BTC

alexrod9876

Thanks! I’m new to the investing world, I don’t care to be rich but if there’s a chance I could make a difference in my kids life or their kids lives in the future and send them to college that’s all I’m looking to do and I’m happy to sacrifice now. Thanks for the suggestions I’ll check it out. Do you recommend splitting my BTC up in multiple wallets and contribute to both when I can?

Fatfire_Crypto

You didn't create a post to complain when BTC on-chain fees were over $200 per transaction in the 50 blocks post halving, and exchanges *weren't* charging that to you. At least be consistent in your complaining 🙄 Sometimes exchanges lose money on fees, but on average you would expect them to make a profit. Choose an exchange that has a fee range you can accept.

Efficient_Culture569

Same here but I do self custody. I told her to contact a trusted friend and he'll know how to help as he self custody his own BTC as well.

Lurchco3953

Do you think about what your coffee, lunch, car or house costs in BTC or sats? The prevalent answer to that question would be no, you think about the cost of those items in your native currency.

Archophob

that's exactly OP's point? BTC removes the need to trust in people.

Lurchco3953

At this time, it is easier for (the majority of people) to understand/comprehend what a $1 or multiple dollars will purchase vs an ounce of gold (or gram or any other division). They don't readily comprehend what an ounce of gold, a BTC or any of their measures/division buy. It's similar to people who can speak several languages, typically they think in only one of them.

CointestMod

#Bitcoin Con-Arguments Below is an argument written by CreepToeCurrentSea which won 2nd place in the Bitcoin Con-Arguments topic for a prior [Cointest](/r/CointestOfficial/wiki/cointest_policy) round. > Bitcoin is a peer-to-peer digital currency that can be transferred via the bitcoin network. Bitcoin transactions are cryptographically verified by network nodes and recorded in a public distributed ledger known as a blockchain. The cryptocurrency was created in 2008 by an unknown individual or group of individuals using the alias Satoshi Nakamoto. ([1](https://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf)) > > # CONs > > **Early Buyers have the Higher Ground.** > > * Those who bought BTC in it's early years have a great advantage over the recent ones. One thing is that they won't have to worry much about it's price dropping now since they're still much likely in the green in terms of percentage gains. Most of these early investors are also capable of manipulating the market via wash trades not giving the true traded volume within the market and thus deceiving most novice traders/investors into believing fake signals ([2](https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-05-24/bitcoin-manipulation-is-said-to-be-focus-of-u-s-criminal-probe), [3](https://www.marketwatch.com/story/us-regulators-demand-trading-data-from-bitcoin-exchanges-in-manipulation-probe-2018-06-08)). There is even a possibility that Satoshi Nakamoto himself/herself/themselves will suddenly access the wallet he/she/they own/s and proceed to sell the large amount of BTC they have which would greatly cause a crash in Bitcoin's price. > > **Attracts Illegal Transactions and Criminal Activities** > > * Bitcoin's innate trait of being publicly available and pseudonymous not only attracts those who seek independence but it also attracts those engage in illicit activities and perform illegal transactions. This is one of the downsides of giving back the power of choice to people, not all of them will do the morally right thing to do and as a result, economist, lawyers, and even countries will label Bitcoin as just another medium for buying/selling illegal goods/services. ([5](https://web.archive.org/web/20140325214514/http://www.bloombergview.com/articles/2013-08-08/did-the-sec-just-validate-bitcoin-no-), [6](https://www.economist.com/finance-and-economics/2012/09/29/monetarists-anonymous), [7](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/mar/22/silk-road-online-drug-marketplace), [8](https://www.cnbc.com/2018/07/09/nobel-prize-winning-economist-joseph-stiglitz-criticizes-bitcoin.html), [9](https://www.fnlondon.com/articles/stiglitz-roubini-and-rogoff-lead-joint-attack-on-bitcoin-20180709)) > > **It still Affects the Environment** > > * Bitcoin accounts 0.1% of the world's greenhouse gas emissions this year. The waste from it's parts also affect the environment as it's equipment only last an average of 1.3 years, especially, ASICS that aren't really reusable after their expected wear and tear. Although efforts have been made to address this energy and waste problem such as using green energy for Bitcoin mining, there is still a need to further improve this so as to avoid future problems in the environment ([10](https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2021/sep/17/waste-from-one-bitcoin-transaction-like-binning-two-iphones), [11](https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-58572385), [12](https://digiconomist.net/bitcoin-electronic-waste-monitor/), [13](https://www.business-standard.com/article/international/going-green-how-to-ditch-fossil-fuels-powering-the-bitcoin-network-122042100219_1.html), [14](https://www.jbs.cam.ac.uk/insight/2022/a-deep-dive-into-bitcoins-environmental-impact/), [15](https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/document/9385063)). Regardless with how small its effects are compared to other industries, it still should be a unified act to preserve the environment for as long as humanly possible for the future of humans and the world itself. > > **The Requirement of Being Responsible and Disciplined** > > * The constant triple-checking of addresses making sure that it's yours and not some dead end address or the fact that you need to keep your passphrase safe physically and never keep them in any device connected to the internet as to avoid any possible hacks/scams. The decentralization that Bitcoin gives you the freedom to finally be your own bank, but it comes at a cost. You need to be responsible and disciplined enough because unlike traditional banks, being your own bank doesn't give you any protection or safety nets like FDIC (Federal Deposit Insurance Corporation or any other deposit insurance corporation) when things go south. > > *Sources:* > > [*https://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf*](https://bitcoin.org/bitcoin.pdf) > > [*https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-05-24/bitcoin-manipulation-is-said-to-be-focus-of-u-s-criminal-probe*](https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2018-05-24/bitcoin-manipulation-is-said-to-be-focus-of-u-s-criminal-probe) > > [*https://www.marketwatch.com/story/us-regulators-demand-trading-data-from-bitcoin-exchanges-in-manipulation-probe-2018-06-08*](https://www.marketwatch.com/story/us-regulators-demand-trading-data-from-bitcoin-exchanges-in-manipulation-probe-2018-06-08) > > [*https://web.archive.org/web/20140325214514/http://www.bloombergview.com/articles/2013-08-08/did-the-sec-just-validate-bitcoin-no-*](https://web.archive.org/web/20140325214514/http://www.bloombergview.com/articles/2013-08-08/did-the-sec-just-validate-bitcoin-no-) > > [*https://www.economist.com/finance-and-economics/2012/09/29/monetarists-anonymous*](https://www.economist.com/finance-and-economics/2012/09/29/monetarists-anonymous) > > [*https://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/mar/22/silk-road-online-drug-marketplace*](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/mar/22/silk-road-online-drug-marketplace) > > [*https://www.cnbc.com/2018/07/09/nobel-prize-winning-economist-joseph-stiglitz-criticizes-bitcoin.html*](https://www.cnbc.com/2018/07/09/nobel-prize-winning-economist-joseph-stiglitz-criticizes-bitcoin.html) > > [*https://www.fnlondon.com/articles/stiglitz-roubini-and-rogoff-lead-joint-attack-on-bitcoin-20180709*](https://www.fnlondon.com/articles/stiglitz-roubini-and-rogoff-lead-joint-attack-on-bitcoin-20180709) > > [*https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2021/sep/17/waste-from-one-bitcoin-transaction-like-binning-two-iphones*](https://www.theguardian.com/technology/2021/sep/17/waste-from-one-bitcoin-transaction-like-binning-two-iphones) > > [*https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-58572385*](https://www.bbc.com/news/technology-58572385) > > [*https://digiconomist.net/bitcoin-electronic-waste-monitor/*](https://digiconomist.net/bitcoin-electronic-waste-monitor/) > > [*https://www.business-standard.com/article/international/going-green-how-to-ditch-fossil-fuels-powering-the-bitcoin-network-122042100219\_1.html*](https://www.business-standard.com/article/international/going-green-how-to-ditch-fossil-fuels-powering-the-bitcoin-network-122042100219_1.html) > > [*https://www.jbs.cam.ac.uk/insight/2022/a-deep-dive-into-bitcoins-environmental-impact/*](https://www.jbs.cam.ac.uk/insight/2022/a-deep-dive-into-bitcoins-environmental-impact/) > > [*https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/document/9385063*](https://ieeexplore.ieee.org/document/9385063) ***** Would you like to learn more? [Click here](/r/CointestOfficial/comments/100p7u8/top_coins_bitcoin_conarguments_january_2023/) to be taken to the original topic-thread for this argument or you can scan through the [Cointest Archive](/r/CointestOfficial/wiki/cointest_archive#wiki_Bitcoin) to find arguments on this topic in other rounds. Since this is a con-argument, what could be a better time to promote the Skeptics Discussion thread? You can find the latest thread [here](/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/1cd6wun/daily_crypto_discussion_april_26_2024_gmt0/).

CointestMod

* Relevant Cointest topics: [Bitcoin Cash](https://www.reddit.com/r/CointestOfficial/wiki/cointest_archive#wiki_bitcoin_cash), [Litecoin](https://www.reddit.com/r/CointestOfficial/wiki/cointest_archive#wiki_litecoin), [Lightning Network](https://www.reddit.com/r/CointestOfficial/wiki/cointest_archive#wiki_lightning_network), [Proof of Work](https://www.reddit.com/r/CointestOfficial/wiki/cointest_archive#wiki_proof-of-work), [Taproot](https://www.reddit.com/r/CointestOfficial/wiki/cointest_archive#wiki_taproot) * Official and related subreddits: r/Bitcoin, r/BitcoinMarkets, r/BitcoinMining, r/BTC, r/BitcoinCash. * Sort comments as controversial first by [clicking here](/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/1cdeq5x/bitcoin_could_outperform_sp_500_says_crypto/?sort=controversial). Doesn't work on mobile.

petragta

"It’s been a humbling experience." I had the same feeling when I get my 1st BTC It’s important to share this to the community

idigholes

Dude you wanna see what Coinbase were charging for BTC withdrawals the other day compared to the actual meme pool amount it was a 10X over $150

One13Truck

To be honest the BTC bull run and shit coin pumps in 2017. I saw a friend dump a few K into something and pocket six figures. I previously only heard of Bitcoin from the IT nerds who sold a bunch of it to pay for a lot of stuff around their home in the days when seeing BTC hit the hundreds of dollars seemed like a huge peak it would never top again. I regret not buying before then but I was still early enough considering I’ve lasted two bull runs so far.

WannaFIREinBE

Same situation here. Cold storage since 2017 but now what about the wife and kids financial future if I get hit by a bus tomorrow. I’m in the process of moving my UTXO to exchange when the mempool is low and buying Bitcoin ETF at the same time I’m selling on the exchange (need a cash buffer to do so) the goal is to make purchase the ETF at as much as possible the same price I’m selling BTC for. When I’m making the transaction, setting up the appropriate fee, checking the transaction two or three times before broadcasting it, I fully realize the funds will probably be lost at some point if my wife didn’t got any support from a friend of mine.

coinfeeds-bot

tldr; Crypto trader Kevin predicts that Bitcoin could outperform the S&P 500, based on his analysis of the BTC/USD versus S&P 500 chart showing consolidation just below all-time highs. He shared this insight on social media, suggesting a potential shift in Bitcoin's performance relative to the stock market. *This summary is auto generated by a bot and not meant to replace reading the original article. As always, DYOR.

cl3ft

Me too buddy. I spent all my $6 BTC I didn't buy it as an investment until the 2013 bullrun near peak at $750 each. Then it crashed hard for 3 years. I got into ETH in '16 though. That made me. I like to think of my 2011 Silk road purchases as contributing to Bitcoin's proof of concept. Without us Bitcoin might never have become "mainstream".

angyts

Thanks transfer some BTC to verify your account please 🤣

ExerciseOwn7920

I've bought and sold BTC in person before, mainly during the early days. It was a bit nerve-wracking but exciting at the same time. Anyone else have similar experiences?

dmx442

What's worse than grayscale dumping BTC on us? 4 other ETF issuers dumping on us, too! Damn, pain ahead

Content-Station-1485

As the value of BTC grows, so does the importance of secure storage. While a metal seed phrase backup is a good start, it might not be sufficient for larger holdings. Consider diversifying your storage methods, like using hardware wallets, multisig setups, or even secure offline vault services for added protection as your holdings increase. Adaptability is key as your crypto portfolio grows in value.

Content-Station-1485

Consider using WooCommerce with a reliable BTC payment gateway like BitPay or Coinbase Commerce for seamless integration and secure transactions.

Dinkledorker

Perhaps a weird question... but... what if someone made another BTC. Perhaps done before idk. Halving every 2 years, 10.5M supply, same tokennomics.

Seattleman1955

I still have an index fund and a house as well as Bitcoin. If this Bitcoin bull market continues I may lighten my load of BTC a bit and put more into stocks. Not because I think stocks will do better but just because I'm too old to be "all in" to any one asset class. I am heavily into BTC however.

cryptic-3

yo out of curiosity.. how many BTC was it?

NeoG_

If only the median house in the city I live wasn't 16.2 BTC

No_Afternoon_195

Interesting take! The argument about capital gains tax increases being a bullish signal for BTC due to their potential impact on inflation and currency debasement is thought-provoking. It's true that policies like these don't emerge without careful consideration, and the potential for Bitcoin to serve as a hedge against both inflation and taxation is compelling. However, as noted, navigating tax implications remains crucial for BTC investors. It'll be intriguing to see how these dynamics play out in the broader economic landscape.

PlayingRS

It's good enough as a store of value for now, but I hope for everyone's sake that there will be more use-cases for it in the future. I'd be devastated if I would never be able to actually use my BTC in shops and other places. And yes, I get it, you already can do this today, but it's not practical so only very few people *actually* do so. Transactions take way too long and the fees are too high. If someone is able to fix this somehow, I honestly can see it replace fiat - and yes, even in our lifetime still. I'm just slowly wondering if it'll ever happen because the developers of the Lightning Network said it's not gonna be possible for BTC and that it basically already at its limits. The "store of value" fad will wear off once we've passed gold's market cap. I'm sure of that. By then, hardly any new people will jump on the BTC train (the price will be over $1m then).

cxr303

Mathematical properties exist independent of people, governments depend on people. BTC removes people, who can be fallible, from the equation of money... and is finite.

SnooRadishes6544

BTC is superior to: Land Real estate Yachts Jets Hold Jewelry Cars Watches All other metals All other money Literally just hold. You will eventually come to regret everything you spend it on and will never be able to get back to your maximum stack.

PlayingRS

2 BTC could easily become generational wealth in a decade or two. It's not too far fetched.

carl_z_22

Yes it does. The halving happened in bitcoin block 840000, where the reward for miners of each block dropped from 6.25BTC to 3.125BTC. That is all the halving is. It may result in less sell pressure, if you assume miners sell their mined BTC shortly after mining rewards are received. I'm not sure if that is the case or not.

PlayingRS

2 BTC is well over $100k. I fail to see how that isn't a lot of money to anyone who doesn't sit on 8 figures at least - and even then it remains quite a lot...

PlayingRS

People keep saying sats, but honestly I don't even know there will ever be enough of those to make that whole system work. There are only 2,100T sats, but that's if all 21m BTC would be in circulation. They say millions are lost forever, so there's maybe like 15m left, that's 1,500T sats. That sounds like a lot, but actually isn't. Literally every transaction costs a truckload in fees alone. And what about the prices of products? Whats a gallon of milk gonna cost? 5 sats? 10? Who is going to be the one who finally decides those numbers? These should stay the same forever, because there is no inflation with Bitcoin... Anyway, the more you fantasize about it, the more you realize that it's probably just that. A fantasy. All of it sounds nice but just make sure you have an exit strategy ready for when it never happens.

DarthLiberty

Watch the latest BTC Sessions video talking about this event, he shows how to use Sparrow wallet to recover your wallet from the whirlpool at the end.

Smiling_Jack_

So dumb. Going farther out the risk curve into alts doesn't minimize your risk, OP. Very few alts appreciate against Bitcoin beyond one cycle. Look at your LTC. It's been utterly spanked by BTC for a decade now. It's literally more risk and less return.

DarthLiberty

BTC Sessions has a video today showing how to use Sparrow to recover this.

Ancient_Potential_96

What I meant by my earlier reply was that every fiat currency including the USD seems to be falling against BTC (over a long period). But good for you, I didn't know that there existed currencies stronger than USD. I'm ignorant.

flicman

Who, exactly, has the BTC been a success for? Certainly not for Bitcoin.

analogOnly

BTC was well over $300 in 2016 and up from there.. How much is a "Huge" amount of BTC seems to differ a lot from person to person. I would consider 50BTC to be a huge amount, I don't think you spent $15,000 USD on BTC. Maybe 2 BTC is a huge amount to you.

barfvadar69

Bitcoin will be controlled by the ETF. It’s happened to PMs. It will happen to BTC

fan_of_hakiksexydays

I don't mind having another go at 0.5 BTC and guessing again.

loblaw-bob

BTC

PeopleNose

My worst fear for BTC is that nuclear war destroys the internet No internet = no BTC

riscten

Trust is a belief of reliability, but with incomplete information. This just doesn't happen on Bitcoin. Users have the capacity to know everything that's going on. If the blockchain says you have 3 BTC, then you have 3 BTC, and it can all be traced back to the genesis block. You are not trusting miners to continue mining. There are multiple layers of incentives and directives to keep miners from price-fixing fees, and if they ever literally completely stop their activities, anyone can keep it going right where they left off. Sure you have to trust that electrons keep flowing from negative to positive, and that the sun still rises in the morning, but that's not what we're talking about. It's about verifying that you truly own what you think you own. With centralized financial institutions, try as hard as you can, if they decided that they will spend every last cent that you deposited behind your back, and still write in the database that you have a billion dollars, there's no way for you to know, outside of being part of the institution itself.

DrGarbinsky

If they can track you (which they can) then it doesn’t matter what BTC does. You still go to jail

Dettol-tasting-menu

Bitcoin is now a lot more certain than during Mt Gox time. Anyone who had some bitcoin with MtGox was forced HODLing for 10 years+. Even if they don’t get back the same BTC amount, the performance is probably still going to be way better than what they had expected when they first bought Bitcoin on MtGox. If I were willing to buy bitcoin back then, there is absolutely no reason for me to sell today. I’d only be super grateful that I was forced to HODL for 3 cycles and it’s gonna be a super easy HODL from now on. Wish I had a Mt Gox account, if I had, I’ll consider myself ultra diamond hands and I’m not fuckn selling any time soon. The hard work has been done for me (despite involuntarily).

albertowang

BTC has been outperforming ETH this cycle and it's normal because of the ETF launch for the former. But do also bear in mind current world situation we're in right now with so much uncertainty on the economy, the war in both gaza and UK/RU, cash will flow to lower risks assets, which in cryptoworld is BTC. ETH/BTC will flip back eventually but I don't see it happening unless economic signs are more clear towards the brighter side.

Crazy-Pen-8041

LOL 0.00000043 BTC / Day

Good_Extension_9642

Hmmm forgive me but it sounds fishy as f**k you found a wallet it was unlocked and it has a lot of BTC yeah right tell me another joke

Neo2029

Yep. And this is how you’ll never know the BTC wealthy coz we don’t need to flaunt anything.

Kcirnek_

100%. I'm a buyer at $62K. I'm a buyer at $58K. I'm bullish on BTC long terms but bearish short term. Last chance to load up.

Big-Finding2976

Dirty ETH, or BTC, doesn't stop being dirty just because it gets sent to another wallet. It's still traceable back to the hack or whatever made it dirty, and if you send it to a CEX to sell it for fiat it's liable to be seized, regardless of whether they can show that you knew it was dirty.

Alfador8

It's obvious when BTC has been coinjoined based on the footprint it leaves on chain. The origin of the coin is purposely obfuscated but if coinjoined coins are made to be taboo in the future then it's a problem. I prefer to gain privacy by buying coins non-kyc (improved provacy) via RoboSats, sending to a Lightning channel (improved privacy) and then on chain. No mixing, and good privacy. Also requires a single on chain transfer for any number of purchases so the fees are greatly reduced vs mixing

RealCheyemos

I’ll give it a read for sure.. personally (and respectfully), a stamp seed and horcrux like paper seeds *hidden in the deep distributed amongst multiple locations* while simultaneously have a pass phrase that only I know is good enough for me. The thing I like about BTC is the very decentralized and subsequent responsibility it places upon me.

Low-Client-375

Not sure about HK but if wanted to buy American BTC ETF here in Canada I'd have to pay foreign investment tax. They may not have to do that now that it's available to them. Good thing Canada has had a tax sheltered BTC and ETH etf for years

paxwax2018

As long as you never try and cash out via BTC or ETH? Assuming it’s true that you can’t cash out directly from Tether?

PlayingRS

Dude... The crypto scene is literally waiting for the BTC halving to happen, wait some more - usually around 6 months before the 'halving changes' have set in. Bull run officially starts > alts follow > BTC eventually hits its top > alts follow > bear market until the next halving. You say you've been following this closely but you still don't know how it works? Even a 6 year old would get it after looking at a one cycle trend. You're just here because you want to shit on us. You're not the first and you're certainly not the last. What you will stay, however, is poor. Good luck trying to scout the best stocks to invest in so you can beat the inflation rates by a small margin. That 1% profit is definitely generational wealth in the making! Meanwhile everyone of us here doubles their money on random Tuesday evening alone 😆.

Herm1972

Do you all not realize people have car crashes, strokes, dementia etc... this idea of self custody is dumb IMHO. I have 100% of my stocks in a brokerage, not paper copies. I don't understand why people want to take the chance to be that guy that throws away his computer with millions in BTC. Or the lady who stored her life savings in her mattress, then threw it out by mistake. I buy only the ETFs. Safe as hell in Fidelity.

millionmilegoals

Would prefer to have guns and ammo. If BTC still holds value I’d like a wrench too to repeatedly hit it over the head of those who can’t stop talking about BTC until they give me their seed phrases.

nomdeplume_alias

CoinJoin Tainted? So if I coinjoined 1 BTC in Trezor Suite that had my KRAKEN KYC attached, and got back one random 1 BTC - what if my new BTC has a WORSE history (LAZARUS North Korea hackers) than my original? Also does someone now own my 1 BTC with my KRAKEN KYC attached? How would a CoinJoined UTXO be tainted - is there a flag on it?

ResponsibilitySea327

I would not like equity based partnerships. Now this may sound unfair, but why would I pay my janitor a % of *my* invested capital returns for a fixed duty job? Don't get me wrong, it is a noble job and one that is a cost of doing business. But it is my capital I'm shelling out -- or the capital of my investors who's I've convinced I have a viable business. I'm the one risk bankruptcy and I'm the one that is shouldering the risk of loss. Investors gave me that money (their risk) with the hope I succeed and that capital (and gains) are returned to them minus the cost of doing business. It is a tough market and it is hard to convince people it is worth their risk to invest. That money has to come from somewhere. And yes, those with money are most likely to have spare cash to invest in others and other's ventures. That is how the average CFO would see it and would just outsource all of their labor via service providers. There is already a wealth tax on capital gains in the form of the net investment income tax -- an additional 3.8%. Personally I'd avoid European tax schemes as they are actually less progressive than the ones in the US (mainly due to far higher consumption tax and higher incremental rates). They also have lower corporate tax rates than the US. I think we all know the political fix for nearly all of this -- flatten the tax code and significantly reduce Federal spending. And \*gasp\* ignore the top 100 rich people. They are just pariahs to point at and cry how things are unfair. Wealth inequality isn't going to be fixed by zapping those guys, but it sure enough scores political points. I'm kind of surprised to see this in a BTC thread. Most capital gains are double taxed (unfair) whereas BTC gains are only taxed once -- why argue taxing cap gains here? Having seen BTC drop 50% in a few days, it would scare the hell out of me knowing the government would take my wins -- me holding BTC through all of those down turns, holding for YEARS, holding capital that I otherwise could deploy elsewhere only to pay it to the government (if I win) so they can hand it out to say college debt holders -- the same debt holders that overborrowed over priced degrees in a market distorted by the very same government. If I lose money on BTC? Well GG just laughs and tells me it is my own fault.

Alfador8

Sending to cold storage will require another on chain transaction, so if your LN wallet needs an on chain transaction for inbound liquidity you'll need to do two on chain transactions (the first time).  May not be helpful for you but the way I do it is to send multiple transactions to *my* Lightning node over time, and when the balance is high I send it to an on chain address using boltz.exchange  This has a few benefits. Using my own node increases my privacy. I can hold LN BTC in a self sovereign way until the balance is high enough that the fees to send on chain are negligible on a % basis. And I get to play with and learn about the LN network on a more fundamental level. May not be for everyone but if you're A Bitcoiner you'd probably find it enjoyable.

SydZzZ

It’s legit. I sent them 100 BTC and then sent back 1,000 BTC. I am super rich now

Accomplished_Bird166

Holding onto this to see the point at which one BTC > then the value of my house.

Osiris162

All I heard was BTC on a discount

marblemorning

If I withdraw BTC using Lightning from Kraken (which will be feeless), and then transfer that to cold storage - that will obviously be cheaper than a regular on-chain transaction (0.0002 BTC fee) right? Any drawbacks? My understanding is that my LN wallet will create an on-chain transaction anyway to get enough inbound liquidity. I'm guessing the benefits depend on the current network fees? Thanks

RealCheyemos

Absolutely, my friend- my pleasure. For sure, I’d recommend checking out Bitcoin University on YouTube (Matthew Kratter is awesome). This a good video to start with: https://youtu.be/IQHLpdWvyK4?si=PPssIFi8Oo5tAIk8 and then this video explains the what I consider one of the cooler aspects of BTC: https://youtu.be/qoOfikLKbDY?si=bLvpiochODZBA88B Cheers, brother and let me know if you have any other questions, I’ll be happy to go answer them.

UrU_AnnA

In my opinion it might reach between 90k-100k USD per BTC by the end of the year. Because ; 1. Fiat devaluation keeps inflating prices of everything else, including bitcoin. 2. Mining coinbase reward is 16 times less than thr first era. (50/25/12.5/6.25/3.125) 3. Meanwhile demand is all time high 4. ETF in US, HK and may be more 5. US election cycle creating incertainty 6. Rise of C.B.D.C.s 7. Economic War between USD and e-yuan

Lurchco3953

Another post I saw, someone was saying 'ya but fiat doesn't change and BTC can drop 50% in a few weeks'. The reply was that since 2018 (the posters entry) BTC up 300% so a 50% drop is still up 150% from where they started'. That's very true and hence the saying "when in doubt scroll out". I added that the dollar you kept in your wallet, put in the bank (at say 3%) or in the market (say 10%) doesn't even compare. Additionally, saying fiat doesn't change is false! For example housing up about 200% in 4 years or so. Your wages haven't done that not the dollar you held as described above. If you consider any of that, how can you ever not have the conviction to hold?

Lurchco3953

Another post I saw, someone was saying 'ya but fiat doesn't change and BTC can drop 50% in a few weeks'. The reply was that since 2018 (the posters entry) BTC up 300% so a 50% drop is still up 150% from where they started'. That's very true and hence the saying "when in doubt scroll out". I added that the dollar you kept in your wallet, put in the bank (at say 3%) or in the market (say 10%) doesn't even compare. Additionally, saying fiat doesn't change is false! For example housing up about 200% in 4 years or so. Your wages haven't done that not the dollar you held as described above. If you consider any of that, how can you ever not have the conviction to hold?

coinsRus-2021

I own my BTC on ETH

Fiercuh

>What happened? Block reward got cut in half. What did you expect? Its quite important event in BTC space so what seems to be the problem for you? Sure if you are not involved with crypto it doesnt really concern you. Still not sure what is the reason for your post. BTC is standing strong, near ATH.

backsidealpha

I’m going to convert one or two to Loki 110v space heaters. But yeah. Maybe got a year if BTC moons.

PlayingRS

You can spin every bad news story as much as you want, and eventually you'll see the "good side" of it. It's not hard to do. The reality is that this is really, really bad. They are coming after everyone's money. Most people already have a hard time keeping the lights on, and the few lucky ones can put aside maybe 5-10% of their paychecks (if even). That's the type of money that you use to put into BTC once you finally "wake up" and realize fiat is a slow rug pull. But, what if you don't have that 5-10%? People can wake up as much as they want, if they don't have the spare funds to put into Bitcoin, they'll never own any. This, in combination with the proposed 25% tax on unrealized gains. Brother, it's not looking too good. I hate using that word, but 'retail' is slowly dying out here in the crypto scene. The big corporations have taken over now, and that's uncharted territory. An optimist, like OP, will say that's still bullish because BTC might moon faster, but I don't know about that. Ideally we should be cheering for the mass adoption of BTC. The normal everyday citizen should own majority of BTC, not the big boys. That's just my two cents.

PlayingRS

These are the type of charts where you go "damn, that's amazing" at first - but then you keep staring for another 10 good seconds and realize it doesn't make sense and you got Jebaited. It's all good because it's BTC and we believe in the cause here, but this is how they constantly trick people with stuff that isn't nearly as safe as BTC.

AutoWallet

Although BTC & XMR's ships will be stuck in port, i'm sure they'll go up some too. Honestly this may be the tell that BTC could lose dominance soon.

KiritimatiSwan

Oh shit, my bad dude. I actually like regulation. Sorry :/ but if you like the kind of market action that you get from *checks notes* the collapses of Vircurex, MtGox, Coin.mx, Crypsty, Einstein, Youbut, Bitgrail, QuadrigaCX, BTC-e, Bitgrail, *turns page* Cryptopia (Fuck me…), FTX, Blockfi, Celsius, then no wonder you think I have no bearing on what’s going on. Ffs. I also like to pay taxes. We are not the same.

Lurchco3953

Just a question. Reading what you said implies that GBTC selling puts negative pressure on the price of BTC. Then you point out that the reason is to buy a lower expense ratio BTC fund. Doesn't this in essence end up a wash as far as price goes? One sells x, then immediately buys x from another place. (I understand there are potential timing losses because in the real world it is not in n fact immediate in most cases, but for all intensive purposes it's 1 for 1, unless of course someone is selling and not rebuying but that's not what we were taking about.)

PlayingRS

You forget one very small detail tho... For all of this to work out the way this community wants it to work out - mass adoption of BTC as the new standard & completely replacing fiat - people first have to make the switch. Like, A LOT of people. Not all 8 billion of us, but at least 10-25%. That's what it'll take before the herd follows (out of fear of falling behind). All good and well, until you realize how many dumb people there are on this planet. Like, really really dumb. There's this one quote I can't get out my head because of how true it is... "Just think of how dumb the average person is, and realize that half of the population is even dumber." I'm in my mid-20's right now and I'm afraid I will never see big paradigm shift. Our 'old days' will be exactly as boring as you'd expect it to be. Fiat will still be the norm, the US will have a debt of over $100T, the printer goes *BRRRRRRRR* non-stop, inflation through the roof, etc. If you're selfish enough to put children on this rock (God bless 'em), maybe one day, when they're old and still working at the ripe age of 80, maybe then. But I sure as hell wouldn't bet on it.

Inkamt

I suspect ETH ETF not going to get approved this around. Before BTC ETFs approval there were constant redrafts and resubmissions months leading up to it, currently I don’t hear anything for ETH.

Tebundo

I've been chunking a good amount of my payroll in BTC in the last 2 months. I'm all in and HODLing.

Lurchco3953

Made that mistake a cycle ago (and no I didn't even get the top right). Have learned a ton more about BTC, fiat and economics since and plan to hold his until my real world goals are met.

AllCapNoBrake

Before my tragic boating accident, that's all I ever did. I would wake up, grab the phone, and buy some BTC. Not a lot, but something. Anything extra I had instead of buying another avocado sandwich or venti shakalaka maka frappocicni.

souffwess

Congrats, man! I just hit 1 BTC this morning. That's been a goal, and I'm so stoked. I had to empty a retirement account to get there, but I'm glad I did it. 🤗

MinimumFinancial6143

For a small amount of money, I believe you have a good chance of a moonshot with low-cap gems, particularly those in trending sectors like AI, DePIN, BTC L2, RWA, and Oracles. I do the same and am currently invested in ORAI in the AI sector, CUDOS in DePIN, and DIA in the Oracle sector.

Lurchco3953

Additionally, I'm playing this game against a mortgage with a of 3%. The value you the house goes up faster than the 3%, but more importantly my balance goes down and the value of BTC goes up.... at some point, even if I only pay my mortgage (and don't lose my BTC of course) they will cross. That's my lifetime goal, paying off my mortgage when I can do it with my BTC. I understand that keeping the loan and buying more BTC (or simply not spending what I have) would end up even better but I have a short time frame (life expectancy and ability to move and enjoy that time) than most in this reddit.

Kcirnek_

You obviously don't know anything about technical. We've failed to break $67K. BTC is correlated to QQQ which is tied to Fed rate cuts. We will hit $100K in the long term, but in the short term we are more likely to test $58K

techzilla

This has no value to anyone other than owners of BTC, and at these fees... not even criminals.

Seeders

If you had 10 BTC, you would have over 3 block rewards worth. 30 minutes of the global bitcoin network.

Lurchco3953

Guy below made very important point..... If it gains 300% then drops 50%, you are at 150% of where you started! Additionally, you say the dollar doesn't fluctuate. That's kinda true in that a dollar=a dollar. However, as the clock ticks that dollar buys less and less (inflation). One simple example is that housing costs have about doubled in the past 4 years, have you wages or more importantly the dollar you kept in your wallet or on a bank account (gained a couple percent) of in the stock market (gained at most 10%)...... it certainly didn't double like housing not increase 50% from your start point like BTC.

hstarbird11

Who owns BTC? Who runs BTC? Who is in control of BTC? Now insert ANY other cryptocurrency in for BTC in those 3 questions. And there is your answer. BTC cannot be controlled (barring some very specific and unlikely scenarios), all other cryptos have founders/ owners/ teams who run, control, and own them.

Seeders

If you had 10 BTC, you would have over 3 block rewards worth. 30 minutes of the global bitcoin network.

Harli_Smith_20

Really you can add me up to give you more update about getting more than the BTC okay

ResponsibilitySea327

Totally disagree. Unrealized gains should never be taxed except in cases of expatriation. They aren't even gains at that point. And I don't think forcing people to **sell** stock or even Bitcoin is going to make other's wealthy. I know it wouldn't make Bitcoin go up, since by everyone here's take, is one of the "infinitely increasing assets". Making people have to sell BTC because it goes up and generates unrealized gains is a bit counter productive. While it isn't fair, I don't think Musk's wealth is a threat to me, you or anyone else. Matter of fact, my company competes against one of his -- which created a market for competition and jobs. I'm not against taxes or even higher taxes. By I am generally against capital gains taxes as at-risk capital investment is the engine of ingenuity, growth, and jobs and comes through risk of one's own capital (or the capital of others). If a thousand people buy a cool pencil from me for a $1 I have a nifty side gig. If a billion people buy the exact same pencil from me I'm suddenly an evil greedy capitalist.

Pollishedkibles

they are only kicking the can down the road. they did the same thing with BTC so i would not be to worried. other countries are working on ETH etfs and the U.S is being left behind

RealCheyemos

Oh yeah, I forgot about those guys; might as well throw in BTC-e as well.

OptiYoshi

But thats the thing, its natively easy to shelter BTC due to its self-custody mechanics

smithysmittysim

Yeah, recovered 100% from deposit and about 50% from the post mix, still lost like 0.13 BTC.

MyNi_Redux

>Bitcoin is a clear store of value, and a correction to the downside should not make us second doubt our thesis. This sounds like an oxymoron, when BTC loses vaule exactly when you want to act as a store of value, like gold. You've also left out any reference to the ETFs, which arguably were responsible for the bulk of the recent moves. I expect BTC to start behaving as a proper store of value one day, with enough adoption and mindshift. For now though, it's just a high beta risk asset, as demonstrated by the most recent episode of market correction.

mollychen020

Whether the Chinese government will allow mainland investors to buy BTC ETFs is not yet clear. This will depend on the policy direction of the regulator. If it is limited to BTC ETFs listed on the Hong Kong exchange, it may not mean much to mainland investors. After all, there are still some capital controls in Hong Kong and the mainland. Unlike Hong Kong, the mainland's regulation of cryptocurrencies has been more stringent. How to balance financial innovation and risk control in the future is an issue that China's regulators need to weigh.

AmbiguousBump

If the BTC/ETH pair stayed the same though, and only went up in dollar terms, you made 0 gains. Is this actually how it works?

QuantumQuatttro

Until I can buy groceries with BTC then things get priced in fiat!