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The whole world is misinformed about Mining and PoW (Pt.2)
L3++ worth buying used (beginner question)?
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I think by that time the standard unit to measure value will become KWH or Joules. And for bitcoin the mining electricity cost
\>please ignore that 25% of BTC was mined before the end of 2011 I was on 4chan when Bitcoin was first being mined. This was before 2011. Back then, almost everyone on the boards was mining BTC. I even was there for the first Doge thread. I chose not to mine because i didn't want to support darknet activity (back then that was its main use case) People were literally mining entire Bitcoins per day back then. With NO idea what it would be worth. It's no surprise that 25% was mined (in a DECENTRALIZED MANNER) before 2011. It was a pretty big thing. Not on reddit tho. ETH is a blatant scam. I don't want to exert the energy required to explain in great detail every aspect of the scam. PoS is bad. PoS is hyperinflationary and serves the rich by a large margin more than it serves the commonwealth. It's not a deflationary ''currency'' (it's a ''security'', stakes are literally the same things as shares, you can outright buy ''governance'' from a PoS chain which if you have 51% of the shares you OWN THE BLOCKCHAIN, sounds familiar?) Bitcoin is a currency. Ethereum are shares in a company. Not even touching upon the comparisons in security because it is laughable. As you point out there's not many ETH nodes (easy to 'hack') whereas there are literally billions of miners. (they're not all mining the same token btw, Satoshi made Bitcoin an open source application so if Bitcoin became ''centralised'' people could ''fork'' it thus maintaining the decentralized model: everyone can ''clone'' Bitcoin, and everyone can ''mine'' those clones. The network support is what makes it valuable. ETH has no network support apart from the few who managed to ''buy'' a validator node. You shouldn't be able to buy validator nodes, unless ''everyone'' can buy them (which they can't, because it costs a fuckton of ''eth'')) ETH has no limit. It's an inflationary currency. With all this PoS popping up all over the place (a literal corruption of blockchain PoW technology) we are more than certainly heading towards hyper inflation. Also it doesn't help that a senile old man managed to print 20 BILLION DOLLARS last year on behalf of 333,802,450 American civilians. (how is this even rational? It's going to destroy the global economy how are 333,802,450 people giving this one man so much authority just take a step back to think about this RATIONALY please. We shouldn't tolerate or accept this. It is tyranny. And 333,802,450 people should not be helpless (and ARE not helpless, far from it) against a single senile old man. America you need to take your economy back because the entire world is about to get fucked up because of YOUR president. Anyway i don't even know what to say about ETH. It's literally the opposite of Satoshis' invention. We could talk all day about the minutae but at the end of the day nothing is more concise than explaining it this way: PoS is not a real cryptocurrency. They've ''rebranded'' the term ''blockchain'' to mean anything they want it to these days. It's like Mark Zuckerbergs ''metaverse'' versus the everyday standard ''internet of things''. It's a rebranding, a corporate scam. If you're a big fan of Microsofts business practices you'll love Ethereum. If i recall correctly, Vitalik has explained it himself that Ethereum essentially profits from other coins (the ''layer 2s'' hosted on the ETH ''blockchain'') I think i remember he said it's not intended for consumers, but for corporations. Every coin that is hosted on the ETH ''blockchain'' pays ''taxes'' towards ETH in the form of GAS fees. This is why you have to pay GAS when you buy a coin that is hosted on ETH. I believe Vitalik aims to create an ecosystem in which most if not all other cryptocurrencies in the future become absorbed into the ETH network. I.E: a monopoly position above the rest. I.E: Centralisation is the goal here. Top down. Vitalik is rich, and profits from everyone else. He also literally has said ''Proof of Work should be illegal'' Which is absolutely a disgusting statement. There's a reason it is called Proof of Work. It provides security. If we lived in a world where we could just trust corporations and ''businesses'' to not exploit their consumers (capitalism is an exploit based economy, my profit = your loss, ergo the more you lose, the more i gain), then we could just trust Vitalik to provide a financial system that does not require work, or ''energy consumption''. Heck, nobody has explained to me how ''shares'' inherently provide security. You can explain in fine detail how Proof of Work encrypts the ledger through billions of computers working on encryption. How do you explain that a ''share'' (stake) provides me anything close to that level of security? A node is just one persons PC that he has a ledger on (a balance sheet). There's your ''stakes''. Tell me are you going to trust all your digital internet money to 1 or 2 guys computers who happen to have bought a node outright? PoS blockchains are comparable to the ToR network. ToR network runs on the same types of nodes. Well guess what, people are already being de-anonymized on the ToR network because ''malicious actors'' know how to manipulate nodes. Blockchain technology and ToR network have a shared history and technology basis. The onion network is essentially the same thing as a PoS blockchain. At least, that's what i've understood so far. ETH and all other PoS networks have such glaring security and economical issues it's actually mind boggling how they even exist. The difference is night and day towards Satoshis' vision. Satoshi wanted an Open Source, uncomprimisable financial network, that is literally unhackable, and even in the case it ever became comprimised, could be cloned and altered, a network that everyone can access and create, contribute to its security (and be rewarded for it), with the financial currency itself being deflationary and DECENTRALIZED, thus DECREASING THE WEALTH GAP that would solve all the problems and headaches that the central banking institution has given us. (and so much more) It seems Vitalik apparently wants a financial network that can be comprimised in more than 3 paths, whilst having as many other coins within its own ''ecosystem'' (centralisation), with the coin itself being completely inflationary (supply of ETH is infinite) that benefits the rich more than the non-rich (increases the wealth gap through the ''Staking'' ''benefits'') (i.e if Jeff Bezos just stakes 4 billion $ worth of ETH (and he can, because the supply is unlimited) at even a 1% APY then Jeff Bezos will outclass a person who stakes 100,000$ worth of ATOM at 20% APY for literal lifetime durations) (it's bad) (decentralization means everyone is wealthy, centralization means everyone is poor in comparison) and idk, probably wants to do the same thing the central banks have been doing for years. It's not even a ''blockchain''. It's literally shares in a currency. You can buy governance. If you own 51% of the shares you literally own all the currency. Shareholders know how to screw over entire companies by buying majority shares LITERALLY ALL THE TIME. If you don't see what i'm getting at here then i don't know what to say. Jeff Bezos buys 51% of ETH and now he owns everyone elses money that they put in ETH. To 51% attack Bitcoin you literally need to buy 51% of its PHYSICAL HARDWARE. Now i'm not going to say PoW doesn't have some ''concerning factors''. 1) The elephant in the room: Energy consumption A) You are trading in energy for security, pretty good tradeoff these days B) We already use a fuckton of energy for the entire banking system \-Physical buildings \-ATM machines \-Computing / Networking / Processing power (transactions cost energy for the bank too especially digital ones) \-Cash printers \-Central heating inside the buildings that the bank uses for the staff (i think if you add it all up you'll find our current banking network uses practically just as much energy as mining, if not more) C) Miners are usually energy conscious \-It's not uncommon for entry level miners to compensate for their energy consumption by switching off unecessary devices, and using their mining rig to literally serve as the central heating element in their households. (central heating costs 1000KWH per household average) (Mining rig can produce for 1000KWH both warmth and a substantial profit)
Some companies will charge you more for each KWH if you go above a certain amount.
So the real point about how it incentives renewable sources of energy for mining comes down to profitability. So think about it like this, there are abundant natural sources of energy that we don’t take advantage of because it unprofitable to do so (I.e. sunlight in the dessert or how the majority of wind power is produced at night while the consumers are mostly sleeping). This energy is unprofitable for the producers because there is no one to sell the energy to. In the case of solar energy in a dessert you have the problem of transporting the energy. Sure there’s an abundant amount of solar energy but you can’t transport it to where it can be used by an end consumer so no one produces it. With Bitcoin, if your energy costs about 10 cents per KWH then you’re breaking even. This profit motive theoretically makes it possible for energy producers to profit from setting up solar panels in the dessert (or insert any other relevant abundant but unprofitable energy source). The more competition there is in Bitcoin mining the cheaper your energy needs to be to compete. So right now people may not absolutely NEED to move to these places to mine successfully but as the market becomes more saturated these cheap energy sources are going to be the best and in some cases the only way to profitably mine Bitcoin.
Yes this is very true, what I worry about is the general acceptance of the regulations because the little guy will be fine with them since they think crypto is a scam or bad for the environment or some other crap that's put out there. Regulations only work when the majority accept them, this is pretty much why the media attempts to mass brainwash us before regulations come out and why there is such a split in the people. If they keep us split on everything we fight each other instead of the bigger issues. Government regulations make no sense and there stupid most of the time. Take my local governments stance of heating our houses (it's really cold here during winter and a big deal). They have banned burning fire wood during cold days due to PM2.5 emmisions causing low air quality, so everyone has to burn oil or coal to heat there houses since there not banned. Thing is oil and coal put out more PM2.5 then properly cured fire wood. So there this huge split with the people here for the ones that believe in the new regulation and the ones that don't. Not to mention they have people turning each other in for burning wood on cold days. Meanwhile the government is pushing for people to swap out to electric and natural gas heat providing grants for the part of the cost of swapping the heating system in your homes. I'm sure someone is pocketing the money from those, probably a large business in my local community that's the only distributor of these systems lol. I'm sitting here partially heating my home with crypto mining being told how bad it is for the environment by people I know are heating there homes with coal fired boilers 😂 atleast the electric is generated in part by a geothermal powerplant and since the government has said they will only expand our power system towards green energy here I see no reason not no mine. I don't know how our government expects people to heat with electric it's .25 per KWH and costs almost double what oil costs to heat our homes and four times coal heating. Not to mention fire wood would be free but thats really not legal anymore. I've gone on a rant on accident, basically we have stupid issues that can't be resolved because everyone is decided on things we should not be. I can understand being decided on things that are actually hard to interpret and understand but simple things like this and crypto I just don't get.
But you could register as a small business and write off the cost of your rigs as a tax expense, and also get a commerical rate on the KWH you use for mining - if you want
What? Are you not going to mention that you live in a Golden State for mining? Bro not everybody's paying 6 pennies per kWh. Some of us are over here paying 12, 13, 14, hell, even $0.15 per KWH! So how about YOU stfu and stop talking about shit you don't know anything about.
The problem is where we get electricity from though. And yeah its basically an infinite resource until rivers stop flowing, the sun dies, wind stops blowing, and the ocean ceases to have waves. There was a study recently on why solar energy hasn't seen mass adaptation. The problem is it generates too much energy and puts power companies out of business. Often the power company ends up owing customers money for using their excess energy. Power companies are closely tied to the state in the US. For instance in FL where I live I tried to call my power company to see if mining was realistic or if lower costs would eat my profit. They told me the state sets the KWH rates and I needed to contact them. State was unresponsive "due to covid". FL also has a law that if I do install solar panels my excess production must go to the power company and its illegal for me to install a battery to hold on to my excess production. So basically outdated businesses have a government monopoly on energy and that's why electricity is still an environmental issue.
MTRG market cap $22m Meter is the high-performance infrastructure that scales and connects the financial Internet in a multi-chain future! Meter allows the smart contracts to scale and travel seamlessly through heterogeneous blockchain networks through its 3 core offerings; 1. Crosschain-Interoperability: Meter Passport (passport.meter.io) is the official bridge for Ampleforth, Moonbeam, Theta and many more. 2. Scalability: An Ethereum compatible Layer-1/2 chain based on state-of-the-art HotStuff PoS consensus (similar to Facebook Libra) 3. Uncensorable money: A built-in Metastable gas token MTR mined by consumption of 10 KWH electricity using SHA256-PoW. Electricity is proven to be more stable adjusted for inflation than any fiat currency
Its 1300 watts at 7 cents/KWH. $2.19 a day in electricity isnt gonna kill me.
Current network hashrate is 150m TH/s Antminer S9 does 13 TH/s while consuming 1300 watts. So current network power consumption is 150m / 13 \* 1300 = 15,000,000 kW In Oct 21 roughly 11300 transactions were added to the block chain per hour. This means for one on-chain transaction 1327 KWh are consumed Assuming a price of $0.12 per KWH, it would cost $160. I know, there are more efficient miners and costs for electricity differ. In some cases, otherwise wasted energy is used. But this view on $/tx is imho absolute FUD when we are talking about a PoW system that basically converts energy to value. Also, this calculation neglects 2nd and 3rd layer solutions. No one would buy a latte with an on-chain transaction.
that's not Possible unless he is using R9-390s in windows OS with power limits turned up. $300 of ETH, at 0.20kw Eff rating (bout as low as it goes) means his power cost is $0.70 cents a KWH with Really inefficient Miners. at that Point its cheaper to Fuel a generator and Pay for fuel that way....... Source: Am miner, Pay .54c per KWH (I pay extra in Cali for 100% renewable) and its STILL profitable for me. my Rigs are have a EFF rating of 0.4kw - 0.5kw
https://www.electricchoice.com/electricity-prices-by-state/ For electricity that you can *actually use* (IE electricity that is delivered to where your mining equipment is plugged in) Texas averages 11.36 per KWH delivered, not 8.58 cents. Typical clueless blog trying to be an news source but lacks enough sense to actually, oh I dunno, compare the numbers to their own electric bill to see if they are being reporting accurately problem. They are probably using the generation rate, and not the combined wholesale plus distribution rate. BNy reference, my actual PA electric bills, taking the bottom line dividing by total KWH, runs around 11.25 - 11.50, which surprise surprise matches the numbers being reported. 11.36 is still cheap, but it's only nominally cheaper (~10%) than the national average which is 12.55. Really cheap electric looks to be: * Louisiana (9.37) * Washington (9.79) * Arkansas (9.99) * Kentucky (10.56) * Idaho (10.58) * Utah (10.63) * Oklahoma (10.72) * Tennessee (10.79) * Oregon (11.02)
21 eurocents is like $0.24 Over in America I'm paying about $0.189 per KWH
He is talking about KWH, which is a very accurate measure of value, since all living things need energy, no matter it is in electronic/mechanic/biology form
In that scenario they would have been better off just buying the dam BTC. He's missing lots of Information. Mining right now on GPUs and ASICS is profitable if your electricity costs are less than around 0.15 cents per KWH. If you are able to buy cards at MSRP, than ROI is around 6 to 10 months. If the card runs for 3 years the rest is profit above and beyond the costs assuming significantly more hashing power or eth2.0 don't change the dynamics to much. This is assuming you bought the cards/mining rig for the intention of only mining. I do it on a laptop I own for personal use, it averages 20hours a day mining and I needed a laptop anyways so my investment cost is 0. The last part is if you register a buissness you can offset any costs on the mining rig or electricity or the location you use it on your taxes.
Hedera Hashgraph -> Hbar, has the most potential in the DLT space, seeing the most enterprise adoption, theoretically limitless transactions per second, ABFT security (best security you can achieve for a distributed consensus algorithm which has been mathematically proven), easy to develop on and use, uses 0.00017 KWH per transaction (one of or the most environmentally friendly algorithms as it does not use traditional mining algorithms like 'blockchain'), most decentralized governance and fair if you believe that experts from top enterprises/ universities/organisations (that only have 3-6 year terms then have to change) in there own sector are most capable of making the right desicions for the network, rather than people that own more coins == more power like ADA cardano etc
Malaysia. average electricity rate is around $0.085/ KWH? and yes, being a tropical country, we do turn on A/C almost 24/7, with my bill around $150 / month max
Yeah, if you put this into a rate, like the article did (1791 KWH per transaction) for traditional banking, I bet bitcoin blows it out of the water by a massive margin. Traditional banking has millions, if not billions, of points of access being powered. Bitcoin isn't even close to the adoption and use. No way to avoid energy use being an issue to address.
Texas is only the 9th lowest KWH price in the US. that's not why they're "settling on Texas." Lazy reporting by the guardian. look into obsolete oil facilities. for being the energy capital of the world (just because it's on it's own grid in the US) they had some of the worst power outages in recent history just in february. ERCOT uses 70k megawatts peak in summer months. there's a sort of politicized fallacy that their infrastructure is better or worthwhile, when miners are FAR better off in other places (especially for heat efficiency).
This is my electricity rate € 0,07640KWH This is what I can earn based on nicehash calculator 💵 Income 0.00171567 BTC 65.60 EUR. ⚡️ El. costs 0.00020236 BTC 7.74 EUR. 💰 Profit 0.00151331 BTC 57.86 EUR.
It’s € 0,07640KWH Not alot I think
About $500/month. My electricity costs are under $0.10/KWH. I mine ETH and XMR both in the same center. XMR was mostly just an experiment but it has been profitable.
Just a quick approximation without counting too carefully... I see 7 stacks, each 9 tiers tall, and maybe 12-14 across. Let's assume 13 across. 7 x 9 x 13 = 819 miner units. 819 x ~2000 watts per unit = **1.64 MW**. / 240 volt rms = 6800 amps of current. That is a LOT of current. At 200amps per main (using #4 copper), that's 34 mains (plus how many transformers? of course commercial is different, but I like expressing things in terms people are more familiar with, ie residential service) 24 hours x 30 days x 1638 kw = 1.2 Million KWH per month. 1.2M kwh * .13 per kwh (pa delivered residential rates, dirt cheap for the US), that's $152,400 per month. Ouch. Dunno the efficiency of the gas generators, but lets assume the impossible and go with 100%. 1 KWH = 3.6 MJ (mega joules) 1 us them = 105.5 MJ (mega joules) 1.2M KWH * 3.6 / 105.5 = 40k therms per month. ~$.20 per therm (pa rates are similar residential and commercial) not sure if thats commodity price or delivered price, but let's assume it's commodity, and delivered is closer to $.35 per therm. that's $14,000 / month in natural gas. Figure 25% efficiency for the generators makes it $50,000 / month? I don't feel like digging around for the eff% of natural gas generators, but maybe someone else feels like contributing? Or even math / conversion factor errors.
Looks like the tax is an extra $0.0023 per KWH which comes into force from Jan 1st 2022.
I'm mining KWH with mine. The issue is KWH has a negative value in USD.
**Hedera Hashgraph ---> HBAR** Founder / Chief Scientist: Dr. Leemon Baird CEO and Co-founder: Mance Harmon **TPS: 10K** without Sharding, **Sharding will be an infinite TPS** **Security: aBFT** **highest grade security** in all of crypto **Fees: 0.0001** less than XRP, VISA, ADA and any of the crypto out there **KWH: 0.00017** less than any other crypto out there
Hedera Hashgraph is already in this space, but they’re doing something legit. You can use crypto micropayments to support access to MH resources and compensate folks who develop content to assist with MH support. This seems like a scam coin that promises to donate to charity/do something good. I lost a bunch of money on a 2017 project to build a micro grid and facilitate electricity exchange/transfer, which is actually a legit project and good use case for crypto. (KWH coin) Don’t do it. Adding a charity to a shitcoin doesn’t make it not a shitcoin.
> Antminer running 24/7 uses 35KWH No Antminers available before October, maybe longer And the sun doesn't shine 24/7. You didn't mention batteries > We figure after a year granted BTC stays around the same price we should get our money back by end of August next year There are many Bitcoin mining calculators on the Web. None of them tell me than an Antminer pays $42000 per year. You'll never break even > free electricity Free + $42000
I have been long advocating using KWH or Joule to measure value, since everything that has certain value to human contains energy or produced using energy. This is objected way of measure value, but that will change almost everything in current financial system
Anybody knows the cost to mine 1 bitcoin today? I did some calculations with formula below; The formula is; (N\*H\*B\*S)/(D\*2\^32) N = number of days mining, H = miner hashrate, B = block reward, S = number of seconds in a day, D = bitcoin difficulty number, 2\^32 = 'trail & error' number. (730\*110000000000000\*6.25\*86400)/(19932791027262\*2\*\*32)= 0.50650219311 BTC This means that my 110 TH/s bitcoin miner can mine 0.506 bitcoin per 2 years. The bitcoin miner consumes 3.2 KWH of electricity. In 2 years it will consume 2803$ of electricity at 0.05$/KWH.
Most of the people are unconsciously use something that can be created out of thin air to measure value, that does not make the calculation meaningful KWH or Joule is a much better unit of account when it comes to measure value, since they always contain same amount of energy. And energy is the ultimate origin of every valuable thing. USD supply could change the exchange rate of energy, but should not change the value of same amount of energy And I don't think FED is able to stop money printing any more, since now the economy is much more dependent on exponentially increased money creation and government spending. A slightest tighten will hit economy hard and make the 2008 like a breeze. They have been addicted to printing and there is no way out. They might consider to create new dollar to exchange 10 old dollar if the inflation is out of control, just like many other small countries do
Well, the total energy consumption of the US works out to about 140 KWh/person/day. This obviously includes lots of things that shouldn't be counted against the dollar. But, if we assume the average person has one transaction per day, the US dollar cannot use more than 140 KWH / transaction. (This does disregard the use of the US dollar outside the US, but it counts all the overheads like the federal government.) Source: Final consumption table from https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/World_energy_supply_and_consumption divided by 330 people and 365.25 days/year
This claim that 1 Bitcoin transaction consumes 741 KWH is grossly overestimated. I checked the OP's source but it fails to disclose their underlying source without a paid account. My guess is they are using a 2018 nature climate report which has been the source of much FUD about bitcoin power consumption since it's publication. That report made many significant mistakes in assumptions and included a severe lack of understanding of bitcoin mining when making their calculations. A few of those mistakes include: * the fact that a bitcoin transaction is different from a bitcoin block which is what their calculation was based on and one block can contain thousands of transactions * assumption the exponential growth of bitcoin occurring during the bull cycle at the time would continue it's trajectory it was currently on resulting in 1 billion transactions per day which is not possible for bitcoin. * the comparison of visa swipes counts only the energy of the swipe machine, not all the networks, banks, and data centers used in conjunction with those swipe devices * ignoring the fact that Bitcoin miners would continue to improve the energy efficiency of their rigs or stop miming when energy / hardware costs exceed income Below is a great video that goes over these common misconceptions and another that specifically debunks much of the information in that 2018 report. Also a report from Nasdaq explaining that bitcoin energy consumption is a tiny fraction of the traditional banking system. FACT CHECK: Bitcoin Mining is BAD For The Climate!? [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DidAwxWaDKI](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DidAwxWaDKI) Bitcoin: Final Nail in the Coffin of Climate Change? | Lars Dittmar | TEDxRWTHAachen [https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lA3iBUqsGhY&t=0s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lA3iBUqsGhY&t=0s) How Much Energy Does Bitcoin Really Consume? [https://www.nasdaq.com/articles/how-much-energy-does-bitcoin-really-consume-2021-05-13](https://www.nasdaq.com/articles/how-much-energy-does-bitcoin-really-consume-2021-05-13)
I understand my friend. Done in Greenland 🇬🇱 But you can produce cheaper electricity and I only see this as a ploy because they adopted Bitcoin and they are a few years away from this happening. If they succeed. You will see thee adoption and costs will land on there citizens and it will not be as cheap as it sounds today. The future will tell the tale. Why not generate solar powered windmills in El Salvador? The KWH by solar will be less then the 5 cents or ten cents by geothermal…
And you can get your KWH price from your power bill.
Yes it does. lol. It's 1KWH per ton. Don't even go their with me on that one. I'm only 6 months away from getting my engineering license, and I have my electromechanical engineering certificate ....which colleges won't just let anyone get. You have to show proof if prior education and experience to qualify for the course. so I can make money selling papers with stuff drawn on it instead of busting my ass fixing commercial units all day. But technically not all use that much energy. However, rich people arents using high efficiency ductless units because they don't want units showing on their walls. Little people use ductless. Also this isn't Europe where ductless is king. Rich people like the ones I'm talking about want something that doesn't break down. That's all they care about. The money they would save wouldn't even show up compared to how much they make. Imagine how stoked someone making $10,000,000 a year is about saving an only 1000 a month and the savings doesn't show up for 2 years because the systems cost that much more over the regular ones. It's not even worth their time.
How many Visa transactions in 24 hrs world wide ? And what about the banking industry and trading floors ? Don’t forget to add that up as well .(KWH)
VISA requires 149 KWH of energy to perform 100,000 transactions on its global settlement network. The Lightning Network is over 1 million times more energy-efficient than this outdated network. If you are still using VISA I guess that you love wasting energy" - Alex Bosworth dunking on boomers.
Thank you that's very interesting to know. I'm considering using my own renewable set up. About how much power KWH do you need a month for that set up?
Completely disagree, The market should have pulled back in Jan/Feb like it always does. No one thinks Elon is a narcissist, he makes some valid points regarding crypto tech and his BTC views are spot on, even if you don't like it. BTC mining consumes more KWH per month than the whole of Argentina. That is insane. With as much money pumped into BTC, surely the devs can find a better solution at this point and fork.
The government provides cheaper electricity for household it would cost around 0.15$ per KWH so it makes sense.
You might be surprised. An RTX 3080 can earn around $13/day from NiceHash after electricity costs of 13 cents per KWH. Now, whether buying a card for $1500+ from a scalper to earn ~$4800 in a year is worth it... is another story entirely.
I'm using about 95 KWH per month and getting $100 in eth
This was posted here earlier. KWH per transaction : algorand : 0.000008 xrp : 0.0079 dogecoin : 0.12 Cardano : 0.5479 litecoin : 18.522 bitcoincash : 18.957 Ethereum : 62.56 Bitcoin : 707 I believe Bitcoin and Ethereum are actually higher than that at the moment. Bitcoin is around 900 Kwh and Eth is 70 Kwh.
KWH per transaction : algorand : 0.000008 xrp : 0.0079 dogecoin : 0.12 Cardano : 0.5479 litecoin : 18.522 bitcoincash : 18.957 Ethereum : 62.56 Bitcoin : 707
KWH per transaction : algorand : 0.000008 xrp : 0.0079 dogecoin : 0.12 Cardano : 0.5479 litecoin : 18.522 bitcoincash : 18.957 Ethereum : 62.56 Bitcoin : 707
Where I used to live, hydroelectric was 4 cents/KWH Where I moved to, i'm paying 8c for gas/coal
It's nearly as energy efficient as XRP. Bitcoin uses 7KWH per transaction, Doge uses 0.0000...something KWH. Bitcoin = Bad Doge = Good XRP = The future of finance
Best according to this link is XRP at .0079KWH DOGE is next at .12KWH BTC is 707KWH ETH is 62.56KWH So based on this, and his past tweets it does look like this is about switching to DOGE, but who knows. [independent.co.uk article on crypto costs](https://www.independent.co.uk/life-style/gadgets-and-tech/dogecoin-energy-consumption-bitcoin-environment-b1846675.html)
Yep, he's simply ego driven watching markets move as he tweets! I Hodl Bitcoin which uses 0.0000 energy while a Tesla electric vehicle uses 33 KWh per mile, so every recharge uses approx 100 to 150 KWH and each year if 30,000 miles driven = 9900 KWh per vehicle.. It takes the same coal to burn to charge electric cars! Wake up. Stop driving / buying electric cars until a cleaner energy source is proven to be in use to recharging every electric vehicle..
I Hodl Bitcoin which uses 0.0000 energy while a Tesla electric vehicle uses 33 KWh per mile, so every recharge uses approx 100 to 150 KWH and each year if 30,000 miles driven = 9900 KWh per vehicle.. It takes the same coal to burn to charge electric cars! Wake up. Stop driving / buying electric cars until a cleaner energy source is proven to be in use to recharging every electric vehicle..
Where is this from and how is this calculated? I mean it also makes no sense because 1 doge is not very much. 1 LTC is almost 800 doge. So to transfer 1 LTC worth of doge it would take 96 KWH? These numbers are almost meaningless.
So according to Twitter top green cryptocurrencies are: XRP = 0.0079 DOGECOIN = 0.12 ADA = 0.5479 Litecoin = 18.522 Bitcoin cash = 18.957 These numbers are in KWH consumed per transaction.
I do invest in crypto (much more than I mine) but I also make money on mining with my 3090. My electricity is 9 cents / KWH. Taxes are around 30%. I’m still making good change. According to Whattomine.com, a single 3090 with my electric costs is $29.87 per day (minus 30% for taxes). I need to find a better mining pool as I’m only seeing $25/day.
Head over to r/Hashgraph. Plenty of great informational post along with the typically noob questions. Mods are legitimately censoring Hedera Hashgraph in r/cryptocurrency which is leading to alot of frustration in the Hedera community. Especially for a project that has great potential. Not a pump and dump circus. I will start with the largest misinformed concepts. You have to understand that the current crypto market is $2.3Trill...and the enterprise/CBDC market is $33Trill. Basically the first legitimate high security enterprise Leger blockchain that is adopted....will fucking blow up 33 times Bitcoins $1.1T value and supply proportionally. HBAR Centralized - for now to insure security. Will be desentralized in the future. I hope to host a node one day. Hedera website has the server requirement up on their website already. aBFT - the only Asynchronous Byzantine Fault Tolerant tech out there. Fantom claims the same...suspiciously the same code. Obvious copyright infringement. Proprietary - but code is peer review and publicly available. 10,000 TPS proven. Today. Not future. Future TPS is technically infinite...but nobody will believe that so they say 100,000TPS. They are so far ahead they have to lie about it. Fees - are tied to .0001 USD not the crypto token HBAR. Very important concept. Fees are only paid in HBAR. Very important predictable fees for enterprise. When fees are tied to a crypto token like ETH or AlGO, they fluctuate to much for an enterprise to adopt long term. .001 BTC isn't the same as .001 ALGO. KWH comparison - HBAR = .001kwh, Visa = .00651 Kwh, ETH = 45Kwh. Pretty obvious here. Enterprise/CBDC competition for your comparison. None measure up in my opinion. Feel free to mention more I can add to my comparison. - Celo - R3 Corda - NZIA - Bitt = NZIA + Dcash + ECCB - Algorand - Fantom - Alchemy - Graph - Cypherium - Solana - unFederalReserve
I just looked at the average KWH listed around the web. Even if it were to consume slightly higher it’s still in the green. Really, it’s not going to make that much money in the end, but whatever. I just wanted to see IF I could do it and say I mined a few coins with this PC I built. At the rate I can mine and earn, I’d make ~$250 mining 7-8 hrs a day (while I sleep) for 365 days a year. That’s not really worth the trouble. Also, it would take me 5 years just to come close to paying back the cost of the CPU at that rate and by then there will be better cards, and RVN could be a dead coin, so 😂
1 ETH is a really long time for me... Currently I'm getting 0.00105ETH/day or $2.88/day it goes up/down with price and difficulty. As far as my costs go, I already had all the hardware (a computer w/ an RTX 2070) but you have to account for electricity (I use ~290 watts and pay 10¢/KWH so I think that's $1/day to run it?) So in all I'm making $1.88/day for doing nothing. The great thing is that since I'm mining ETH, it may be worth that $2.88 when I mine it that day, but I hold on to it, so the ideal is that it gets doubled a couple times.
~$0.11 KWH comes out to an additional >$10 a month
Looks like mine is about 1/2 that - $0.13/KWH. May be worth it more than i thought.
I think there is a big 'catch' here. Although the farmers get at peek moments a measly € 0,01 for 1 KWH. then it seems to be smart to put this in crypto mining energy. HOWEVER In the evening/night, when solor power = 0 you have to pay around € 0,20 per KWH. I didn't do the calculations, but I think even when you subtract heating coasts (which is for farmers relative cheap) I don't think mining will be very profitable, unless you doing it just during daylight time. It will take twice as much time before you are breakeven.
Plus its super easy to calculate some emissions numbers from bitcoin. hashrate \* some arbitrary machine \* the local CO2 per KWH.
I don't know about the prices today, but yeah, I looked them up before buying. There are websites that have info on graphic cards if you are going to use them for mining. Like their KWH, total cost of rig, TH/s and so on.
That's been proposed and is a terrible idea in practice. KWH's value to people depends & fluctuates very substantially in time and place. Look at the electrical power markets, as storage capacity is small and expensive, price of USD/kWH fluctuates by a factor of 1000 w.r.t. dollars. It can be cheap here and expensive there because the power line between them is congested. People want to use something stable through time and space. USD is pretty much stable through space unless you're in a country with USD sanctions or other difficulty trading. Through time, the Federal reserve is pretty clear they can guarantee a 1-5% inflation, and they've been right so far. USD is a measure of value because all sorts of contracts and legal consequences are in dollars. Would you take a mortgage out if its payments were in some unit that was fluctuating wildly w.r.t. the unit that you get your generally fixed salary in? Certainly not. There's nothing wrong with USD as a unit of accounting (or EUR in euros etc) and contracts that isn't more wrong with something else. As far as people worrying about an imminent hyperinflation---we've been hearing that BS since the 2009 stimulus (which in fact was too small to get the economy going fast enough). I think of it this way: there are many powerful people who would lose real wealth in that case, and they would ensure it doesn't happen. A deflationary currency is even worse as a base. Generally deflation helps wealthy people (bond holders) whereas small inflation helps regular working people relatively more.
I don't doubt the Lightning Network is more energy efficient ... but c'mon. 149 KWH ? That's ludicrous.
It is a problem of unit of accounting. People's perception is that USD is used to measure value, so itself must have constant value, just like lbs to measure weight and foot to measure length Once people find a better and objective unit of accounting, for example KWH or Joule (since every product/service, to its root, is eventually produced by consuming energy), and everything's value is measured by that unit, then it will be interesting to see if fiat money still can hold value at all
OP, Check this out... Debunking "Crypto is Destroying the Earth" Propaganda Part 2: Paranoia from Ignorance **Quick run up on Part 1**: I focused more on the comparison of power needed to feed just 13Million people's daily habits streaming movies compared to the power needed to verify 1.2Million Eth, 300K BTC, and 90K LTC transactions per day. _____________________ This time around I'm going to debunk the whole " BTC mining power " argument that's being used by many ignorant non-crypro users to say we are selfish people that need to "stop using cryptocurrency all together". **Let's look into mining BTC numbers.** *We have less than 3 million BTC left to mind* ###The final bitcoin is expected to be mined by 2140 Calculations considering this took into account the rate of mining adoption, and rewards halved for blocks every 4 years. The very reason it's estimated to take long is because we will actually see a decrease in mining due to increases in energy costs, and rewards being greatly reduced. Instead we will likely see a major shift from mining to collecting fees for Bitcoin transactions well before 2140. by this time, fees for transactions will likely increase into the thousands, but that's per block not per transaction. Nobody is going to charge $1000 to transfer 0.00001BTC. I hope not 😳. **Source**: https://www.investopedia.com/tech/what-happens-bitcoin-after-21-million-mined/ ________________ Haters of crypto that we are seeing today all over social media who once knew nothing about mining but now know everything about POW because they read a 3min news article about the total destruction of Earth believe there's going to be millions, and millions of BTC being verified, and mined by half the world every day. Exchanges before 2030 are also going to adapt enough where they can simply be cashed out there instead of sending them to coinbase or other exchanges who provide liquidity. We also haven't considered all the holders, all the lost PKs, and those who trade for other crypto like LTC before they transfer out. This is happening now as we speak, nevermind 2030. 😆. There's also a rise in usage for many other altcoins like Nano that take seconds to verify. In fact, most of the experienced crypto traders aren't even touching ETH or BTC transfers. It's all about holding shitcoins till the moon most of the time. We also still have Roger Ver FOMOing noobs into Bcash. ____________________ So much for, "if Half the world is mining....blah blah blah blah scary things for the Earth, blah blah blah" These people who claim they "care about the environment" but don't mind steaming 40KWH of content a day love using that Theory. ###Imagine 4,000,000,000 Billion people mining? 👀 We can't even get half of crypto owners to mine, much less half the world. Yes, this is one of the main statements being used on social media to say crypto is bad. Another one is the entropy argument. As if somehow we are going to need the same amount of energy it takes to build a Death Star. Not only are these people now experts in POW, they also have their PHD in Physics too. This is nothing short of fantasy theory driven by paranoia through ignorance. The world's yearly power usage is approximately 23,400,000,000,000KWH It takes approximately 720,000KWH(72,000GWH) of power to mine 1BTC **Source**: https://www.thebalance.com/how-much-power-does-the-bitcoin-network-use-391280#:~:text=Regardless%20of%20the%20number%20of,usage%20provided%20by%20ASIC%20miners. So 1,000,000,000,000KWH, the amount of energy it takes to power the world for roughly 15 days is enough power to mine 1,388,888BTC at its current BTC per block rate. We have less than 3 Million BTC left 😆. At the current blocks, if half the world was mining BTC, all the bitcoins would be mined in 70 days. That's a major IF. Again...these wild notions are at best a fantasy novel. Jeeezuz CHRIST! Half the world can't even pay their rent off in time, much less afford a rig to start mining BTC or Eth. We won't even come close to 5% of the worlds population mining BTC . Imagine 400,000,000 people mining BTC??? That's INSANE! All these people who NEVER OWNED CRYPTOCURRENCY, now have Superior knowledge over us crypto users about POW. ###Do these people really think they just stepped out of a Matrix learning portal after a 5 minute CNN + Wiki combo? I could promise you it took me a lot longer to compile all these numbers and I've been trading crypto for over 5 years now. **Next time you hear people who most likely didn't mind using the same amount of energy streaming hrs of propaganda filled movies during their lockdown as it takes to verify 1 BTC tell you**... *we are being selfish and wasteful for doing the stupid crypto thing* just tell them they are watching too much TV, then ignore them. You can't fix ignorance. https://www.reddit.com/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/m0ueiw/debunking_crypto_is_destroying_the_earth/
Just a rough estimate from google... There's roughly around 87 billion square feet of commercial floorspace in the USA, with an average operating cost of $2.10 per KWH. Assuming that 16 hours a day these floorspaces are sitting vacant and (being conservative) operating at 25% capacity, that is still $46,675,000,000 of electricity being used per hour nearly no one is there. Also, if I fucked this math or data up, someone kindly correct me.
Maybe you can help me. Where I live KWH is ~19¢, I have a laptop pc that is always idling but turned on 24/7 I think nothing would be worth mining on that, correct?
Numbers are way way less. There's only 1.2M eth transactions per day. 300K BTC and 90K LTC. That's 1.6M ltc uses a fraction of the power too. Those numbers get lower and lower as you move down that line. Not only lower but many many altcoins are using nothing In power compared to BTC and eth. We have 13,000,000 movies streamed at 10KWH per flick in the US at 18-29yeads old. That's a very very conservative number. That's more than all the power the world uses to verify these 3 cryptos. There's literally billions of hours being streamed world wide every day. And conservative? Reports are out that the average american streams 8hrs of content per day. That's 40KW of streaming x200Million americans lol. Crypto can't even complete with the power sucking machine of streaming in just the US alone. You have to be kidding me? Streaming movies and shows is just a hobby/leisure for the most part. Crypto is a hobby for people too. And an investment at the same time. So If we stopped crypto now....there really wouldn't be any real change in the world's power usage. Stopping steaming an going back to dvd or flash drive would be a major change to our power usage. Major. Hard copies leave less of a footprint
Yes, you can look up median rent in NJ in 2010 and compare it to today here. https://www.deptofnumbers.com/rent/new-jersey/morris-county/. It's a morris county link but also shows a chart compared to NJ median rent prices. $1245 in 2010 median and 2019 it's $1376. So it's even more than $100 difference. You can compare how much x amount of $$$ in 2010 is worth in 2020 by using this calculator. It's pretty accurate. You can see it on multiple sources but you have to pull out a calculator and see how much 8hr 40hrs a week for the year comes out to. And $12 hr. https://www.dollartimes.com/inflation/inflation.php?amount=50000&year=2010 The price for KWH is $16 today in NJ. It was $15 in 2010. That's a little tougher to find the average monthly bill but it works out to be $700 more a year on average. That's even with all these new energy efficient appliances.
What about the norweigan people who are using miners to heat their homes? They literally pay their electricity and water bills while getting free heating. They have the processing units attached to water pipes going through their floors. Now imagine that most homes use gas combustion to heat water. Bitcoin isn't doing anything that any other revolution has not done, it just needs adaptation AND IT'S GOING SUPER FAST ON THAT. Take as examples the industrial revolution or nuclear power plants. They both are know collaborating with he environment more than they have destroyed it. When Bitcoin stops this rushes and gets globally accepted, each KWH will mean a loss, and people dont want to loose money.
It surely works, since 99.99% of people use it to measure value, without USD, what do they use to measure value? It is like a standard unit of counting, like lbs or foot In fact, I promote something that is more objective to measure value, like KWH or Joule, and also someone said bitcoin is like a battery, you store electricity in it, and can exchange for more electricity in future
a good libertarian doesnt have a biden occupation goverment telling them they cant charge less than 15K per KWH for electricity generated during an emergency unless it comes out of an inefficient green windmill.