank you for providing me with this information!

FullyTaxedBro

ZIM Integrated Shipping. 100% dividend, shorts will get rekt. DFV

ZombieFrenchKisser

lmao shippers can't get a break. A -8% drop in the weekly freight index. RIP $ZIM https://fbx.freightos.com/

manginamonologues

Do you get the dividend if you buy ZIM now?

420_Funding_Secured

$ZIM only has div for the 1st 3 quarters

Koala_eiO

Well I sure hope you don't have ZIM in your portfolio.

Significant-Worth-75

Why is ZIM calls IV so low but puts IV so high?

DMVganggang

You’re half-right. Stock buybacks alone won’t raise the value of a stock price. It’s the earnings per share growth that will. The stock buybacks act like a multiplier effect so if earnings are overall decreasing then the buybacks won’t offset and raise the stock price. And earnings are what fuel buybacks which is why they’re the main variable in valuations $ZIM is a good example of this. They’ve been paying a really fat dividend because they’ve been made huge profits from supply chain issues. But their stock price is still declining because earnings is still expected to decline

Foreign-Context-4334

What’s everyone’s thoughts on ZIM?

-Dreamville-

ZIM is a steal anywhere around 20 imo

tohon123

ZIM!!!!!

VisualMod

>ZIM is a great company and their stock is doing well. I'm not surprised, they are the best in the business.

camarouge

ZIM is still paying a ludicrous dividend, next one pays on the 9th. If every one of their dividends paid the same going forward, you'd make back the stock price in 9 quarters.

Screwyball

ZIM tends to keep popping up on this subreddit and has done so for several months. The main reason seems to be because their most recent earnings year has been downright exceptional which makes the stock look extremely attractive on surface level metrics such as p/e's, dividend yields, p/b etc. This lures in a lot of investors who seem to be unaware of the extreme cyclicality of shipping and that these metrics don't tell you anything about the future and thus arent applicable for cyclical companies. When you think about it, the past is done, the profits have been made and were already paid out to the shareholders, so all that matters is what lies ahead. So how can we estimate what lies ahead? Well first we can look at current container shipping rates, [which have now fully collapsed to pre-pandemic levels.](https://www.statista.com/statistics/1250636/global-container-freight-index/). While ZIM is still reaping the benefits from some locked in contracts at higher rates, they will soon be forced to operate back at normalized levels. So how did $ZIM fare at normalized levels, such as in the years before the pandemic? Well despite the fact that its current public listing is relatively recent ZIM is over 75 years old (and has been public before) so we can look back a fair bit. The numbers aren't great. For the past ten years it has run at a massive loss in 2012, 2013, 2014, 2016, 2018, a small loss in 2019 and barely broke even in 2015 and 2017. It was now, very exceptionally, making a boatload (pun intended) of profits due to the supply chain disruptions that have lasted far longer than most predicted which has given this stock very handsome returns, absurd dividend yields and a seemingly very very low multiple. However, it seems very reasonable to assume that as soon as their contracts returns to normal, they will be running at a loss again and the dividends and low multiples will vanish like snow in the sun.

graybeard5529

That's the reason GOGL and ZIM have unsustainable dividends --last month's news ;) More supply +lesser demand = lower prices? Have to see ...

T3rribl3Gam3D3v

ZIM puts?

BYE_HI_SELL_LOW

“That dividend just made me bust in my pants! I’m Ballish! We like ZIM to 475!” \-

sparkit420

I'll take a pass on this for now but in return I will offer you ZIM. Aprx. 20% SI , makes money and pays out a sweet divi. I'll publish DD soon but check it out. Next ex-div date is Nov.28 for $2.95 . I sold yesterday for profit @ $25 but hoping for a pull back to re enter. Even though this is a long hold with squeeze potential I am considering short term puts in anticipation of a sell off after divvy before it settles. If you check it out would love to hear your thoughts.

aka0007

Ah... So now stock prices are based on past performance... when every broker will tell you past results are not indicative of future performance. You should go all in on ZIM. Crazy past results compared to current share price.

Public_Knowledge_908

ZIM INTEGRATED SHIPPING looks good

Aniki722

Too volatile I guess. One year they'll make amazing profits and give crazy dividends and a few years later they're just barely scraping by. There's just not much faith in them, I mean look at ZIM. Given more dividends this year than their share price is currently.

ProsaicPansy

ZIM is a shipping company. Shipping companies are inherently cyclical. There was a huge spike in freight rates, which led companies to over-earn and be able to pay this dividend. Look at what freight prices have been doing recently (https://fbx.freightos.com/) they’re falling off a cliff. If we go into recession next year, these rates could go even lower and then ZIM will have MUCH worse margins, and have depressed earnings. The stock market is forward looking, a dividend yield is inherently backwards looking. There’s no way ZIM will be able to maintain their dividend because they have massive headwinds with slowing economy. ZIM could be a good long term investment, but those are the main reasons someone would sell this stock. Look at their profitability before 2020, they used to be a break even business at best, and now they have massive profits. Wouldn’t be surprised to see them at break even again if the economy and demand for goods cools. The question is, are you happy to own the company at a much lower earnings (I.e. higher P/E if price stays the same)?

Gourd-Futures69

Using historical dividends as an assumption of the future is misleading here but for most companies it’s a reasonable way to present the data in a general format. ZIM’s business model just doesn’t fit the mold though. I think a lot of fear is priced into the stock, it pays out a majority of earnings as dividends and those are tied to shipping rates which are cyclical, coming off highs of pandemic supply chain issues and into a looming recession. But will it never making money on shipping contracts again? No, but people are quick to see the yield and call it a dividend trap when it’s actually pretty transparent. Options for long dated vs short dated are interesting as IV is the inverse of most stocks but the spread is MASSIVE so idk of a strategy that’d work on this one

Godmode

Guess I just have to wait and see. I didnt have ZIM the last time they declared, this is my first time. Nov 28 is ex date and its payable on Dec 7. Since I dont live in US, am just wondering whats the shave off. Israel has 30% withholding tax for dividends paid to non-Israel shareholders and then I will get double withholding tax from US at 30% it seems. This is terrible.

Brett-_-_

I would add that from [https://www.statista.com/statistics/1250636/global-container-freight-index/](https://www.statista.com/statistics/1250636/global-container-freight-index/) that container rates went from $10k down to $3k, but this latest rate is still above a longer term average before the pandemic. However, on a technicality ZIM was not listed on NYSE until 2021. Therefore there is not the stock price history to compare what it 'should do' as a base price when things get flatter again in terms of shipping rates.

AliveNot

People buy the stock for dividend then dump the stock. Quite literally all its significant downward action YTD is from post dividend. The dividend is unsustainable in the long run, so I wouldn't invest in it. This is all to say, nobody cares about the actual company, just the dividend rate. This is similar with other, more smaller dividend companies, but ZIM being the worst.

BrokeSingleDads

That's only Los Angeles, no one is shipping into L.A. because of the Union Strike threat. Look at the eastern seaboard and down south. ZIM avg Freight rate was 3,353 and Los Angeles is a very low port for them. ZIM serves 300,000 customers in over 100 countries and 350 Ports worldwide. They have been shifting away from L.A. as everyone has expected a union labor strike in L.A. They've been hitting eastern seaboards and railroading their products. They have renegotiated their contracts with AMZN and renegotiated the Vessels rates 6 months ago below market daily value. NET CASH was 1.67B on a2B market Cap... On top of that Maersk has refused to renegotiate their contract rates and have stated that revenues will only fall 2-4% in 2023 per their guidance in last earnings calls. If you're going to post the Los Angeles route maybe you might want to edit and update the averages for New York and down south... GL For the record I do have a position and have had since their IPO. 15million shares currently short and I'm in at 23.25avg. As soon as China reopens and factories 🏭 start producing again at regular numbers I expect this to level off and still make $6.00 EPS/QTR easily leaving it with a 1 P/E.

nolawnchayre

Rip ZIM

SnS2500

I haven't had ZIM but had other shipping companies. If they didn't have the dividend, their chart would just be a nice upward movement from January 2021 till now. They have pretty low institutional ownership so I suppose management is directing these short term profits to themselves and other shareholders because they don't need all the cash in the business in the future.

ExiledGirlVS

Hope ZIM is still worth buying

luciform44

Sometimes cyclical companies give out big one-time dividends when they are in a very profitable period. Some of the algorithms use the TTM payouts as their nominal yield, so if ZIM gave a one-time $5 dividend, and then the price of the stock falls to $4, then the yield is 120% (5/4) according to the algorithm, even if the company has made it clear that they are not going to pay out any more for the foreseeable future. Algorithms are dumb, basically, because they don't dig any deeper for relevant info. Once you are a year away from that big one-time pay out, the state yield will fall to zero, and anyone who bought while it was supposedly 120% will have gotten nothing.

ParticularWar9

Yes, it's annoying. My accountant couldn't figure out how to frame it as a tax paid to another jurisdiction because there is no record of it on any statement. he only evidence that the dividend was paid is ZIM's press release and financial statements saying they paid $XX/sh in dividends. It's as if the money was never paid to me and taxes were not deducted. ZIM never even notified Schwab regarding the taxes, which is where I held the shares. No withholding statement from Israel, nothing. It's as if that part of the dividend never existed. Schwab was either unable or unwilling to help me or my accountant. They said the only way to get the money or even a deduction thaT would acceptable to IRS is apparently to directly contact the securities/tax folks in Israel. Schwab wasn't willing to do this, as this has apparently been a problem for them in other cases, although they didn't say this directly. I immediately sold the shares and do not plan on owning it in the future.

graham2100

ZIM published its earnings last week https://investors.zim.com/news/news-details/2022/ZIM-Reports-Financial-Results-for-the-Third-Quarter-and-First-Nine-Months-of-2022/default.aspx Dividend equals 30% of quarterly earnings resulting in a forward yield of about 50%. Shipping pricing is volatile, to risky for most investors, but the company has little net debt so it may very well be way oversold after the Covid boom ended.

graham2100

ZIM published earnings last week https://investors.zim.com/news/news-details/2022/ZIM-Reports-Financial-Results-for-the-Third-Quarter-and-First-Nine-Months-of-2022/default.aspx Company pays out 30% of quarterly earnings as dividends, resulting in an actual forward yield of about 50%.

Miserable_Section103

So $ZIM isnt paying those high dividends?

AtentionToAtention

im a ZIM guy, Div is gonna be cut but its still a better value than any shipping stock

111001011001

Yes a company could do that but ZIM’s business model is to send the profits to the shareholders via dividends No profit = no dividend

TakingChances01

I don’t know anything about ZIM but in most of these cases the company is losing money you’re correct

WanderingWithWright

I will be averaging down and putting about $1000 into $ZIM. Mostly a dividend play but they are undervalued as of now. They should be a $40 stock.

PickleMysterious2361

Yes dude I’d be all in on ZIM if they didn’t tax dividends

Reddit-Mgmt

Barclays analyst Alexia Dogani maintains ZIM Integrated Shipping (NYSE:ZIM) with a Equal-Weight and lowers the price target from $63 to $26.5.

Notoriolus10

Every time someone claims that companies like ZIM are a bargain because they trade at or below 1 time last 12 months of earnings, show them this chart so they can see what the market is pricing in.

exagon1

Crying in ZIM

ParticularWar9

It doesn't show up as a tax on your brokerage statement. You can apply directly to the Israeli government for a wavier, but unless it's a huge position it's probably not worth the trouble, and it might not get granted anyway. All this info is in ZIM's stock prospectus.

DartFanatic

>“the price action is wrong” This is often true. But there is always a reason behind the price actio. The rising chartering agreement costs with the free fall for shipping rates are the reason now. Whether that makes ZIM a good investment cant be foretold by the price action

themarkedguy

Nah, it’s believed to be a political thing. ZIM is the biggest taxpayer to Israel on the planet. And the owner is a well connected billionaire who was basically handed the company at the behest of the government. He’s not buying back anything. The IPO was created to allow insiders that pulled it out of its last crunch to exit. They’ve now exited. I believe ZIM management doesn’t really care about the share price.

Ambitious_Reality974

i was being sarcastic. ZIM gets posted a lot around here

ronrein

I'm sorry but you are fucking regarded. ZIM is a containership company and they do not follow the Baltic index. Please just take 5 seconds to google it before you spew some rubbish.

NotJustVirginia

Who here bought ZIM at peak?

RonMexico13

ZIM is absolutely not dry bulk. You've never seen a ZIM container?

RonMexico13

Yes please someone show this to the regarded individuals in the ZIM thread someone just put up today.

slipperymagoo

ZIM is quite specifically, container shipping. I think you may be confused.

HarrisLam

yeah but something tells me he isn't selling soon. ZIM is just being dumped way too hard. The money they earn and dividend return is really good.

kurtasle

ZIM has a lot of tonnage on charter, where they pay high daily rates. They don’t own a whole lot - but returning charters before term = penalties. Dropping volume and rates = operting service loops at a loss. They don’t operate in an alliance, so they don’t benefit from VSA. I would be cautious here.

komidor64

Yeah things aren't just moving from China to the West anymore because China is shut down and US is buying less cheap useless crap. ZIM is a first mover in this new reality of what is really large scale drop shipping

Haunting_Ad_6021

ZIM is not container shipping

No-Reflection-7705

Bought a single share of ZIM at 59$ 😎😎😎 I mean… still doin better than if I bought meta

Whitebrown22

Puts on ZIM

eazy-83

Cramer hates ZIM

vegasoptions666

Acquired via CSP assignment: 5,100 shares of EAR @ $1.75 - Currently $0.52 13,400 shares of FFIE @ $1.30 - Currently $0.38 2,325 shares of NLY @ $24.14 - Currently $19.91 2,200 shares of ZIM @ $32.25 - Currently $24.78 At least NLY and ZIM pay dividends.

AVERSE_AVICE

Watching for DSX lows as well as ZIM

Haunting_Ad_6021

Yes, but don't confuse container with dry bulk. I linked to the chart that applies to ZIM.

DartFanatic

If everyone is bullish and the price action is wrong, it is usually good to dive in. I found that if shipment rates go back to 2019 and given the current oil price and the resulting chartering agreement, ZIM would lose around 1b a year.

FunCranberry112122

Literally no one here talks about the increased charter rate which will be brutal for ZIM when combined with a shipping rates crash.

Zexel14

First off, it says 111% and second, ZIM is a stock that has been discussed a gazillion times.

zulufux999

Wait, you mean all you ZIM geniuses aren’t all millionaires yet?

Stunning-Ear-2715

I bought some DAC after I sold ATCO following the buyout. DAC sold all their ZIM shares.

LincolnHamishe

I thought everyone knew about ZIM. I'd avoid.

Zueter

I keep having this conversation with my father who wants to buy more ZIM every couple days. They pay a variable dividend of about 30% of profits. Look at earnings a couple years ago before COVID and realize they might not be making any money in 2023. Not only will the dividend go to 0, but the stock will go down to $5 if that happens. It seems fairly valued, but not a bargain.

UnwittingCapitalist

It's an unregulated sham. Expect nothing less from an apartheid state government which did the leg work promoting ZIM. They work within its guts of inhumanity

VisualMod

>It's great to see a company like ZIM Integrated Shipping doing well. Their earnings exceed expectations and their sales growth is strong. It's clear that they are a leader in the shipping industry and I'm sure they will continue to be successful in the future.

teteban79

Shipping rates are way down. On top of that, ZIM market is spot rates which are even more down You're way over your head here. Check the latest dividends they gave out. If you bought every time before divex and sold once you got the div, you'd lost money each time

Cool_Cartographer_39

I liked DSX a little better, but got out anyways on their recent good news. I saved this post, and will look at ZIM again if it drops some more.