Bitcoin is my all-time HODL. I first dabbled in it in 2012. Got a Blockchain wallet, did some third-party mining. I even remember being able to watch an ad and earn like five cents of bitcoin. I bought 7 Bitcoin for $500, sent to Mt. Gox and was thinking of withdrawing it 2014 because my initial investment was now over $3000. Alas, Mt. Gox went down a week before I knew about it..and so did my investment :( Meanwhile I still had a small Blockchain Bitcoin balance and in 2017 actually bought carpets and a watch on Overstock using my Blockchain address just to prove there was utility to crypto. Worked beautifully. Even returned one carpet and was refunded the exact same 0.00362142 BTC to my wallet as I originally sent (interestingly via Coinbase). And, because the USD value of Bitcoin rose when I got my refund, I made USD! (Kinda highlights one of the conundrums of using coins for transactions as the value fluctuates.) Fast forward, after a decade still holding small chunks of Bitcoin in original wallet, DCA in others and riding the dips and highs I still think Bitcoin is just now coming of age and has the impetus to grow more in the next decade. Ditto for POS blockchains, even real NFT utility.
Probably you didn’t knew this, but the fees paid to stakers are 10 times lower in comparison to what we are paying to miners. Staking is way cheaper from a network security standpoint, paying miners is just wasting ETH for the entire network, when a more efficient economical solution like POS is available.
I already accept BCH. have done for years now. Find it odd the comment above this is getting downvoted, do these people just expect merchant to add coins that will rarely get used? Was it what I said about POS? I often find people who have no experience actually accepting crypto have a lot of bold ideas about what coins should be added, but can never answer my legitimate concerns.
I've been warning people for quite some time that BTC is not a good investment. I've also been warning that Proof of Work will be hated and demonized in the future. Bitcoin is one thing only, and that's a means of transaction. ETH, ADA, etc., are likewise means of transaction, but are also much more, and are therefore more worthy investments. They are also POS, instead of POW.
The problem with merchants adding not so well know coins is very few people pay with them. I've never really heard about XLM, if it is a POS coin I'm not interested as it will be hard work to implement and POS coins are not something I actually class as crypto, if it is a POW coin, I could possibly be convinced. Exactly how stable is it, was it not effected by the recent crypto crash?
BTC is passive, meaning the value accrued comes from the supply being reduced (by half) each four years. Simply holding for one halving means your coin is more scarce than any new btc. That's what it does. If you want to 'use' your BTC for investing sell some to buy an ASIC to mine more with - and use those profits on more miners ad infinitum. That way you aren't losing from inflation since you're at the tap. (It's the same as staking) You can bridge it to Ethereum and get wBTC (something criminal like 20% of all BTC is wBTC) so you can use it in DeFi or staking, but bridges are a massive centralization risk until better technology comes out, and no one wants to borrow wbtc (so the rates are low). It would be so much better to use ETH in that case IMO but the choice is there if you want to use btc for collateral or something. ETH is doing a triple halving (90% supply cut) for its merge to POS, in the middle of BTC halving cycles. It will actually do a 100% supply cut until validators are allowed to (gradually) unstake 6+ months later. If BTC's biggest utility to me is its supply shock, the merge is like 12 years of BTC utility wrapped into one event, plus I can still earn interest on my coins *on top*. I'm biased as fuck toward Ethereum though, hodling doesn't appeal to me, at least hodl a coin that people *use* so demand is always there. BTC is good for passive long term wealth accumulation instead of active wealth accumulation like you see in DeFi. It's not a bad thing but it's different from what crypto has morphed into these last couple years. To steel man BTC most DeFi or staking schemes are ponzi's anyway, even if not most can't be trusted. It does make sense to be against it so much. Just imo bad ideas or projects are a necessary evil for proper innovation so I don't think using a conservative philosophy on a tech startup is sustainable. Like you said yourself you'd be better off ignoring the other 27,000 coins and sticking to a couple, at least until the space matures a bit and there are more than just a couple. BTC does what it does already without any of the luxe the other 27000 coins offer and it's probably more sustainable (at least right now) than any of them. Nothing wrong with hodling and just letting time go by, that's time the supply continues to halve and demand continues to increase.
It was a mosaic, that took time and then finally all clicked when I truly grasped the concept of POW vs. POS. Once I could see that all other coins are subject to a single leader or board, etc, and understood that bitcoin is a truly decentralized international computing network, it was game over. Love being a part of this movement. We are all going to be on the right side of history.
>No. Do Kwon tweeted the exact opposite. Cex luna holders WILL receive air drops!! Changed his mind again..... Just like how 1 LUNA = 1 LUNA But now the criminal POS retroactively changes things after selling 6.8 TRILLION LUNA out into the open market and is saying that 725M LUNA are worth more then the newly minted 6.8T..... Straight up FRAUD! You can't make representations about a product your selling, then once sold make a retroactive decision that 725,000,000 of them have more value then 6,800,000,000,000 of them because it's more convenient for you.... that is theft by deception and fraud! Can't trust a single thing Do Kwon says, flip flops however is convenient to him!
Isn't it great when the founder of a "decentralized" currency holds a massive bag? What? You people worship him for it? He is a "good guy" ~~billionaire~~ millionaire. ETH needs to go POS already so we can stop pretending it is decentralized.
One of the most important mechanics of POW is how the total difficulty of the genuine blockchain allows new nodes, who have no transaction history, to distinguish it from counterfeit blockchains. How do new nodes make that distinction with POS?
I agree we are in an energy crisis. Our fault mostly for reliance on fossil fuels. We needed more investment in nuclear and renewables, a long time ago. Eventually those will be our only power sources. That's the ideal world. Otherwise bitcoin is just as polluting as an electric car, which uses the same energy. As is any data center, because that's what a mining facility is. The future is with energy abundance, not scarcity. We aren't going to devolve into a dystopian world where nobody uses energy because of its scarcity and it's effect on the environment. We are going to evolve into a world where energy is abundant and clean. Bitcoin can actually provide financial insentive for both renewable and nuclear sources of power. Calling bitcoin polluting is like calling any use of power polluting. Should we stop using power altogether because it's polluting, No. Should we devolve into a world of rolling Black outs, No. I can transact on the lightning network for less power usage than any POS blockchain with faster transaction time.
Yeah that's interesting thanks. It says >Nakamoto Consensus creates a random delay so that any one node can effectively only say one thing at a time. Nodes are effectively prevented from saying multiple things. This delay is created by the well known Proof of Work. But I think Cardano/Ourobouros is POS? So I guess they must get round this some other way.
#Dogecoin Pro-Arguments Below is an argument written by roberthonker which won 2nd place in the Dogecoin Pro-Arguments topic for a prior [Cointest](/r/CointestOfficial/wiki/cointest_policy) round. > (initially put forward by u\/Adventurous_Piglet85) > > (Put forward by u\/meteor-vs-lizardking last round) > > Dogecoin’s success is explained through pure economic and mathematical fundamentals. > > The important thing to note is these fundamentals apply regardless of the name, regardless of it being a meme, regardless of why it was created, and regardless of which billionaires support it > > I am going to cover two topics today > > A) What makes a currency successful > > B) What makes a Cryptocurrency successful > > What makes a currency successful? > > 1. a large supply relative to the user base > 2. An inflationary tendency that allows for lost or destroyed currency. note - inflation and hyperinflation are completely different. Regular inflation - between 1-10% is healthy - whereas anything over 20% is considered detrimental) > 3. cheap, available and easily transactable (the economic term for this is liquidity) > 4. Popular enough. What I mean by this is either enough businesses actually transacting the currency or a user base that barters with each other. > > What makes a cryptocurrency successful? > > 5. dedicated user base either mining or staking the cryptocurrency. This allows the the blocks on the blockchain to be solved - and therefore maintain the transactions. > > 6. an active development team - what this means is that while it doesn’t necessarily have to be the BEST technology or development - it does need to have at least some development to maintain the Cryptocurrencies longevity > > Now - there are definitely other defining factors that contribute to a cryptocurrencies success. However, these are the primary fundamental criteria for a cryptocurrency or currency to be successful. > > If any of these 6 criteria are not met - the cryptocurrency/currency will fail OR not be nearly as successful as it could be. If it meets these criteria- then it is successful. Regardless of it’s price per coin. Anything else after this is just bells and whistles. This is the bare minimum requirements. > > Well how does Dogecoin cryptocurrency hold up? > > 1. Does Dogecoin. have a high supply relative to the user base? Yes. It has a 128 billion dollar supply. This allows the people owning this crypto to own large amounts. The high supply helps maintain liquidity and promote spending rather than hoarding. > 2. Does Dogecoin have an inflationary tendency? Yes, it has a fixed rate of 10,000 new coins added per minute - which equates to roughly 4% inflation per year. (This falls within the range of healthy inflation) Since this rate is fixed, over time the inflation rate lowers. This inflation rate is negligible to affecting the price per coin > 3. Is Dogecoin cheap, available and easily transactable? Yes. It has a transaction(gas) fee of 1 coin per transaction. It cheap - and readily available > 4. Is Dogecoin popular/used by the majority of the user base? Yes. This it is currently in the top 99.99% of used cryptocurrency. Dogecoin is accepted by restaurants, car dealerships,sporting teams, as well as thousands of other small businesses. > 5. Does Dogecoin have a dedicated user base mining the cryptocurrency? Yes, even though it is merged mined with LTC - it has a dedicated group of people mining the coin. They have been maintaining the blockchain for over 8 years, and the block reward of 10,000 coins per block is a great incentive to continue mining in the future. > 6. Does Dogecoin have an active development team? Yes. Contrary to the misconceptions. Dose Dogecoin have an active development team. Are the top of the line developers like other cryptocurrency like ETH? Not necessarily, but it does indeed have a development team working behind the scenes to ensure its success. > > As you can see, based on the minimum requirements of what makes a cryptocurrency and currency successful- you can see without a doubt why this cryptocurrency has survived as long as it has. > > To further show more evidence here 10 additional points for why Dogecoin is successful > > 1. Dogecoin has an 8 year track record of success - even if the price hasn’t necessarily shown it until recently. Dogecoin has survived every major Cryptocurrency bear market and will survive the next. > 2. The myth behind Dogecoin having an unlimited supply is just that, a myth. Dogecoin is not unlimited it has 128 billion dollar supply and 4% Inflation rate > 3. All POW and POS cryptocurrency are also inflationary. Cryptocurrency is inherently inflationary and that is a good thing. Inflation is negligible when under 20% > 4. Dogecoin’s price is not dependent upon Elon musk or Mark Cuban. The price rise has been evident for approximately 8 months. Elon and Mark just sped up a process that was already happening > 5. Dogecoin still have plenty of room to gain price, but due to the relatively high supply don’t expect bitcoin levels per coin. Realistically Dogecoin can reach between the $1-$10 range. > 6. Dogecoin is accepted by more businesses than 99.9% of other cryptocurrency > 7. Dogecoin’s mining reward of 10k per block is a great reward for mining and helps to ensure that the cryptocurrency will continue to survive > 8. Dogecoin has cheap transaction fees and has a very good utility at Cryptocurrencies intended purpose of exchanging goods. > 9. The economic fundamentals behind Dogecoin are sound and great for its intended purpose of being a currency > 10. The meme aspect of Dogecoin has absolutely zero impact of the functionality of the cryptocurrency > > Almost every single argument against Dogecoin has one of the following flaws > > a) lack of understand of economics - misconceptions about the supply, mining rate, and inflation and how none of these are actual issues > > b) not understanding that the meme aspect has nothing to do with the fundamentals of the cryptocurrency > > c) lack of actual research - just repeating information they heard from someone else on the internet ***** Would you like to learn more? [Click here](/r/CryptoCurrency/comments/pz2r9u\/rcc_cointest_top_10_dogecoin_proarguments_october/) to be taken to the original topic-thread or you can scan through the [Cointest archive](/r/CointestOfficial/wiki/cointest_archive#wiki_Dogecoin) to find arguments on this topic in other rounds.
Check out Ergo on /r/ergonauts It's a biggest 'thing' is there's no pre-mined coins, and it's the PoW version of ADA's POS system. There's some neat white papers you can find about how the PoW and PoS systems of ERG and ADA can tie together for a security system called 'minotaur' IIRC. It's also at something like 1/8 of it's ATH.
Really, depends. There's no single best app that does everything I want anyway. I just sat down and went through the annoyance of signing up for a whole a bunch of them in one go. IMO, Binance is good for trading, and has relatively high APY for lots of coins, mostly for POS ones. But to earn good interest rates on BTC, ETH, and USDC, it's best to go with a lending platform like Celsius or Nexo. If you want some help finding good interest rates for your coins, [this crypto interest rate comparison table](https://extracrypto.cc/interest-rates/all-cryptocurrencies/) could be of help.
As a vendor, we don't use lightning network because you need to do 1 of the following 1) trust someone with your coins / payment processing 2) know how to build payment processing solution yourself. Most non-custodial BTC payment processing solutions monitor the Block explorer and update your POS system, without touching your coins. Since there is no block explorer for LN, you have to trust someone or be a developer yourself. If you know of a non-custodial lightning network solution for Woocommerce, I'm open to it though
Woosh you've missed my entire point. It doesn't make sense to compare BCH to VISA without comparing BCH to the blockchain VISA is using..... Of course VISA is permissioned. The tech VISA is using **isn't** permissioned, non custodial, or even centralized. If you want to compare BCH to *a business* of course one is custodial and the other isn't. You can't do the same things using both though so it's a dumb thing to compare. It's like saying my garage sale is going to overtake Amazon because I don't ask for a login, like what that's not what we're talking about. If you're purposing BCH can overtake VISA then at least compare the tech not *your* access to it. Comparing tech it's cheaper and faster to use Ethereum than BCH. If you want access to cheap payments *without a physical card* (ie no longer competing with VISA) you would use an L2 instead. **If BCH has physical cards and can compete with VISA in a noncustodial way I'd like to hear it. ** What do you have to 'give up' to use an L2? Let's pick a real one, Arbitirium as an example, because I agree with you LN is wack. Same trust and security assumptions only now my data is compressed, I've given *nothing* up to save 99% on fees. The L2 is paying the L1 for blockspace so as fees grow larger (necessary for a sustainable security budget without inflation) individual fees shrink smaller. POS doesn't *scale* Ethereum. It reduces the *energy consumption* required to maintain security and not a thing more. L2's scale Ethereum and run on POW currently. BCH takes 3000 or 9000 block confirmations to settle because of how unsecure it is. That's like a 1-2 month wait to move from a CEX to wallet.. It's not realistic to use in almost any circumstance *especially* for payments. I don't know why comparing it to VISA was even purposed - if you're going to do that at least be honest with a direct comparison.
POS is a scam always has been, I even think proof of history is better but still you need a real world variant. Proof of storage might not be bad but it would suck if storage prices skyrocketed. POW is just the best to me and provides the most economic value by subsidizing renewables and giving stranded energy a home. Gotta get rid of the dirty energy but that hopefully happens over time.
ETH2 merge will not scale Ethereum though. It will only get a couple TPS boost from POS. Additionally, staked ETH will remain locked. The risk is that what if we see a bull run this year and people are not able to sell because their ETH2 is locked. Also, what if there is no adoption of the chain other than stakers because of high transaction fees? I think that the internet computer integrating Ethereum this year solves a lot of these problems. You will still be able to use Ethereum DApps and trade, but with low fees.
>I don't think Do Kwon maliciously tried to rip people off, Challenging billionaire to attack his project..... While he has a fiduciary duty to his token holders..... Yeah, that's pretty fuckin malicious! He just didn't think anyone would actually do it! A CEO has responsibilities and liabilities when running a company.... That's what they will use to prosecute this POS is my bet.
Are you missing chromosomes? I said hes looked at like a POS by society for the simple fact that hes a man. If a woman did the same thing shed expect and would be granted forgiveness. Maybe that's enough internet for you today buddy.
Ergo has nice tokeneonomics. 97 million total supply. Fair distribution. No VC funds. Once ETH is officially POS, miners may switch focus will switch to ERG. Juno on the Cosmos too. Max Supply of 185 million. Got ETH vibes a little bit.
I hope that within 10 years: * Bitcoin has been integrated into POS of every retailer, * Private banks offer accounts for holding Bitcoin, so less tech-savvy users can protect themselves from inflation (including insurance against losses), * People can buy Bitcoin in 401k, RRSP, etc * Bitcoin has become a global currency, used by nations for settling debts, * USD lost standing as a reserve currency and is now only used within the United States.
Not just "small POS chains". This exposes a flaw in the entire concept of decentralization. In a world where money itself is so centralized, decentralization is the exact opposite of democracy. You only need the top 1-2% of people with you to successfully get over the 50% threshold, which even bitcoin is vulnerable to. Then you can do anything you want against the wish of the 95%. I mean it should be obvious to everyone. "Decentralization" is just a cute word meant to make "robbing people of their rights" sound like "distributing freedom".
This is just as true if not more so with Bitcoin. One of the big appeals of POS is that it makes ETH a good investment for everyone, mass appeal. Bitcoin mining will never decentralize, and will likely centralize more. Anyone can buy ETH and earn more ETH at pretty much the same rate as everyone else.
If leaders are less egoistic, we would have solved climate issues, oil reliance, viable clean energy would not be an alternative but the default, we would be having Earth Treaty Organisation and not NATO. Oh wait, we already have UN for that, but look how effective they are. Not surprised that crypto CEOs would not be any better but I understand your point and perhaps disappointment, and also agree that they would serve the community way better if they focused on delivering the goods than trying to win a shouting match. Like Eth migration to POS announcements is starting to become like climate disaster announcements by scientists, except that the climate disaster s unfolding right in front of our eyes.
That’s how POS is supposed to work, you vote with your capital. And a look at forum means nothing, I say that I’m against hard fork even though I don’t hold any luna. I can also say my opinions about what direction bitcoin should take even though I don’t mine any. The problem would be if the blockchain got forked against validator votes.
By the end of the year any place with NCR or blackhawk POS systems will have a bitcoin lightning integration. So anyone with a lightning wallet can spend their bitcoin easily. Some places are already live. Shopify also accepts lightning payments
Even with the chance to buy Luna before the next snapshot, I'm good. I'd rather not waste money on Luna, get the new coin, then sell my Luna for a loss or get stuck with a delisted POS. All to get stuck with the new coin which very well may end up worthless with lack of interest and trust
POS is not perfect (yet), but a few points of clarification: In the case of ETH you’ll need 67% rather than 51%. In its current form if we assume 100% staking participation the top ~2000 accounts would need to collude in order to stage an attack. This also comes at an extremely high risk of loss if the attack fails. In fairness, If we assume less than 100% participation (likely) then the total number of accounts required for collusion decreases. I am confident that economic incentives will be brought forth to further mitigate any risk of collusion.
I don’t disagree on BTC but I think you’re overstating the power of a few wealthy individuals on POS blockchains. Early on? You’re probably right. But eventually a few million people with small bags negates the the influence of a handful of whales. That effect will only become greater as the number of active addresses continues to increase.
If you want control over the coin then you should be staking in a POS coin. Likewise if you want control over a dAPP (like say Maker DAO) then you should hold governance tokens (MKR). If you don't then you are saying "I am cool with what other people decide".
Bitcoin is a great hedge against inflation because demand is growing, fiat keeps printing, yet there are fewer BTC put into existence each year as it trends toward 0. If you buy 1BTC now for $30K and held for ten years - 1BTC be a lot more scarce and $30k will be worth a lot less. The same way the stock market or any asset can be a hedge against inflation. It usually counts on you selling *as* inflation happens not during the fallout after - crypto preformed *extremely* well in the last two years during the run up of the (lagging) CPI. Ethereum is a hedge against inflation because people spend $20-80 million for its blockspace each DAY. It mints $30M in new coins which get sold each day to people who want blockspace. Next year it will mint $3M new coins each day forever after, and I'm taking the bet people will pay even more for blockspace in the future (by L2 compression protocols that batch 1000s into 1). Blockspace is finate and demand is **strong**, it's been a good bet to make so far. [Here's a great site](https://ethereum.org/en/energy-consumption/) to compare POW and POS Ethereum. Something like a 2000x energy reduction sometime this year. Bitcoin mining is done on specialized hardware so the economics of that are a lot different than GPU mining, and very strongly incentivize the *new development* of clean power. IMO large corporations having access to ~$0 energy while selling it for a cost isn't sustainable for true decentralization but whatever, it keeps coal mines from being profitable too if the hashrate can be inexpensively high. The argument against it usually is that it allows existing mines to stay open longer by recycling their otherwise wasted energy into BTC which means they may not go bankrupt. That's still a step in the right direction compared to flaring it all into the sky though, and that BTC can be sent somewhere that has no power *to create power* (like oil is used). Every 4 years the amount of new BTC minted per block is reduced by half, and the hashrate (security/difficulty to mine) is dependant on how many miners are trying to get the one block reward. That means if your costs 20K to mine a BTC that's worth 30K today, the next halving your costs will be 20K to receive 15K of BTC, and you would be forced to stop mining or find a cheaper alternative. If the price of BTC doubles than you are safe but (despite what btc maxis think) it can't double forever. **It's a non-issue because it will solve itself.** Ideally the costs from people buying blockspace (crypto fees) will be drastic enough to make up for today's prehalving inflation rate, which means a ton of POW being done to earn fees - but if today miners are already making the pivot to clean energy (and not by choice) I can't imagine in ~20 years it being any easier to use coal or otherwise. The energy argument is a global one, picking just crypto is disingenuous because most people are completely ignorant about crypto so this is what they're taught. BTC is a legitimate currency in multiple Countries, crypto is used all over the world in places that don't have banks or face **real** inflation (Argentina), I spend it on cards in shops with and online too, VISA is using it because it's cheaper/faster than their existing rails, so is Stripe for the same reason. Volitility means you buy at the price you deserve not the price told to you, if housing bounced up and down every 4y and you weren't forced into a $1M two bedroom home maybe you'd be okay with it? There are real problems with crypto but none of the things you mentioned.
Because every shop already has an existing POS. Building on top of that infrastructure is a quick win, instead of reinventing the wheel and needing to teach all retailers and staff how to use crypto wallets. I see the existing infrastructure, like MasterCard and private banks, will continue to exist, but they will eventually offer accounts where less tech savvy people can store Bitcoin.
Exactly, he did say that. Cost of almost all commodities tend to gravitate to around the production costs. Same for gold, copper, etc. It gives a reliable fair value or bottom for the price. Also why POW is much better than POS for the purpose of hard money, which most people don't get.
Proof of Stake is (in theory) both much more secure and way more sustainable. Right now in order to mine bitcoin you basically have to live on a volcano and have a million dollars worth of equipment (slight exaggeration ;) ) This is leading to greater and greater centralization and vulnerability to being shut down for a variety of reasons. With POS Ethereum will be able to be validated and mined on a laptop, from anywhere. The cost of securing the network (issuance) drops dramatically in POS and there is no constant sell pressure from miners who have to pay for external resources to keep afloat; value accrues to the network and prices are stabilized. This is not even touching on the fact that POS isn't burning as much electricity as a small country to accomplish consensus. POW was a brilliant idea that had its place, but it doesn't scale well and given our current dependency on fossil fuels it is going to be become more and more distasteful. People will eventually vote with their hodlings. I hope bitcoin makes changes and survives these transitions.
Largely the same. There is a block reward per block. Paying that to POS vaidators vs miners just changes who gets it. I would add that right now BOTH validators and miners are paid so once the merge goes down the rate of minting will go down as well. Lastly ETH burns most of the transaction fees. In theory this can be close to or even exceed the block rewards making the money supply shrink. In reality it is likely to be less and thus the money supply grows but at very low rate of inflation <0.5%.
Nope. Only the record of the transfer of the NFT is in the chain. The NFT is in your wallet, and the file that the NFT tracks is elsewhere .. The NFT, like all money, is just a way to track value. If you use a dollar to go buy a candy bar, the change you get goes in your pocket. The transaction is recorded in the stores POS system and also in your receipt and the candy bar goes in your belly. The NFT is just the currency used to transact the single item. I don't think you understand this fancy Internet money yet.