CPU

SteveW928

Yes, that is pretty close. In fact each hash each chip does within an ASIC unit (usually 100s of chips) have such a chance. Hashrate is analogous to how many 'tickets' you have. Each hash would generate a 'difficulty' which even if very high, won't win if it isn't over the threshold. But, but the more hashes, the more chances you have of generating one that crosses that threshold. This is, of course, if you are solo-mining. If you are pool-mining, then it is still the same thing, except that having all the tickets, from all these chips and miners, makes it more likely one of the units in the pool finds a block. The 'gotcha' here, is that most pools have too high of minimum difficulty, that a PC won't generate enough of them to register as a 'worker' to the pool. That means you won't get anything, even though you're contributing, which would be the whole point of joining a shared pool. But, if you can make the code run on your PC, CPU or GPU, it will be mining Bitcoin. It might just take you - not hundreds, but hundreds of thousands - of years. The difference between CPU, GPU, and an ASIC is hard to grasp.

daemonpenguin

Running a console only (SSH) will use less memory and CPU than a GUI. And on a small machine like a Pi, every little bit counts.

Corbimos

Nope. Any new coin that shows any form of value will immediately be taken over by the existing mining industry and corporations, completely missing the grass roots distribution you need for a decentralized currency. That type of distribution is only possible once. And bitcoin was the reason for the invention of ASIC miners. That happened after there was sufficient CPU and GPU mining. You can't compare that environment to today's, they are completely different.

Teraverse

In a sense, they are the same thing. If you have a business. That business will need your energy firstly your physical energy and secondly it will have a cost. Expenses, that you would need to cover. Until those expenses and that physical energy presence give you a yield. That means you need money to make money. So if I cannot cover my expenses, my business goes bankrupt. Cause it lacks the economical energy, likewise if I give the economical energy but I have no workers, meaning physical energy to actually do the hard work. The business goes bankrupt. So in a sense, you have to provide physical and economical energy to the instrument, for it to accumulate and sustain a healthy and secure growth Environment/Network The physical energy was already placed into the bitcoin code, that took physical energy to actually code it for some time. The economical energy was given by the miners with their CPU, and then the cpu energy was depleted, the network needed more energy, the miner upgraded to GPU mining, until that energy also wasn’t enough to sustain the network, the miners upgraded their mining equipment to ASICS and here we are. ASICS are upgraded each year cause the network requires more hash power.

FamousM1

The digital gold narrative is that Bitcoin is not meant to be spent and that it's supposed to increase in price and be expensive to move and slow to use, that quote has nothing to do with the usability of Bitcoin or the digital gold narrative. It's an analogy to how new coins are created. This is the only mention of gold in the whitepaper. > 6. Incentive: > By convention, the first transaction in a block is a special transaction that starts a new coin owned by the creator of the block. This adds an incentive for nodes to support the network, and provides a way to initially distribute coins into circulation, since there is no central authority to issue them. The steady addition of a constant of amount of new coins is analogous to gold miners expending resources to add gold to circulation. In our case, it is CPU time and electricity that is expended. Bitcoin was made to be a fast, secure, decentralized, peer-to-peer digital currency with low fees. Don't believe me? Check out Bitcoin.org and it's archived pages from 2009 til present. It even still says for the "What is Bitcoin" section that: > Bitcoin is a consensus network that enables a new payment system and a completely digital money. It is the first decentralized peer-to-peer payment network that is powered by its users with no central authority or middlemen. From a user perspective, *Bitcoin is pretty much like cash for the Internet.*

CointestMod

#TRON Pro-Arguments Below is a TRON pro-argument written by a deleted user. > ##**PROs** > > **Disclaimer**: There is little reliable information about Tron that isn't from Tron DAO or Justin Sun interviews. The official [Tron DAO Medium](https://trondao.medium.com/) site doesn't provide links to sources in the blog, making it harder to fact check and analyze. Many of its sources are from Weibo posts that are inaccessible beyond the Great Firewall of China. Tron's documentation and community posts provide way less information than that of other major blockchain projects. Nevertheless, I'm make do with what I can get. > > ####**Performance and Consensus** > > **High throughput and fast finality** > > Blocks are produced every 3s with a max size of 2M bytes. Consensus is completed using DPoS with a fault tolerance of 70% (9/27) Super Respresentatives that act as validators. There are over 350 SR/validator candidates who vote on the 27 SRs each 6 hours. > > - **High Throughtput**: **Tron can reach a max throughput of 2600 TPS with full 2M blocks** and its current balance of actual transactions, which is really high for an EVM-compatible blockchain. > - My calculations used [Tronscan data](https://tronscan.org/#/blockchain/blocks): Basic TRX and token transfers use 250-500 Bandwidth. The current average bandwidth for each transaction is currently 298, which is not that much higher than the lower end for basic transactions. > - Each bandwidth is 0.850 bytes, so you can fit 7800 average transactions in a single 3s block. Tron officially claims that it can reach 2000 TPS, so they're giving a conservative estimate. > - Even filled with 350-550 bandwidth swaps for [SunswapV2Router02](https://tronscan.org/#/contract/TKzxdSv2FZKQrEqkKVgp5DcwEXBEKMg2Ax/transactions), that's 1400 TPS on the lower end. That's way faster swaps than [everything other than Algorand](https://medium.com/dragonfly-research/the-amm-test-a-no-bs-look-at-l1-performance-4c8c2129d581). > - The tradeoff is that consensus is highly centralized (only 27 validators), and that the validators have very high requirements like having 32 CPU cores and 64GB of memory. > - In comparison, Ethereum's Layer 1 in comparison, can only do ~15 TPS average (59 TPS for basic transfers, 7 TPS for Uniswap v3 swaps). > - **Fast Finality in 3s**: All 27 SRs are currently playing friendly with each other, so for all practical purposes, finality is in 3 seconds. (Deterministic finality occurs every 27 blocks, or 81 seconds). > > **Network Energy usage** > > Tron's estimated annual energy usage for 2022 is estimated to be 1.7 kWh, or the **energy usage of [15 average US households](https://decrypt.co/108115/tron-network-energy-use-matches-that-of-15-us-households-ccri-report)**. This puts it slightly lower than the consumption of Avalanche, Algorand, Cardano, and Solana's networks. Its carbon footprint is also 4x lower than the others. And it uses 100000x less energy than Bitcoin. > > ####**Ease of Basic Utility** > > **Transaction fees are covered for FREE by freezing TRX** > > Tron has a unique design for transaction fees instead of using gas. Transactions fees are divided into bandwidth (pays for data bytes) and energy (pays for computations). All transactions require bandwidth while only contracts need energy. > > The benefit is that you get **FREE bandwidth and energy by freezing TRX**, a process similar to staking. You currently receive about 28 energy and 1 bandwidth daily [per frozen TRX](https://tronstation.io/calculator). Basic smart contracts use 350 Bandwidth (requires freezing 330 TRX) and 14.7K energy (requires staking 520 TRX). At current TRX prices, **if you freeze $2500 worth of TRX, you could perform 100 free basic transactions daily**. In addition, each account receives [1.5 kb of bandwidth daily](https://developers.tron.network/docs/resource-model) (originally 5 kb) for free even without freezing TRX, which is good for ~5 transactions. Though I suspect users can abuse this by creating new accounts. > > Any transaction fees in excess of the free energy and bandwidth are burned. This is why TRX is **currently deflationary by ~0.3% annually** (excluding burns for the USDD minting process). > > **Settlement layer for Tether** > > According to Blockchain's [Sep 2022 interview with Justin Sun](https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/exploring-tron-with-justin-sun-and-blockchain-com/id1536699961), **the original purpose of Tron was to act as a stablecoin settlement network and reserve network for Tether** (USDT). Sure enough, the bulk of DeFi on Tron's network deal with stablecoins. As of Sep 2022, [45% of Tether is now held on Tron](https://defillama.com/stablecoin/tether). And with Ethereum transaction fees being so high, Tron has become an attractive platform for USDT dApps. > > ####**DeFi Usages** > > **Smart Contracts** > > Tron's VM (TVM) is EVM-compatible and uses Solidity for the smart contract language. It is also Turing-complete. Thus, it's simple to rewrite EVM contracts for TVM. > > - **Tron's [DeFi TVL is massive at $5.4B](https://defillama.com/chains), putting at 3rd place after Binance Smart Chain**. > - Though it is a bit suspicious though that 99% of Tron's DeFi TVL are on 3 projects that are literally named after Justin Sun, though that could just be because it's very new. In comparison, Ethereum's DeFi is spread over hundreds of dApps. > - Tron SUN's [Liquidity Pool](https://sun.io/#/home) provides very high interest for USDD-USDT pairs at 5-70% APY. Back in June-July, you could gain triple-digit APY on Tron DeFi with stablecoins while the governance rewards boosts were still active. > > ####**Sustainable Tokenomics for TRX** > > - TRX's tokenomics have a steady, permanent issuance for validators, so it's **sustainable**. All transaction fees are burned. This isn't too different than Ethereum's tokenomics model (other than that Ethereum only burns part of the fee). > - TRX has a total circulating supply of about 92B, which is noticeably lower than their highest supply of 102B before the TRX-to-USDD minting protocol. TRX suddenly became [deflationary on Oct 27, 2021](https://tronscan.org/#/data/stats2/circulation). Supply has fallen about 10% since then due to token burns, making **TRX one of the most deflationary cryptocurrency in the top 30**. > - If we ignore the token burns from USDD minting, each day, ~5M TRX is minted, ~6M is burned (from transaction fees). **This gives net issuance of 1M TRX burned daily, or 0.3% annual deflation.** > > **Good TRX price action during the bear market** > > Tron's native token, TRX, is currently #15 in marketcap as of Sept 2022 with a [marketcap of $6B](https://www.coingecko.com/en/coins/tron). Its value has held up surprisingly well during the bear market, barely falling 50% while the rest of cryptocurrencies fell closer to 70-90%. **TRX is up 2x vs Bitcoin over the past year** during the bear market, pumping especially hard right around the launch of USDD and introduction of major staking and governance boost projects. > > ####**USDD, a hybrid stablecoin without UST's flaws?** > > **USDD is a hybrid collateralized/algorithmic (seigniorage) stablecoin** launched in May 2022 on Tron's network. It is one of the biggest focuses on the Tron roadmap. It was originally designed as a purely-algorithmic stablecoin based on Terra's now-failed Luna and UST stablecoin. After the collapse of Luna UST, the Tron DAO Reserve (TDR) made several changes to USDD to avoid a similar failure: > > **Differences between UST and USDD** > > 1. The biggest difference is that USDD is 300% collateralized with 11B TRX, 14K BTC, 100M USDT, and 1M USDC [Source](https://usdd.io/). **This makes USDD one of the most collateralized stablecoins.** In comparison, DAI is only 120% collateralized, and USDT and USDC are only 100% collateralized. > 1. TDR controls how much USDD can be minted or redeemed, so it's not purely algorithmic. Thus, TDR has full power to stop it from crashing. > 1. USDD will be released in multiple phases. The current phase only allows for a minting of 2B USDD. This is to limit USDD from growing astronomically quickly like with UST. [[Source](https://trondao.medium.com/improving-usdd-from-lessons-learned-e2600d7f94ad)] > 1. You're probably wondering what's the catch. There is a Peg Stability Module (PSM) that allows minting of USDD by burning TRX. You can current burn TRX for minting USDD, but **you cannot redeem USDD for TRX** [[source](https://twitter.com/TheImmutable/status/1536930692344401921)]. There is no liquidity on any of the [PSM smart contracts](https://docs.usdd.io/psm/the-psm#psm-contracts) to trade USDD for anything else. ***** Would you like to learn more? Check out the [Cointest archive](/r/CointestOfficial/wiki/cointest_archive#wiki_tron) to find submissions for other topics.

hero2288

Mining difficulty is actually scalable both up and down, and is actually done automatically. We could go back to CPU mining if really needed. Even one computer could keep the network running if needed. Can they shut down every computer on the planet?

analogOnly

He said, Whatsminer m21s. That's ASIC, not CPU mining.

Abundance144

Gold is present in every CPU. Sure it isn't the primary material, and the manufacturer minimizes the use of gold because, duh, it's expensive. However there is no other element that has the conductive and anti-corrosive properties that are needed in electronics. Show me any CPU, and I'll send you a picture of the pins underneath that are gold plated.

Dry-Preference-8733

What CPU’s don’t have gold in them? I wasn’t aware of that. All of nvidias, intel, amd, Samsung, and apple chips use gold. Who has made cpus w/out gold.

AutoX-R

Gold is not present in every CPU. While gold is used in some electronic components, such as certain connectors and bonding wires, it is not a primary material used in the manufacturing of CPU chips. CPUs primarily consist of materials like silicon, metal alloys, and various other semiconductor materials. Gold is more commonly found in older electronic devices or high-end components where its conductivity and corrosion resistance are valuable, but it's not universally present in all CPUs.

information-zone

You’ll be fine with either. Both are far faster than Raspberry Pi 4, which is what a lot of people use. Bitcoin Core (the main node software) is mostly network & disk bound, so a faster CPU doesn’t help. The speed of your disk (SSD) and your network will determine how quickly it syncs up, and with 10-minute blocks almost any CPU will be able to keep up.

Potential-Candle-961

I increased the max connections from 4 to 15 previously and that didn't really seem to help the issue. I also checked my CPU usage and throughout the entire duration of the Bitcoin Core program running it seems to only use about 20%. I'm not sure if that's a direct translation to my CPU not being bottlenecked but it doesn't seem like a problem. The only reason why I'm concerned is because I know other people who have ran the program in the last couple of days and they were able to download it with relatively little difficulty but it seems for me in the past 20-24 hours the progress has been painstakingly slow. If the resolution is that's how it's supposed to be then so be it, but I'm worried that there may be other things that I could fix to remediate the issue. Thanks!

Particular_Hawk_6660

You can only download what people are uploading to you. If it appears to slow down you may not have optimal power connections. Usually the bottlekneck is in your CPU verifying the blocks as they come in but in your case it could be the bandwidth of your connection and or the amount of peers you have. How many connections do you have? Go to connections window in the settings.

ensignlee

There was a random ad about running some program on your computer and they'd pay you in USD. Seemed like a scam, so I did some research and people were like "lol, this is just a shell for polcbm, a way to mine bitcoin with your CPU and GPU. You may as well just mine the btc yourself and convert to USD and cut out the middleman" So that's what I did. And that's how I got onto bitcointalk, and well, one thing led to another...

chloe_priceless

i would think more like 99% who where early didnt realize the potential of that and doesnt bother on the "money" kind of stuff. And at the beginning in 2009 there where only this network effect stuff and mostly nobody cared. CPU Mining was easy with a Laptop or PC but it wasnt usable during mining times. And you have to be on the right mindset to get a climps of that so early. I was 17 when i discoverd BTC (2009 - IT Nerd and had some IT Mailing lists) and until 25 i didnt bother to save money i lived from paycheck to paycheck. So thinking about Bitcoin or so didnt make much sense back in the days. There where more brain cells attached to buy makeup or cloth or drinking with friends and start your live after school and do your first Job and Training.

Whydidyoudothattwice

Satoshi approached us on EVGA forums, and asked for people experienced in software development and testing. Want to see if we were interested in helping test the mining software, and we had to have a modern CPU and GPU in the GTX 200 series, and some Cuda experience.  I had all of the requirements for it. Ended up becoming a Bitcoin founder, and ICO’d it.

castorfromtheva

Umbrel is good. It's easy to run and runs really stable! I compared it to a lot of other implementations and so far Umbrel works best compared to others! I recommend running it on a real x86 pc rather than on pi. Much more power while still being very energy efficient! Look for things like (used!) Lenovo Tiny mini pc with at least a generate 6 CPU (i3 6100t or above) and 8 gigs of RAM. On top get a 2Tbyte SSD and you're good to go for the next 5 years. Won't cost you more than approx. 200 bucks plus around 1 to 3 bucks per month for energy (in case you run it 24/7/365 as usually recommended, because quick availability).

seed-cat

The easiest would be just to use the XPUB if you have it (no derivation paths makes things faster). Otherwise, just try say the first 100 derivation paths once you have the XPRIV / XPUB. You should be able to reuse this for the derivation paths so you avoid the expensive 2048 iterations of SHA512 for each derivation path. The bitcoin Rust libraries support this. I wrote a tool that supports this with pure GPU acceleration, but if you are dealing with 49M that should be easy on a modern CPU. [https://github.com/seed-cat/seedcat](https://github.com/seed-cat/seedcat) In my case I needed to try \~100B combinations so GPU acceleration was necessary.

bigbarryb

You overestimate the power of miners. The whitepaper says "As long as a majority of CPU power is controlled by nodes that are not cooperating to attack the network, they’ll generate the longest chain and outpace attackers." It doesn't say "Bitcoin is defined as the one with the longest chain". In such an OBVIOUS situation, we the users will communicate, patch the issue and run on the chain that is obviously the original one. Eventually, miners will address the issue and join the users and we can start to rely on the longest chain once again. The longest chain metric allows us to have a level of automation, but it isn't the final decision maker... we, the humans are... as long as we can agree on something, and nothing is easier to agree on than a common enemy. Also, when a reorg happens, what do you think happens to the unconfirmed transactions? They just go back to the mempool to get mined again.

ares_god_not_sign

That is a hairsbreadth away from my target compared to when I started mining BTC on my CPU over a decade ago.

bleakj

I know I can mind Monero using XMR-Rig, but isn't this just CPU mining? Or is there actual node running that Im not familiar with that that functions different?

arthurwolf

My first contact with BTC was like two weeks (a month?) after the first release, from a comment on a Boing Boing article about something cryptography-related, somebody said "by the way, there's this cool project about cryptography-based coins...", at the time you could mine a block (50 btc?) in like under an hour (minutes?) on your CPU. I did so and got a few hundred BTC, and then lost that wallet after my disk file system was corrupted and I had to write over it. Didn't really care at the time, it was worth nothing, just a fun/interresting curiosity. I do search my house from time to time from top to bottom just in case I find some old backup from back then, but by now it's pretty clear that wasn't backed up at the time. Later on (2011?), I bought a harddrive online (legit seller) for 300 btc (I \*think\* also mined, but took much more time. at the time I was really proud to be able to get a physical object from just "processor time". Felt like I had gamed the system. ) I paid somebody to do AI dev work for me (adapt a github AI project into a node library I could use in my project), paid them well over 1000 BTC, that I bought minutes before sending to them (they were in a country for which bank transfers are expensive/inconvenient). Don't remember exactly when, but it might have been 2012. The over 1000 BTC (1200?) was worth around $5k. We actually became friends over the years, recently as they complained about money trouble, I asked them what happened to the 1000BTC, they should be super rich: they bought drugs with it, minutes after receiving it. Later on (2013), I was paid for something, and asked to be paid in BTC to make the transfer more convenient. I then used Mtgox to convert it to cash, and \*\*exactly\*\* at the time I had my money they (was a matter of days), is exactly the time when MtGox collapsed. The good news is, \*after\* they stopped allowing withdrawals, but before they completely closed, there was a period in which they allowed trading still. In that period, through a series of trades I'm very proud of, I nearly 10X my BTC. Now, after over 10 years, we're going to get paid about 15% of what we had on Mtgox (it "all" got stolen by a hacker, but actually the site admin had "forgotten" it still had 200k btc in a cold wallet... so japanese justice is giving us our share of that back). All in all, in that operation, I'm getting more BTC than I initially sent to Mtgox (due to the trades, 10X my BTC, and we're getting 1/7th of what we had there, so that's over 1X), AND I was forced to hodl through two (now three) halvings... Later on (2014/2013?) with a friend I had designed/manufactured hundreds of custom ASIC mining chips (would have been amongst the very first to mine on ASIC), we paid a guy in the UK a few dozen BTC to design the PCBA on which the ASICs would run. He did design the thing, but it didn't work. When we asked him to fix it, he just ghosted us. I hired a private investigator to find him, but they didn't (possibly the info we had for him was fake). As I get richer, I'm going to put more money into finding the guy, he's not getting away. He's got millions worth of bitcoin (MY bitcoin), but if he wants to enjoy it, he'll have to stay in hiding the rest of his life. That was not all lost though, a year or so later, we were able to get other PCBs designed/made, and I ran the ASICs in the back of my garage with a huge watercooling system, for over two years, until they became not worth the electriticy. I accumulated I think around 13 BTC (and random other btc-based coins), half of that was lost when a mining pool I used rug-pulled, and the rest I sold to cover my cost of living at the time / the electricity / making the PCBs etc. I also bought a miner from butterflylabs, paid in BTC, they never delivered, and when they paid me back, instead of sending my BTC back, they paid me back the equivalent USD value of the original BTC payment, in USD, meaning they essentially stole all of the value gained. Would be a few BTC worth I think. When covid started, I had managed to accumulate around 0.5 BTC just from DCA. I had to sell it all after losing my job / my (self-owned) electronics company freezing due to the worldwide shortage of components. I'm accumulating again, though I won't say publicly how much I'm at, it's not very much. But I'll keep at it.

Dazzling_Marzipan474

Did you even read wtf I wrote. Go look at my entire history. I've never mentioned render anywhere. I was trying to help. I thought the token was for rendering CPU power. Thus the name. Like I said twice already I don't know anything about it. Just trying to help.

g_r_u_b_l_e_t_s

I run a (new) public node on a VPS that came up last weekend. Its incoming traffic has been a fairly constant 10-12 Mb/s with light CPU use. It certainly has room to grow. Granted that’s a single datapoint, but it’s better on resources than I was expecting.

coinjaf

\> need a considerable amount of storage And bandwidth, and CPU power and memory. \> A single person without a huge mining farm cannot profitably run a mining node False. 1/1000th of profit at 1/1000th of the cost is still same percentage of profit. \> If not every person should be able to run their own mining node Why are you changing the subject from node to mining node? \> own full node Because you run a full node primarily for yourself, not for others.

Generic_Globe

Abstract. A purely peer-to-peer version of >>>>>>>>>>electronic cash<<<<<<< would allow online payments to be sent directly from one party to another without going through a financial institution. Digital signatures provide part of the solution, but the main benefits are lost if a trusted third party is still required to prevent double-spending. We propose a solution to the double-spending problem using a peer-to-peer network. The network timestamps transactions by hashing them into an ongoing chain of hash-based proof-of-work, forming a record that cannot be changed without redoing the proof-of-work. The longest chain not only serves as proof of the sequence of events witnessed, but proof that it came from the largest pool of CPU power. As long as a majority of CPU power is controlled by nodes that are not cooperating to attack the network, they'll generate the longest chain and outpace attackers. The network itself requires minimal structure. Messages are broadcast on a best effort basis, and nodes can leave and rejoin the network at will, accepting the longest proof-of-work chain as proof of what happened while they were gone. Does it say "money" or does it say "gold"?

afterthawed

I mean lets be honest, 3 mining companies controlling a combined 70%+ of the hashing rate is not an ideal situation no matter which way you look at it. The main thing stopping them colluding is simply that it would be far less profitable for them to do so, and people really like money... However unlikely it is it's still something people should be aware of, if for no other reason than to simply better understand how mining works. As Satoshi himself wrote: >The incentive may help encourage nodes to stay honest. If a greedy attacker is able to assemble more CPU power than all the honest nodes, he would have to choose between using it to defraud people by stealing back his payments, or using it to generate new coins. He ought to find it more profitable to play by the rules, such rules that favor him with more new coins than everyone else combined, than to undermine the system and the validity of his own wealth.

aprx4

> meaning new transactions are happening faster than it can sync sometimes! It does take some CPU resource to verify transactions and blocks but i don't think there are too many transactions to slow CPU down that much.

Dhegxkeicfns

I mined for a bit before GPUs took over on a laptop and desktop CPU. Wasn't worth much when I stopped and so didn't worry about the keys. Nowhere to be found now, though.

CointestMod

#Dogecoin Con-Arguments Below is a Dogecoin con-argument written by Chysce. > Dogecoin was [launched in 2013](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dogecoin#:~:text=In%20addition%2C%20they%20wanted%20to,making%20the%20idea%20a%20reality) as a satirical response to the hype surrounding crypto. In 2015, its creators stepped away from the project. The aim of its creators was to develop a coin that would not be taken seriously by investors, however despite their intentions, Dogecoin still attracted a significant number of speculators. In fact, it became the world's largest memecoin during the first half of 2021, with its value rocketing over 15,000%. > > Like Bitcoin Dogecoin uses the proof-of-work to validate transactions. Doge is merge mined at the same time with litecoin. There are [speculations](https://cointelegraph.com/news/rumor-has-it-that-dogecoin-could-shift-to-proof-of-stake-what-does-that-mean-for-miners) that Doge will switch to Proof of Stake soon but there is no definitive news on this as of yet. > > **>> Doge has no intrinsic value** > > In the very essence Doge has no value. Apart from [sporadic use](https://coingate.com/blog/post/doge-support-much-wow) for online tipping or as a means of payment for some businesses, it does not have a unique use case or solve any real-world problems. Its value is solely based on its popularity. While this can produce exciting short-term gains it is not a viable strategy for long-term investing. > > **>> High Volatility** > > The price of Doge is highly volatile, making it a risky investment. It's price is mostly driven by the Elon Musk's tweets and memes. Nowadays there are even bots that market buy Doge whenever Elon tweets something about it. These pumps are short lived and can cause a big spike in liquidations for unprepared investors. Elon Musk also appears to have distanced himself from Dogecoin in recent times. He did not include Dogecoin as a payment option for Twitter, and he also [tweeted](https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1631720134636367872?lang=en) that he is more interested in AI than crypto as of late. > > **>> Unlimited supply** > > Unlike Bitcoin, Dogecoin has no hard cap [no hard cap](https://www.sofi.com/learn/content/will-dogecoin-ever-be-capped/) on the total supply, which means it could potentially be inflated indefinitely. It's current supply increase is [\~4% per year](https://www.analyticsinsight.net/heres-what-you-need-to-know-about-dogecoin-inflation/#:~:text=For%20anyone%20buying%20Dogecoin%20to,4%25%20in%20price%20each%20year). > > \>> **Lack of Development and future narratives** > > Dogecoin has a relatively small development team, and the project has not seen significant updates or improvements in recent years. Additionally very few people run full nodes. Finally there is no clear long-term narrative that could cause its wide adoption > > \>> **Security** > > Dogecoin's mining algorithm is less secure than others, making it more susceptible to 51% attacks. Doge uses a different mining algorithm than Bitcoin, called [Scrypt](https://learn.bybit.com/altcoins/how-to-mine-dogecoin/), which is generally considered less secure than Bitcoin's SHA-256 algorithm. [Scrypt was designed to be more memory-intensive](https://cryptobook.nakov.com/mac-and-key-derivation/scrypt), making it harder for ASIC miners to dominate the network and creating a more level playing field for CPU and GPU miners. However, this also makes it easier for attackers to launch 51% attacks. > > On top of that Doge has a much smaller mining community and less overall network hash rate than Bitcoin. This means that it could be more vulnerable to attacks from miners who control a large portion of the network's hashrate. > > And finally Doge's unlimited supply means that there is less of an incentive for miners to secure the network. ***** Would you like to learn more? Check out the [Cointest archive](/r/CointestOfficial/wiki/cointest_archive#wiki_Dogecoin) to find submissions for other topics.

riscten

If we cannot trust the hardware cryptographic functions on a piece of silicon, then the idea of cryptocurrency completely falls apart unless we do all the calculations by hand and use fair dice that we built ourselves for random number generation. This is bordering on tinfoil-hat levels of paranoia, which I'm not against, but I think it's fair to assume that outside of specialized wallet hardware where there is a big incentive to distribute malicious chips, these components should largely behave as expected. Building a hardware wallet out of a general purpose SoC such as the ESP32 or an Intel/AMD CPU should mostly be fine.

PoisonWaffle3

Hey, I mined 5 BTC on my gaming PC in 2011, on two mid-tier GPUs and a quad core CPU. Three instances running, mining on all three chips. I've sold most of it over the years (it paid for a good chunk of the house I built in 2021/2022), but I still have 0.1 BTC still in that wallet, mined myself in 2011.

erilaz123

Hi, is a Tesla M40 card profitable in 2024? I'm considering replacing the K10 in my server,[Tesla K10, similar to 2x GTX 780) 2X Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU E5-2650 0 @ 2.00GHz 12X HMT31GR7BFR4A-H9 8GB DIMM DDR3 1333MT/s MemTotal:       98894328 kB ( 98 GB) MemFree:        77341924 kB MemAvailable:   81958844 kB A  kWh is 0.106 euro. M40 card specs: https://www.techpowerup.com/gpu-specs/tesla-m40.c2771

BitcoinAcc

If that were to happen, then the average time between blocks would decrease. A little or a lot, depending on how many miners that wizard could actually employ, I mean, it's not as if hardware that can do this new special math just appears suddenly - so presumably only a little at first, as only a few of these new miners would go online and the total hash rate would only increase a bit. Block time would decrease until the next difficulty adjustment. And after the adjustment we would be back to one-block-every-ten-minutes (on average). Presumably, that wizard would bring more of the new miners online and other miners would soon also start using this new wizardry. The hash rate would increase faster than before for a time (again causing blocks to be mined faster and difficulty to increase) until finally all miners use the new technology and everything evens out again. This would actually not be the first time, as it would be similar to what already happened when CPU mining was replaced by GPU mining which was then replaced by ASICS mining.

BitcoinAcc

> Not really. It was being tested and a problem was identified. Further investigation into the issue discovered the potential backdoor. It really was coincidental. Andre Freund, the person who found it was not specifically testing xz at all, he wasn’t even doing any security testing or security audit either. He was running his usual automated PostgreSQL tests on bleeding edge Linux distributions just to make sure that nothing in the new distributions would break PostgreSQL (a database). He just wondered why a certain part of the tests was suddenly slower than before and investigated. At that point he had no idea that it had to do with xz at all, or a backdoor or anything like that. He said so himself: „I was doing some micro-benchmarking at the time, needed to quiesce the system to reduce noise. Saw sshd processes were using a surprising amount of CPU, despite immediately failing because of wrong usernames etc. Profiled sshd, showing lots of cpu time in liblzma, with perf unable to attribute it to a symbol. Got suspicious. Recalled that I had seen an odd valgrind complaint in automated testing of postgres, a few weeks earlier, after package updates. Really required a lot of coincidences.“

HeroicHeron

You were likely mining shitcoins on Nicehash which was paying you in BTC. As Amber\_Sam suggested, the best way to utilize those GPUs would be to sell them and buy BTC directly. Buying an ASIC is probably not going to be worth it for you if the electricity costs are not extremely low where you live. Running a node is great, but you won't be making money that way. You don't need GPUs either (an integrated one would do) . Mainly you just need a decently sized and fast SSD, some RAM and a basic CPU. Anyway. good luck to you.

turdoman

Yep, my wife's employer was mining it first with CPU, then GPU it continued for years. He amassed tens of thousands of BTC and was also a target of theft for tens of thousands. The funds he has made public at the moment amount to a few million euros at most.

stcalvert

Right. Bitcoin was poorly described as tokens you get in exchange for spending CPU time on random "puzzles" which doesn't make sense, especially when you compare it to projects like Seti@home which had a clear need for distributed CPU cycles. When I read the whitepaper I finally got it.

Self_Blumpkin

Yeah. I was fucking around with BTC back then too. I was mining with CPU and then GPU when it became a thing. Spent most of it on onion sites. I try not to think about that. I most certainly would have sold it when my funds gained a couple thousand percent lol. I can’t imagine I would have had the foresight to hold onto all those coins until 2024. Back then it was magic internet money. Not the new gold. But in 2017… I was running a hosted mining business and I had a shit load of my own miners too. I knew. Even though it was only 4 days worth of funds, it still hurts.

caploves1019

Considering CPU/GPU mining yields shtcoins you can swap for Bitcoin.... And this method yields NO bitcoin.... Opportunity and energy cost is real.

kevdoge102

Don’t use nicehash, it’s deceiving. First it doesn’t account for halving. Second, your share of the network hashrate decrease as each day passes. It’s the same reason you won’t make anything mining with a CPU. Go to https://smokinghopium.io to get general estimate of how much you could make ( and those are optimistic numbers). In your case it’s probably better to just buy BTC instead of mining.

SmoothGoing

Trezor Suite or Sparrow will be fine if obtained from legit sources. There's no secret information touching the M CPU if you use a hardware wallet. All keys and signing is done on chip in the HW not on M.

Spats_McGee

Yeah that's a good point, even if one was interested in acquiring BTC there weren't a lot of good options... Well except for mining, you could probably CPU mine at that point

john-larry

75% BTC, 20% ETH, 5% XMR Monero is what bitcoin noobs think they bought. Other than most cryptocurrencies it’s actually untraceable and fungible. It has low fees and a very low inflation rate of 0.86%/year that will continue decreasing forever. Gold is currently at 2% and bitcoin at 1.72% so monero doesn’t have “infinite supply” like many believe. It also fixes ASIC centralization with CPU-only mining and has a dynamic blocksize that can scale with network demand. It has 10-20% of bitcoins transactions and about 30-50% of the number of bitcoin nodes yet only ~0.17% of bitcoins market cap; massive upside. Darknet markets have already abandoned bitcoin in favor of monero. They were the first users of bitcoin…

Ilovekittens345

That is nonsense >Once the CPU effort has been expended to make it satisfy the proof-of-work, the block cannot be changed without redoing the work. As later blocks are chained after it, the work to change the block would include redoing all the blocks after it. A blockheader is the hash of the previous blockheader + nonce, where the blockheader is the outer layers of the merkle tree allowing you to look at a tx id and calculate it it's included in the tree. Therefore in terms of forging block it goes not matter if they are empty or have tx. It's the bruteforcing of the nonce that is the work.

erilaz123

It's a old server that has: 2x GK104GL [Tesla K10, similar to 2x GTX 780) 2X Intel(R) Xeon(R) CPU E5-2650 0 @ 2.00GHz 12X HMT31GR7BFR4A-H9 8GB DIMM DDR3 1333MT/s MemTotal: 98894328 kB ( 98 GB) MemFree: 77341924 kB MemAvailable: 81958844 kB A kWh is 0.106 euro. Maximum wattage for the two cards is 234 W combined according to nvidia-smi.

john-larry

In case of a “world emergency” where you have to survive in an adversarial environment, you’re probably best served with a stack of Monero. It’s untraceable, decentralized and people in adversarial environments are already using it today (e.g. darknet markets). It is mined with CPU so even if governments would want to target miners, they would be difficult to identify. It also has a tail emission to ensure network security long into the future while still having lower inflation than gold. Probably best to also get a position in bitcoin and gold as a hedge. Gold to use in case internet/electricity goes down.

TheDumper44

I have been in it since you could mine a BTC on a CPU in a day. Only people I know who have consistently won are people that dump on bulls. Everyone who fomos sells before they get into profit or never buys again.

Glass_Fox2505

I'm in Bitcoin very long. Mtgox , mining on gpu and even CPU .. I don't wish to change anything. Just be happy, open-minded, and try to share this happiness with your love ones . And money will always be around as long as you live connected with the universe and try to change other people lives for better. 🌎 Ah this Easter is magical 🐣🐰 do you also feel that?

Cat7o0

just mine a cents worth. mine something like Ursula (gpu), subi (CPU). or ravencoin if you have a good GPU (payout will take a while.

ArcherBullseye

Originally you could mine with a CPU, then a GPU, then cheap ASICS.

Revolutionary-Ebb-26

From a technical perspective, that is Bitcoin's innovation. It solved what's known as the Byzantine Generals Problem by using Proof of Work. Satoshi gives a good explanation of what is the Byzantine Generals Problem and how proof of work solves it, in the cypherpunk mailing list where Bitcoin was first introduced to the world: https://www.metzdowd.com/pipermail/cryptography/2008-November/thread.html#14849 > James A. Donald wrote: > It is not sufficient that everyone knows X. We also > need everyone to know that everyone knows X, and that > everyone knows that everyone knows that everyone knows X > - which, as in the Byzantine Generals problem, is the > classic hard problem of distributed data processing. The proof-of-work chain is a solution to the Byzantine Generals' Problem. I'll try to rephrase it in that context. A number of Byzantine Generals each have a computer and want to attack the King's wi-fi by brute forcing the password, which they've learned is a certain number of characters in length. Once they stimulate the network to generate a packet, they must crack the password within a limited time to break in and erase the logs, otherwise they will be discovered and get in trouble. They only have enough CPU power to crack it fast enough if a majority of them attack at the same time. They don't particularly care when the attack will be, just that they all agree. It has been decided that anyone who feels like it will announce a time, and whatever time is heard first will be the official attack time. The problem is that the network is not instantaneous, and if two generals announce different attack times at close to the same time, some may hear one first and others hear the other first. They use a proof-of-work chain to solve the problem. Once each general receives whatever attack time he hears first, he sets his computer to solve an extremely difficult proof-of-work problem that includes the attack time in its hash. The proof-of-work is so difficult, it's expected to take 10 minutes of them all working at once before one of them finds a solution. Once one of the generals finds a proof-of-work, he broadcasts it to the network, and everyone changes their current proof-of-work computation to include that proof-of-work in the hash they're working on. If anyone was working on a different attack time, they switch to this one, because its proof-of-work chain is now longer. After two hours, one attack time should be hashed by a chain of 12 proofs-of-work. Every general, just by verifying the difficulty of the proof-of-work chain, can estimate how much parallel CPU power per hour was expended on it and see that it must have required the majority of the computers to produce that much proof-of-work in the allotted time. They had to all have seen it because the proof-of-work is proof that they worked on it. If the CPU power exhibited by the proof-of-work chain is sufficient to crack the password, they can safely attack at the agreed time. The proof-of-work chain is how all the synchronisation, distributed database and global view problems you've asked about are solved.

john-larry

>but does it have to be transparent for everyone? No it doesn’t need to be this way. There are public distributed ledgers that don’t reveal transaction amounts as well as senders/receivers while still being completely verifiable. Monero is currently the most used privacy preserving blockchain. It has also made strides in CPU-only mining to help decentralization by being ASIC-resistant. Fees are also very low and the blocksize can automatically adapt based on demand and extra fees being offered. It is one of a few cryptocurrencies that are actually fungible and don’t have to deal with the concept of dirty coins.

Sterlingz

Maxis have been wrong since they started existing, ie early days of alts. They said we only *need* bitcoin - but that isn't true because the crypto ecosystem fulfills hundreds of use cases that bitcoin can't touch. They advised a "bitcoin only" portfolio, when the reality is that alts are the easiest way to obtain more fiat and therefore, more bitcoin. They said shitcoins, smart contracts and nfts were scams, but in 2023 the bitcoin blockchain was subsidized entirely by inscription and shitcoin fees, demonstrating sustainable security for the first time ever. They said bitcoin can't be hard forked, no matter what. Then they learned of the 2106 bug and changed their minds. Actually, they're not sure yet. They said lightning would scale. It hasn't scaled or gained much traction, and lightning devs have said, verbatim, that lightning doesn't work in a high fee environment. They said mining would decentralize and align with the ethos "one CPU one vote". Mining has trended toward centralization and so has asic manufacturing. They worship scammers like max keiser and spit in the face of CORE DEVS who then quit. Obviously I could go on and on, the point is that maxis are idiots.

GuiltyMasterpiece248

Bitcoin can function as long as 1 ASIC/CPU/GPU is mining. If the current global hash rate stayed the same it could function forever. The only thing needed for the network is to be large enough to make it unprofitable for 1 entity to have 51% of the global hash rate. At the current scale this is not possible. Then even if it did happen. Nodes can just invalidate and ban the corrupt third party from the network making everything they did useless.

implaying

I did the same thing last year when I had to upgrade my CPU. Thanks Moons

MrHonkiHonkson

BTC mining has not been profitable with CPU or GPU for quite a long time. With not profitable, I mean zero rewards. It can only mined with ASIC. This is the way.

thetdy

What does research mean? Do you understand cryptography? Do you know how these projects work and what they set out to do? When I first started in alts I was reading home page descriptions and watching YouTube videos. Not really a great method. As my understanding of cryptography was next to none, the white papers didn't make sense or sounded like crypto business buzzwords. YouTube is just a shrillers paradise. If I were to redo it and give you advice I would have you understand these things: 1. Public Cryptography- Understand how encryption works with asymmetric key pairs. Encryption, decryption, signing, GPG, hashing (sha256, sha 512, etc). All this can be played with in GPG4win/Kleopatra. 2. Cryptographic primitives- how they are used in computer science to develop the CPU architecture. Using a CPUs instruction set (RISC) to encrypt and decrypt data. 3. Virtual machines- how VMs work in the crypto world. 4. How blockchains work- Not just a quick 15-20 min videos on YouTube. I'm talking about 2-3 hour long videos that go into developing a block chain. Ones that really go into the inner workings of a blockchain. Not the ones that have the voice over a infographic video with animations lol it's gotta be one dude on stage and his 3 hours of slide shows lol. With these things being understood, then you can dive into alts and understand their goals. From there you can make good decisions. The only thing is that most people in the crypto space are number go up people. This means good projects may go unnoticed and complete garbage and even scams will skyrocket. But at least now you can identify good ideas. Next will be trying to understand people which is the hardest part. People will invest in good projects but demand marketing if number doesn't go up when it literally makes no sense and drop them for scams or projects that don't even work lol so that in my opinion is luck. One last thing I would advise is pick your expertise. You can't monitor or understand the entire crypto world so pick something you're excited about and focus on that market. AI, gaming, L1s, L2s, interoperability, security, decentralization, etc. pick something like one of these and study it. Study it hard and then good luck.

Amber_Sam

>Just thought of how people criticize and laugh at Lazlo for purchasing two large pizzas with 10,000 btc, now worth $713M USD Laszlo had more than 10k coins. He created and used a GPU miner while the rest were running on the CPU. He just wanted something in return, otherwise the mining was worth $0. People laughing, have no idea. >Will we someday tell similar stories of how we spent soooo many sats on relatively cheap items? As long as you have fiat, spend and replace. Problem solved. >My book was purchased for $2,100 in “future money.” Have you bought a new computer, 30 years ago? Same result.

speculator100k

Did he really spend thousands of dollars on mining? Back then, CPU mining was the name of the game. Say 200W to keep a regular desktop computer running. That's 1752 kWh per year. What was the cost of that? 200 USD? Depends on the location of course.

Xylber

It is still a peer-to-peer electronic "currency" system (not cash, as "cash" is physical paper). I guess Satoshi didn't expected that Bitcoin would be so expensive to mine, because at the begining you were able to mine with a normal consumer oriented CPU (do old gamers remember the glorious Intel i5 2500K that mined 1 BTC per day?), so the fees were less than a cent. Now we have a **devaluation of all national currencies, inflation, increased costs in energy and specialization of the hardware**, which makes Bitcoin super expensive to mine increasing its price, beating the US dollar 70,000 to 1, something that I'm guessing was not expected by Satoshi (or anyone, would you believe it 15 years ago?). Anyway, we know for sure he expected more people to join in, so we can divide a Bitcoin in more parts than a single Satoshi (that means, we can add zeroes in front, 0.0000000000001).

Deep-Cow9096

akash golem io.net ritual gensyn edge matrix net mind Probably a dozen others. Add NodeAi to the list of projects that are just people making their GPU/CPU/memory/storage available for people to compute stuff but most of it just idles away not being used. Isn't any more about AI than my RTX 4080. Not saying you can't make money off token airdrops for making your GPU available to users before the project tokenizes (probable idle the whole time). Then you take your GPU/CPU/storage/memory off the network and sell your airdropped tokens

Archophob

the difficulty is adjusted often enough to keep the 10 minutes per block on average, yes. Otherwise the shift from CPU mining to GPU mining and the later shift from GPU to ASIC would have drastically decreased to time between blocks and increased the supply. As Nakamoto didn't intend to have "goldrushes" each time the mining hardware changes, the difficulty adapts roughly every week.

SmoothGoing

It's number of bits in a data structure storing values. Not 64 bit processors. 32 bit CPU can deal with an integer 64 bits long.

SmartestScammer

Bitcoin doesn't even prioritize the ability for users to verify the network, so why mimic it? ASICs dominate bitcoin mining. I would also argue Proof of Stake inherently takes away an independent user's ability to verify the network. Unlike XMR where 1 CPU = 1 vote, a validator with a low stake basically has no say in the network.

filbertbrush

“The vulnerability can be exploited when the targeted cryptographic operation and the malicious application with normal user system privileges run on the same CPU cluster.“ This means that a potential victim would have to be running a malicious application on their M processor Mac while running a wallet like ledger in order for keys to be leaked right? 

generateduser29128

Just looking at their 4 options for mining Bitcoin I can 100% guarantee that this is a scam: \* CPU (5.000 GH/s) \* GPU (15.000 GH/s) \* ASIC (50.000 GH/s) \* AntMiner (150.000 GH/s) CPU mining hasn't been profitable for more than 10 years, and the hash rate would be a factor 10\^5 lower. The other ones don't make sense either. ASICs are many orders of magnitudes faster than CPUs and GPUs.

CobraPhi

Ok fine. You presume that the mining reward becomes so low that it’s not worth it to mine. Do know the future? Do you have a Time Machine? If so, could you rent it to me cause I’ll use it for all kinds of investments beyond Bitcoin. Miners have always prioritized, are currently prioritizing, and will continue to prioritize higher fee tx’s. This is just market dynamics. You’re presuming that the mining industry looks the same decades from now. If it becomes less profitable to mine, then miners shut down and hashrate goes down. Perhaps hashrate lowers to the point that I can once again mine with a CPU. Would need to borrow that time machine tho to get optimistic about it. You presume the incentives of people to buy/sell. I don’t buy or sell btc because of the mining reward. I buy it because it is decentralized, immutable, and secure. You are correct in if demand decreases then the usd value of bitcoin decreases. But then how is the value of usd going so far given its current (and most likely perpetual) rate of inflation?!?! Does it even matter if usd value keeps evaporating? Lastly, there is a common expression that gets tossed around a lot in this sub. 1 BTC = 1 BTC. And although it is trite, it is actually a very significant concept both implicitly and explicitly. It took me a long time to really get it. You are following this sub, so you must see the value of what Bitcoin offers and you are on your own journey with it as well. I hope this has helped to further your understanding or to prompt you to seek out further understanding. And hit me up about that time machine. It’d be so rad to make the regards over at r/wsb feel even more regarded!

Real-Technician831

BTW I checked and Apple M series CPUs does not allow programmer to force some code to run in efficient cores. Program can set ThreadAffinity and QOS. But it is the CPU that decides in the end. And if high performance cores are free, those will be used.

CointestMod

#Dogecoin Con-Arguments Below is a Dogecoin con-argument written by Chysce. > Dogecoin was [launched in 2013](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dogecoin#:~:text=In%20addition%2C%20they%20wanted%20to,making%20the%20idea%20a%20reality) as a satirical response to the hype surrounding crypto. In 2015, its creators stepped away from the project. The aim of its creators was to develop a coin that would not be taken seriously by investors, however despite their intentions, Dogecoin still attracted a significant number of speculators. In fact, it became the world's largest memecoin during the first half of 2021, with its value rocketing over 15,000%. > > Like Bitcoin Dogecoin uses the proof-of-work to validate transactions. Doge is merge mined at the same time with litecoin. There are [speculations](https://cointelegraph.com/news/rumor-has-it-that-dogecoin-could-shift-to-proof-of-stake-what-does-that-mean-for-miners) that Doge will switch to Proof of Stake soon but there is no definitive news on this as of yet. > > **>> Doge has no intrinsic value** > > In the very essence Doge has no value. Apart from [sporadic use](https://coingate.com/blog/post/doge-support-much-wow) for online tipping or as a means of payment for some businesses, it does not have a unique use case or solve any real-world problems. Its value is solely based on its popularity. While this can produce exciting short-term gains it is not a viable strategy for long-term investing. > > **>> High Volatility** > > The price of Doge is highly volatile, making it a risky investment. It's price is mostly driven by the Elon Musk's tweets and memes. Nowadays there are even bots that market buy Doge whenever Elon tweets something about it. These pumps are short lived and can cause a big spike in liquidations for unprepared investors. Elon Musk also appears to have distanced himself from Dogecoin in recent times. He did not include Dogecoin as a payment option for Twitter, and he also [tweeted](https://twitter.com/elonmusk/status/1631720134636367872?lang=en) that he is more interested in AI than crypto as of late. > > **>> Unlimited supply** > > Unlike Bitcoin, Dogecoin has no hard cap [no hard cap](https://www.sofi.com/learn/content/will-dogecoin-ever-be-capped/) on the total supply, which means it could potentially be inflated indefinitely. It's current supply increase is [\~4% per year](https://www.analyticsinsight.net/heres-what-you-need-to-know-about-dogecoin-inflation/#:~:text=For%20anyone%20buying%20Dogecoin%20to,4%25%20in%20price%20each%20year). > > \>> **Lack of Development and future narratives** > > Dogecoin has a relatively small development team, and the project has not seen significant updates or improvements in recent years. Additionally very few people run full nodes. Finally there is no clear long-term narrative that could cause its wide adoption > > \>> **Security** > > Dogecoin's mining algorithm is less secure than others, making it more susceptible to 51% attacks. Doge uses a different mining algorithm than Bitcoin, called [Scrypt](https://learn.bybit.com/altcoins/how-to-mine-dogecoin/), which is generally considered less secure than Bitcoin's SHA-256 algorithm. [Scrypt was designed to be more memory-intensive](https://cryptobook.nakov.com/mac-and-key-derivation/scrypt), making it harder for ASIC miners to dominate the network and creating a more level playing field for CPU and GPU miners. However, this also makes it easier for attackers to launch 51% attacks. > > On top of that Doge has a much smaller mining community and less overall network hash rate than Bitcoin. This means that it could be more vulnerable to attacks from miners who control a large portion of the network's hashrate. > > And finally Doge's unlimited supply means that there is less of an incentive for miners to secure the network. ***** Would you like to learn more? Check out the [Cointest archive](/r/CointestOfficial/wiki/cointest_archive#wiki_Dogecoin) to find submissions for other topics.

kaiserwilhelmthe4th

I am using Monero Ocean Pool currently, which a pooled cooperative of sorts. They have the ability to change what is being mined based on current crypto mining prices. When something becomes more profitable, they switch the pool members mining efforts. I get paid directly to my Monero wallet every day or two. I promise you won'ts get rich quick, but it is fun and you do end up with profit and you get paid directly in Monero. So, in a nutshell you download Mornero Wallet, which then downloads the entire blockchain to your hard drive (Large amount of data). Over 120GB. So, you are esentially synching, validating and running hashes againsta a local host of the block chain. Once you create a new wallet (DO NOT LOSE the Wallet name, passwords, etc. Write it all down. From there you download he correct version of XMRig software. You will insert your Monero wallet public Key into the XMRig .CFG file. That's how you get paid. When you initially run XMRig, it will stress test your machine and optimize it for best efficiency based on your hardware speed. If everything is configured correctly, you will start to automatically receive jobs from the pool, which your CPU will process and complete each job. You can choose to get paid for lower minimums than default if you like, which I opted in to. Depending on your hash rate, you will get paid every couple of days or more whenever you hit the payout minimum. The pool will send XMR to your wallet. I am running a raw hash rate of about 2k/sec, which isn't bad, but it's not 27k h/s, which the AMD EPYC 7742 64-Core Processor can achieve. To put it in prospective, the 7742 tricked out can generates up to $27/month. However, the average hash rate for the general public is about 500h/s. I am running actually a Intel (AMD is better) 8550 at 2000h/s. I'm using 6 of 12 threads and 8GB out of 40 GB in DDR4 ram. This computer is still quite usable, but I do stop mining if I am trading JIC. Go here to get started: https://moneroocean.stream/ Click on Help for the instructions. I'm no expert, but I will try to answer any questions that I can for you. It seems complicated, but in hindsite, it's not that bad. Get wallet, download XMRig, put your Wallet Public key in the config files, where it tells you to, and Run XMRig as adminitrator and everyting else including getting paid happens automatically.

WesbroBaptstBarNGril

I mined with my CPU and found a few blocks solo. My friend from high school helped me set it up and we both ran our PCs in our respective dorm rooms. Got tired of the sound of my power supply humming at all hours and quit, he didn't. I remember reformatting that hard drive and not thinking twice about it. He retired at 32.

kaiserwilhelmthe4th

I'm mining Monero actually. Just started doing it a few weeks ago. CPU mining. Not extremely lucrative but my electric is free so why not.

Consistent-Set-913

“I wrote a Python script to iterate through the BIP39 wordlist with 2048 words, one missing seed word and one known BTC address created early in the wallet’s lifetime. It took me approx. 7 hours and 30 minutes to try every possible iteration (2048 words) and generate a BTC address that matched what I gave the program. I ran the script offline (no internet access) with 6GB RAM laptop and 8-core CPU. I must note that I couldn’t use my laptop for other tasks and the 7hrs 30mins landmark doesn’t include the frequent times the laptop crashed but at the end, it was really worth it” Found this post. What’s going on here???

object37

Again, I'm not interested in actually mining, I'm not asking for advice on what to do... I asked why can't I solo mine? What stops me from throwing a load of money at something that I'm never going to get back? Why can't I put myself into electrical bill debt waiting 10 years for my laptop to CPU mine a single block, solo? What stops me from doing that? Besides having more than one brain cell, anyway. Surely solo mining software exists, or to get back to my original question you ignored, is there a dedicated software requirement to assemble my own blocks and manually type in a guessed hash at random in my own time whenever I want? Or is the block assembling also carried out by the mining software?

WoodenInformation730

You won't get rich from doing that but you should look into CPU mining. You can use MoneroOcean, it applies a profit switch, mining the highest paying CPU coins and paying the rewards in Monero.

Individual2020

I think what you’re trying to get at is can you solo mine? The answer is no. You have to interact with a mining pool. In theory, if such software exists, you could guess a string of zeros and ones and send it to the pool. Better to have your CPU, GPU, or ASIC guess the numbers and send those guesses to the pool. Those guesses represent the “hash” you are providing to the pool. In turn, you get your “cut” based on the amount of rash you provide, once the right number is found in the pool. But the pool assembles the blocks. The mining pool runs a block template in real-time adding and kicking out pending transactions to maximize the total amount of fees for that block, since they get the fees as well as the block reward.

Revolutionary-Ebb-26

If there's one thing Bitcoin is, it's money and I will concede to the bright eyed early Bitcoiners looking for things to buy with Bitcoin after reading "electronic cash" in the white paper, of which I was one, that it can be used as such and it was and it is. I was trying to ignore the quibbling over semantics and give OP the benefit of the doubt since it was clear what he meant wasn't really currency but more vaguely "the currency everybody uses everywhere including at the grocery store" . Bitcoin can be attempted to use a currency in the same way that cigarettes are by prisoners, salt by ancient Roman soldiers, beads, feathers, copper, silver, gold, etc. OP is arguing that cryptocurrencies will never be currency and then goes on to string together all the reasons it's not widely used as one today and why it won't likely be used as one lateer and even though he is wrong technically at the core of his argument is an intuition about something important about the future of Bitcoin and I tried to focus on that. Unfortunately, he revealed himself to be not an actual seeker of truth but just another idiot who hasn't done the homework. Yes you can use Bitcoin layer 1 as currency, even today, and even after widespread adoption as it becomes the ultimate global settlement layer that I surmise it will. It can but that will be a niche use, a rarity. The sidebar will stand, as it does even today, a nostalgic glimpse of the early days when we so badly wanted to believe in the peer to peer currency of the internet, obtainable by any regular person with a CPU, that pizzas were purchased, all manner of fun and frivolous things!

eggZeppelin

Multi-threading is another term for parallel processing. Sealevel on Solana that allows multiple transactions to be executed concurrently is amazing and there are similar technologies in development such as Monad. It turns out network and disc I/O are actually bigger bottlenecks currently then CPU utilization so that is being optimized as well.

Excellent_Panic_Two

Thinking it was dumb and running Folding@Home instead of switching to some internet money miner thing that was doing the rounds on tech forums. I'd have lost those coins for certain, but I was aware of Bitcoin early enough to CPU mine. I still think it's dumb fwiw, but it's a legit speculation vehicle these days I guess

GaRGa77

You can mine on CPU’s and GPU’s but not bitcoin directly but you can mine shitcoins and get paid in BTC

Miserable_Twist1

The difficulty for the block adjusts down every two weeks until the miners come back. Every time it adjusts down it will require less electricity to mine a single block, in theory, it could keep dropping so low that it becomes profitable to mine on a CPU. That would never happen, but that is how the system is designed. If after two weeks the blocks are being mined too slowly (because some miners have left), then the difficulty drops and it becomes cheaper for everyone to mine. It will keep doing this every two weeks until the blocks are being mined on schedule. The reverse is also true, if blocks are being mined too fast because there are too many miners, the difficulty increases after 2 weeks.

BitingChaos

I started mining when BTC flowed like water from a CPU running some code. After losing so much to MtGox, Celsius, BlockFi, and Hodlnaut and all the money spent with Koinly and dealing with reporting income on the shittiest staking rewards to the IRS in hundreds of pages of tax forms (lol), I'm not sure I want to deal with it any more. I'm selling now. I have been showing my wife pictures of retirement homes. Since my cost basis is close to $0, according to the IRS, I'm gonna have a **huge** tax bill next year.

Equal_Classroom_4707

His original idea did not evolve around that: "In this paper, we propose a solution to the double-spending problem using a peer-to-peer distributed timestamp server to generate computational proof of the chronological order of transactions." "We started with the usual framework of coins made from digital signatures, which provides strong control of ownership, but is incomplete without a way to prevent double-spending. To solve this, we proposed a peer-to-peer network using proof-of-work to record a public history of transactions that quickly becomes computationally impractical for an attacker to change if honest nodes control a majority of CPU power." Satoshi sought to create a system that proved money can exist in A, be moved to C, while erasing B from the alphabet entirely. How do you prove a coin exists in A before it gets to C? In order for a coin to be created it needs to be mined, so it goes into a wallet. It may never leave that wallet, and for that user that's a damn important fact you need to uphold. Therefore, the underlying blockchain is the most critical aspect of Bitcoin, with peer to peer being a necessary step to move it along.  Satoshi (is/was) not stupid. Read their forum posts, they were incredibly forward thinking. They asked for CPU's to be used instead of GPU's to give everyone a fighting chance at mining, but the system accelerated too damn fast, it was inevitable. But they never believed this would replace payment processors. A way to exchange? Surely, it's a given from peer to peer. Reread the genesis block; Satoshi wanted a storage for value to replace the banking system. 

Quik-Sand

Just go download and install brainflayer.. compile it and run it.. I can't remember the exact process, but it will scan millions of keys per second. You can set this up to run across multiple cores using your CPU processor.. it's lighting fast.. it 100% works if you configure it properly.. I've tested it in the past using real wallets and their keys.. as an experiment I've configured it to scan hashed keys and run in the background, scanning trillions of wallets with 0 luck .. I'm not going to explain how it scans millions per second, all files are in the GitHub.. you will need to find an additional source to break the algorithm down from ripemd160 to sha256.. https://github.com/ryancdotorg/brainflayer

Quixote0630

Well, it does. You could rent CPU power from Akash right now if you wanted, for example.

Amber_Sam

>The need for specialized ASIC chips to even start mining, You can start mining Bitcoin with your own CPU or GPU, no ASIC is necessary. >the fees There's r/TheLightningNetwork to deal with the fees. >transaction limit per block No such thing. There's a space limit per block.

Revolutionary-Ebb-26

It's hard to say. The vast majority of Bitcoin users do not run a node. And as the years have rolled by the network that still runs nodes have become more knowledgable about Bitcoin. Not saying they've turned into coders just that they understand the nature of Bitcoin and their economic incentives as actors in the network. Now you as an actor in the network have learned the dangers of that and may be more cautious. Ive heard knowledgeable people on podcasts who happen to run full nodes say things like "I'm still running <some slightly older version>! Im good with Bitcoin like that I won't update unless I have some compelling reason" and "nodes will be able to 'vote' <by running a non updated version>'. You don't need to verify the software by looking at the code. (And probably when people say verify the software they mean to check it's hash and the code maintainers signature to ensure no hacker has messed with the file). if you feel confident that v26 is the Bitcoin you think it is (I can vouch for it personally), then let that be your reference point. The protocol you trust your monetary wealth on is v26 and below. That's your vote. Bitcoin is a different kind of software than you've come across before and you have to treat it a bit differently than a web server. It looks like software and it functions as software but a major aspect of Bitcoin is it's almost invisible, game-theoretic interplay with the human economy. As Satoshi said, "one CPU is one vote". So careful with your vote!

Savingsmaster

A few other things to point out: * Banano is a memeified fork (code fork, not a chain fork) of Nano, meaning it has most of Nano's benefits * Nearly instantaneous * Zero fees * Negligible energy usage * Massively scalable * No built-in mechanism for the rich to get richer (mining and staking profits) * The Kalium mobile wallet is one of the very best wallets in all of crypto, and makes for an outstanding P2P payment experience * I could see Banano becoming a very popular P2P payment platform while Nano fulfills the more "serious" B2C and B2B payment types of operations * Despite the usage of the term, there's no **actual** "mining" Banano. It has a fixed supply (like Nano), meaning all the BAN that will ever exist was created when it launched. Rather than actual mining, you're essentially being paid in BAN for contributing your compute (GPU/CPU) power to medical research (protein folding) via the Folding@Home app. The rewards for this are paid from funds in a specific address which were dedicated for this purpose from Banano's inception.

OfWhomIAmChief

I felt the same way when I first learned of tail emission. It took awhile to understand why it had to be a necessary evil. The reason for tail emission is twofold. Monero has a lower barrier to entry for anyone to mine, all that is needed is a CPU, Bitcoin on the other hand started out as, one CPU one vote, as Satoshi intended in the whitepaper. Asics then came on to the market and CPU mining was made obselete. Hence a mining centralization of power arose where only the wealthy can afford to mine Bitcoin today, due to large datacenters being erected all over the world dedicated to Bitcoin mining. Moneros' hashing algorithm, RandomX, was designed to be an asic breaker, to keep the barrier to entry low for the common man to mine, limiting mining centralization of power.l by the wealthy. Tail emission ties into the lower barrier of entry to mining by incentivizing miners to secure the network without needing to be compensated by expensive transaction fees. Everyone knows that once the Bitcoin block reward drops lower and lower transaction fees will have to rise to subsidize the miners to continue securing the network/validating transactions. The trade off is a perpetual inflation asymptotically approaching 0%. This means as of today Moneros' inflation rate is ~.8%/year. Every year the inflation percentage drops lower and lower as supply increases infinitely approaching 0% inflation. It is only an infinite supply over infinite time, something that is hard for cryptonoobs to comprehend. So tail emission was implemented to keep transaction fees less than a penny and pereptually incentivize miners to secure the network thereby never having to increase transaction fees as a result while allowing any average Joe to turn on their CPU at home and be able to mine without having to be a wealthy person erecting mining farms to compete.

coinjaf

I don't see OP asking about CPU or GPU mining. \> with a puny single PC. You're making it sound like the big boys are using lots of PC's. Which is bull crap all the same. \> No. These days, mining BTC is pretty much only a game for mining corporations with access to huge resources and lots of electricity. Mining with 1000 ASICs gives you 1000x the BTC reward as mining with 1 ASIC. whooptidoo. That doesn't make it only a game for large miners.

john-larry

Monero keeps me interested. It is the only crypto that still upholds the original vision of p2p electronic cash. You can spend it with complete privacy for not even a cent, not having to worry about tainted coins and chain analysis risk-scores. Everyone can mine it on their PC no need for an expensive ASIC; 1 CPU 1 Vote. The darknet has already ditched bitcoin in favor of monero. It is a tool that helps to fight back against government oppression, not just to make gains. I am here for the revolution.

M-log1_053

You'll be able to mine Soloneum initially via CPU and later GPU once mainnet is launched. Our timelines looks like following: Q1/Q2 - presales A and presales B Q2 - Testnet Q3 - Mainnet Q3/4 - Port and migrate partners and projects, launch products and services. Stick around in our chats or check around here / twitter for official announcements once we are there.

JoeYo743

We did get an 85% We did receive the digital contents successfully. Peer2peer proof of work. We did generate each a wallet and then collectively sent to one of the group members to place the order. We all read the same article about CPU mining, and laughed about how ridiculous it sounds... The prof didnt care about it and commented how it sounded like BitTorrent but with a coin system and thats all... 2012- early 2013 is when we started actually hearing about it and even then it was not trusted at all it was feeling gambly and shady much.

I_AM_A_SMURF

Hindsight is 20/20. Nobody could predict what happened. I discovered bitcoin when it was worth cents. You could mine it with a CPU back then. Still didn’t buy (was very hard) or keep any of the ones I mined. They are worth millions now, I could be retired on a beach 🤷‍♀️ or I could’ve sold as soon as I needed some money who knows, it’s not that straightforward.

Mitani-1524

Ah yeah, I remember doing some CPU mining back then as well 😆 I was still in school back then and my mom didn't like it when I left my PC running to mine Bitcoin 💀

RespectibleCabbage

Nobody bought in 2009, we were mining on our teeny weeny CPU’s

Sure_Contribution962

You really don't need to destroy internet to monitor and control it... USA manufactures every CPU at this moment through AMD, Intel, and Taiwan/Japan manufacturers. If they want to add backdoors in the CPUs they just need to give the instructions to those factories. There might even already be some, some parts of the CPU are still undocumented. Also do you think they don't already check the content of the packages going in and out of your computer? The NSA have access to domestic but also international communications for a while now. Why do you think USA begged everyone to not purchase 5G from China... The list goes on. Bitcoin is no threat for governments. When you die your kids will inherit it, be taxed and spend it on hookers, lose the keys, divorce 3 times, die without descendant or be sterile, have a rare disease, be scammed, etc. It ultimately goes back to the government or people with an established business. Once you or your kids run out of Bitcoin you'll go back to work.

alineali

And real effect has nothing to do with CPU power or majority of nodes - only with majority of transactions initiated through these nodes - and not just any transactions, but those that have real economic effect (basically, are related to buying/selling something). Because the basic mechanism which kills fork is simple - people with money avoid it - price drops - more people avoid it - and we have positive feedback loop.